Mystery tender

[phil_sutters]

A negative in Dad's files shows what seems to be an early tender, however I am suspicious of its chassis and wonder if it is from a film - e.g.Titfield Thunderbolt - although I don't think it is. Any thoughts. As a loose negative, it has no accompanying information about the location either.

[Bon Accord]

Looks to me like a film prop - the tender side sheets appear to be a mixture of canvas and wood.

[844fan]

A negative in Dad's files shows what seems to be an early tender, however I am suspicious of its chassis and wonder if it is from a film - e.g.Titfield Thunderbolt - although I don't think it is. Any thoughts. As a loose negative, it has no accompanying information about the location either.

Early tender 1960.jpg

Oddly gives off a American tender feel based off the looks of it. But I have to say it looks like it may a prop it just doesn't look like any I've ever seen of that age.

Edited January 17, 2017 by 844fan

[Steamport Southport]

I've seen a photograph of that before somewhere.

 

I think it's the tender from the replica of Northumbrian. They built a replica of it for the 100th anniversary of the Liverpool & Manchester Railway. With the gas works behind I'm thinking of Derby again. Don't know what happened to it though.

 

 

 

Almost the same as the one behind Planet.

 

Scroll down here. https://janfordsworld.blogspot.co.uk/2015_11_10_archive.html

 

 

 

Jason

[DavidB-AU]

It matches the tender off North Star.

 

 

Possibly from the 1923 replica?

 

Cheers

David

[Steamport Southport]

Could be. I've always assumed that it never had a tender, Even in the photos of the time it's tenderless.

 

Then I found this. http://www.swindonviewpoint.com/content/gwr-locomotive-bond-drives-north-star-film

 

 

Doesn't look like it's Broad Gauge in the OP photo though. And if it is Broad Gauge then where was there a stretch of BG track in the 1960s? Swindon presumably.

 

 

Jason

[DavidB-AU]

According to Transport History (Graphmitre, 1978) p102, "Its tender in the G.W.R. centenary film of 1935 was a standard gauge plywood mock-up which still survived derelict at Swindon in 1964".

 

Cheers

David

[DavidB-AU]

Here's part of the GWR centenary film. You can see the tender from about 1:30.

 

http://www.swindonviewpoint.com/video/cameo-how-swindon-started

 

Cheers

David

Edited January 17, 2017 by DavidB-AU

[844fan]

It matches the tender off North Star.

 

NS.jpg

 

Possibly from the 1923 replica?

 

Cheers

David

Wow I guess the US tender evolved from this style of tender. I mean the shape of many engines you'd see in the US in the late  1800s had a very similar shape above the foot plate just much bigger. Oddly the engines we used for branch work  at that time were not terribly much bigger than engine of the early grouping era in the UK.

 

Sierra No. 3 with some minor rebuilding (Her second dome needs to be shortened) could easily be within Loading gauge. At least maybe as her body is not much bigger than a Black 5. So it seems our branchlines were more akin to UK mainlines and we really didn go nuts on size till after 1900. A interesting thought if you ask me.

[phil_sutters]

I've seen a photograph of that before somewhere.

 

I think it's the tender from the replica of Northumbrian. They built a replica of it for the 100th anniversary of the Liverpool & Manchester Railway. With the gas works behind I'm thinking of Derby again. Don't know what happened to it though.

 

 

 

Almost the same as the one behind Planet.

 

Scroll down here. https://janfordsworld.blogspot.co.uk/2015_11_10_archive.html

 

 

 

Jason

It is very like Planet's one, but this one must pre-date 1992, as that was the year Dad became more or less house-bound and this tender looks as though it has been left outside for quite a time. Although Dad did have prints from other photographers, I haven't found any negatives that aren't his. It looks as though this style of tender was the default for any early loco reincarnation, judging by those illustrated above. 

Thanks for all the suggestions. Dad didn't leave much undocumented so it is a curiosity.

[phil_sutters]

Here's part of the GWR centenary film. You can see the tender from about 1:30.

 

http://www.swindonviewpoint.com/video/cameo-how-swindon-started

 

Cheers

David

Thanks David. Given Dad's love of the GWR and his visits to the works over several decades, I do think that this is the most likely identification. While I haven't spotted the gas works in any photos of the works, I am sure it would have had one*. There is a black dot at the end of a siding right at the north west corner of the works on the OS map for 1921 (I think). Maybe that was the gas holder.

*Even Highbridge Works had its own gas works.

Edited January 17, 2017 by phil_sutters

[ejstubbs]

There is a black dot at the end of a siding right at the north west corner of the works on the OS map for 1921 (I think). Maybe that was the gas holder.

 

old-maps.co.uk has an OS 1:10,560 plan of Swindon from 1960-61 which would appear to be around when your Dad's photo was taken.  There are a number of large, round objects* shown in the north-west corner of the works.

 

The tender certainly looks as if it is 'surviving derelict' in the photo.  You can see that the bent wood - so probably plywood - is splintered quite badly on the curved face of the front right hand corner of the tender.

 

* As the old joke goes: "Who is Round, and why does he object?"

[Shed82CB]

1. it was the 1:1 model of northumbrian's tender, later becoming the replica north stars one before slowly rotting away, seen here in another view. if anyone can credit the author of this photo please let me know

[RodneyS]

In December 1963 I went on my first railtour, Paddington to Swindon behind a Clan.

We walked up past the scrap sidings to what I was told was called the stock shed.

Inside we glimpsed a GWR railcar and outside was a timber tender.  I wish I had taken a picture but I only had my Brownie 127 and film was expensive.

This looks exactly as I remember.  If so then this must be Swindon.

The 'lattice work' on the underframe is  quite distinctive.  I recall the body was offset to one side and this can be seen in the photos.

I was later told it was for the replica North Star.  If the loco was broad gauge and the tender standard gauge that would explain why the body was offset and why it was not kept.

Rodney

[justin]

Definitely Swindon Works. The tender is standing at the rear of the Stock shed. The GWR, in common with some other railway companies had their own gas works at Swindon that supplied town gas to the railway works, station and the original railway village. No.3 gas holder is on the right and No. 4 gas holder is in the background. The gas works closed in 1959 but was not demolished immediately. No.5 gas holder in fact lasted until 2012 having passed to the gas board and its privatised successor. There is an article in Railway Archive No.23 about the gas works.

 

Regarding the tender I agree with others that this is the mock up standard gauge tender built to go with North Star for the GWR centenary celebrations.

 

Justin

[phil_sutters]

I don't know whether it is the same tender refurbished or another new recreation, but there is a photo of the replica of Stephenson's Planet 2-2-0, in Robin Jones' The Dawn of Steam, with the same type of tender. The loco was built by the Friends of the Museum of Science and Industry in Manchester in 1992.