grahame Posted April 6, 2021 Author Share Posted April 6, 2021 24 minutes ago, Tricky-CRS said: . . . are people coming around to 3D printed? I think its to expensive (certainly from the likes of shapeways) and whitemetal looks more solid and easy to work with. 3D printed is certainly 'in vogue' currently but it does have drawbacks. It's expensive (as you mention), fragile, often suffers from stratification ridges that needs quite a bit of work to eradicate, then there's the finishing necessary - preparation, painting, glazing, etc. Whitemetal tends to suffer from a poor historic reputation, probably as a result of those old, crude models with solid windows. But it doesn't have to be. This N gauge Austin K2/Y (Katy) Ambulance from Arrowhead Miniatures is a good example of what can be achieved with whitemetal: 2 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahame Posted April 6, 2021 Author Share Posted April 6, 2021 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Steadfast said: With 3D printing it depends on the material. Some of the early Shapeways materials were virtually unsandable (was it white strong and flexible?) and FUD is very brittle and has very crisp layering from the printing process. The resin based printing methods tend to have softer ridges between layers and tend to behave more like injection moulded plastic when sanded or cut. Having been making Airfix, Tamiya etc since childhood, anything that behaves like a plastic is much more comfortable for me, but it's horses for courses and others may feel the complete opposite. Shapeways have a 'cheap' material that has a very rough finish, like sandstone (or dentine), but is harder to sand. The more expensive fine materials often used for miniatures are a kind of acrylic resin and are very brittle - I have had models shatter, or least have several bits break off, when dropped even a short distance. They do have a list of many materials but they don't seem to be available as a choice when selecting and purchasing: https://static1.sw-cdn.net/files/cms/materials/comparison-guides/Shapeways_MaterialsGuide-2020-All.pdf And yep, I agree, I also prefer to model with injection moulded plastics and/or styrene type plastics (as in plasticard sheet and strip). Edited April 6, 2021 by grahame 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted April 6, 2021 Share Posted April 6, 2021 12 minutes ago, Ian Morgan said: I have to say that white metal, as used in so many British model products, to me seems very 'chunky' and usually with quite poor detail definition. In the US, where white metal is probably banned because of its toxicity (in the same way Kinder Eggs are banned because toys are hidden inside the chocolate) they produce some wonderfully fine detailed motor vehicles for N scale using Pewter. e.g. https://www.ghqmodels.com/collections/1-160-10mm-n-scale I was thinking whitemetal / pewter as it depends on the caster, some use very low lead levels some none. As Grahame mentions you can get some very good metal kits, R Parker and Arrowhead but I have bought some horrendous ones, even terrible resin ones. Its really hard to know how well the resin from 3D printing will last, once painted is it protected or will it degrade, metal won't? Its interesting and I thank you for your feedback. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted April 6, 2021 Share Posted April 6, 2021 'Whitemetal' technically is any silver coloured metal that is not Assay marked as silver. Also if you look it up, pewter can be a lead/tin alloy. The Sherpas certainly look the part much more so than the old cast one currently available. If used as masters a little light sanding/filling to remove the layering will lift them that extra level. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted April 6, 2021 Share Posted April 6, 2021 55 minutes ago, BernardTPM said: 'Whitemetal' technically is any silver coloured metal that is not Assay marked as silver. Also if you look it up, pewter can be a lead/tin alloy. The Sherpas certainly look the part much more so than the old cast one currently available. If used as masters a little light sanding/filling to remove the layering will lift them that extra level. Thanks, it has confused me when people try to use pewter as different to whitemetal when I thought it was variations of the same, now you have confirmed it. I am planning on trying to get better quality prints done as masters, I have another resin to try on my printer if that is not perfect I'll pay for better prints. I then may pay a sculptor to prep the masters so I know they are perfect, don't trust my finishing skills. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
-missy- Posted April 6, 2021 Share Posted April 6, 2021 5 minutes ago, Tricky-CRS said: Thanks, it has confused me when people try to use pewter as different to whitemetal when I thought it was variations of the same, now you have confirmed it. I am planning on trying to get better quality prints done as masters, I have another resin to try on my printer if that is not perfect I'll pay for better prints. I then may pay a sculptor to prep the masters so I know they are perfect, don't trust my finishing skills. Hi Richard. How about 3D printing the moulds directly for casting? Its something that I have been wanting to try for a while now. M. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted April 6, 2021 Share Posted April 6, 2021 2 minutes ago, -missy- said: Hi Richard. How about 3D printing the moulds directly for casting? Its something that I have been wanting to try for a while now. M. Not sure, I have been looking at various ideas but not that one, can you print in silicon rubber? I real want a siocast machine but not got £60000 to invest, that would mean nice resin/plastic injection moulded parts. This is way of in the distance at the minute. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Royal42 Posted April 6, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 6, 2021 (edited) This tutorial might be of help. Or this one for a two-part mould. Silicone moulds wear out quickly, plus they are prone to movement; causing mis-shapes, whereas rigid resin moulds should last for ages and retain their form. Mike Edited April 6, 2021 by Royal42 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium acg5324 Posted April 6, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 6, 2021 Redandy on eBay has got a Wolseley 16/60 printed off in undercoat. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/164795458007 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trewisin Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 (edited) Hi all we have all tried various means of trying to get good looking vehicles on layouts wether it be in metal or plastic (print 3D). But we still cant get anywhere near the manufactures finished products . So I think we will have to comprimise to the best we can as long as we still able to get something that looks right then its going to be right in our eyes. Yes Grahame I have 2 of those K2 s and a couple of the Humber wagons as well , nice models. Trickey those Sherpas look very interesting you have started the ball rolling. As P G models have ceased operating to the general public He is only continuing to produce the special vehicles for the NGS warwagons Missy you had a go a Printing a Foden ballast wagon some time back I recall .That made a nice loooking model .Have you made any others?. Regards Ray. Edited April 7, 2021 by Trewisin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 23 hours ago, Ragtag said: They're looking good, are they in N? Not 3D printed but I'm quite partial to a Sherpa or two myself Sorry missed this question, yes N gauge well 1/152ish at the minute will be rescaled when I work out all the shrinkage rates. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahame Posted April 7, 2021 Author Share Posted April 7, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, Trewisin said: Hi all we have all tried various means of trying to get good looking vehicles on layouts wether it be in metal or plastic (print 3D). As well as white-metal and acrylic resin plastics (3D printed), there are also polyurethane resin models available. These military vehicles pictured below (Saxon APCs and a Humber Pig) are resin model kits from the NGS. It is also easy to produce your own models from a silicone rubber mould using a homemade (carved, assembled or 3D printed) master. And, of course, it is quite possible to make your own vehicles (or extensively bash commercial ones) using styrene plastic like plasticard sheet and strip. These two below, while utilising commercial cabs (the Scania is an injection moulded cab from a fire appliance model and the Ford D series tractor unit is a 3D print), have scratch-built bodies made from styrene tube, sheet and strip: Edited April 7, 2021 by grahame 4 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragtag Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 5 hours ago, Tricky-CRS said: Sorry missed this question, yes N gauge well 1/152ish at the minute will be rescaled when I work out all the shrinkage rates. Pity, could use some of those styles in 1/76 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Ragtag said: Pity, could use some of those styles in 1/76 Not sure they would scale upto well, wall thicknesses, that said depending on your perspective you could get them drawn quite cheap, depending how many versions you wanted. The guy that drew them for me has alot of info and a good idea of the shape now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trewisin Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 Hi Tricky I like your mini buses based on the Leyland Sherpa. Are you looking at having a fleet of Badger Line Buses., or are you just trying to see how many variations of a Sherpa you can get. Thanks for your imput Grahame those military vehicles are the Ngs special load produced by PG models ,His Volo Snow Cat vehicle used by the Marines has just been released for the society looks nice. I did not realise that these were made of resin as most of PG models were in melat . As you probably thought metal would be heavy for loads in N gauge, hes gone for resin as an altenative. This gives us another means of producing models , If 3D is not what we can get easily.Regards Ray Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted April 8, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 8, 2021 On 06/03/2021 at 14:09, BernardTPM said: You need just a very small bit of curved angling across the front end of the Allegro bonnet and grille. It's not quite straight. Rad grilles on Allegros (Allegri?) is a whole subject in itself. Different for each sub-series/model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 Yes, though the bonnet pressing is the same. The last series made the rear lights less curved too and got rid of the two concave recesses between them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahame Posted April 9, 2021 Author Share Posted April 9, 2021 Here's something that might be of interest to those who bash vehicle models - a 3D printed container truck chassis from RailNscale. Currently only seems to be in 1:160 scale but I'm sure if you ask they'd do 1:148 scale. https://railnscale.com/2021/03/26/flat-container-chassis/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium acg5324 Posted April 15, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 15, 2021 Another new vehicle from redandy on ebay Volvo 142 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/164816229559 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 Final versions signed off. deciding on next project. 5 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
javlinfaw7 Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 https://69.cdn.ekm.net/ekmps/shops/osbornsmodels/images/what-s-next-[2]-43500-1-p.jpg?v=F245D3DC-1DEC-4721-8AFD-236168BCD0A9 In coming next from Osborns models 2 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahame Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 Excellent. A Bedford TK. I did suggest it to them on their suggestions scheme for new vehicles. Very pleased to see it'll be next. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium acg5324 Posted April 21, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 21, 2021 Ford Zephyr Mk3 from Redandy..........cue Z cars? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/164825588285 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahame Posted April 25, 2021 Author Share Posted April 25, 2021 On 18/04/2021 at 20:59, Tricky-CRS said: Final versions signed off. deciding on next project. Are these Sherpas available for purchase anywhere? TIA 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted April 25, 2021 Share Posted April 25, 2021 4 hours ago, grahame said: Are these Sherpas available for purchase anywhere? TIA Not at the moment, hopefully early autumn I'll have some news, just planning next few models first. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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