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Kadee Couplings on Bachmann Mk 1 Coaches


drewn
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Hi guys,

 

I've just bought some more Kadee couplings because I think they give me greater lexibility in when and where I can uncouple wagons and coaches.

 

However, I've come across a problem with Bachmann Mk 1 coaches.  The  Kadee coupler itself, when fitted into the NEM socket, tends to foul the bottom of the coach's buffer beam, thus stopping it from deflecting when over the magnet.

The options open to me seem to be :-

 

1. Use  a longer Kadee eg go from a #19 to a #20

2. Introduce a stepped coupler which would not only clear the buffer beam but also bring the coach and loco couplings into line vertically ( there's a good video on

   YouTube on how to do this)

 

Has anyone else had this problem and how did you overcome it?

 

Drew

 

 

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The coupling device on Bachmann coaches works far better with a stiff link between the coaches and the coaches kept in semi permanent rakes.

A case where there are superior options to Kadees. Hornby and Roco do a coupling that behaves in a similar fashion to the Bachmann originals and allows closer coupling by using a combination of the two.

Bernard

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Hi guys,

 

I've just bought some more Kadee couplings because I think they give me greater lexibility in when and where I can uncouple wagons and coaches.

 

However, I've come across a problem with Bachmann Mk 1 coaches.  The  Kadee coupler itself, when fitted into the NEM socket, tends to foul the bottom of the coach's buffer beam, thus stopping it from deflecting when over the magnet.

The options open to me seem to be :-

 

1. Use  a longer Kadee eg go from a #19 to a #20

2. Introduce a stepped coupler which would not only clear the buffer beam but also bring the coach and loco couplings into line vertically ( there's a good video on

   YouTube on how to do this)

 

Has anyone else had this problem and how did you overcome it?

 

Drew

 

HI Drew

 

I'm at work at the moment , but from memory the Bachmann mk 1 coaches have the NEM box at the wrong height. I got over this by taking a standard Kadee coupling ( say a # 5, 16. 36 or similar) cutting the boss off and then epoxying the resulting shaft into the NEM box.

 

I don't model British much any more but I have one Bachmann Mk1 left and I will photograph it when I get home to show you what I mean.

 

Paul

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The coupling device on Bachmann coaches works far better with a stiff link between the coaches and the coaches kept in semi permanent rakes.

A case where there are superior options to Kadees. Hornby and Roco do a coupling that behaves in a similar fashion to the Bachmann originals and allows closer coupling by using a combination of the two.

Bernard

 

Yes I agree but I assume he will still want a Kadee at the end of the rake to connect to a loco.

 

Paul

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Yes I agree but I assume he will still want a Kadee at the end of the rake to connect to a loco.

 

Paul

 

Yeah,  That's right Paul

 

Basically I will have a Kadee on the end coach only - connected to the loco's Kadee

 

Drew

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A #20 will fit with no problems.  For a #19 you will need to file the underside of the end beam as otherwise it will snag against it.  I use Hornby-Roco couplings within sets, and #20 on the outer ends.

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With Bachmann bogie vehicles I use #20.The Bachmann NEM pocket on most of their stock is often a little further backwards than some others. For Hornby vehicles I find that #19 is OK

 

However I am regularly uncoupling single vehicles, for which I use the kebab stick method not magnets. I have standardised Kadee location such that the inner (pushing) face of the coupler is in line with the buffer face. I have Peco medium radius points and find that this gives reliable working both pushing and pulling

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The NEM pocket is too high - the bodge I often refer to works well with these - take a NEM tension lock coupling that you are not going to use and reduce it just to the NEM fitment and the plastic shank that is the same width as the fitment. Take your NEM Kadee and cut off the NEM fitment. Now glue/blot/screw as applicable the two parts together to make a stepped coupling that fits the pocket but has the coupling at the right height. In some cases (not usually with the Mk1s) it may be necessary to provide some packing between the two parts to increase the step.

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As others have said, the Bachmann link does not place the pocket in the position laid down by the NEM standard so the Kadee coupler head, or any other make that is made to fit into one that does, will not be correctly aligned.

 

The non-bodging solution is the replacement links made by Keen Systems, which are a straight swap for the Bachmann parts but give the correct length and height. If you run your coaches as a fixed rake you only need one at each end.

 

I fit them with Kadee #19s if using corridor covers, or #18s if not.

 

Within the set, the most economical course is to keep the Bachmann links but fit Hornby R8220 coupler heads.

 

John

Edited by Dunsignalling
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As others have said, the Bachmann link does not place the pocket in the position laid down by the NEM standard so the Kadee coupler head, or any other make that is made to fit into one that does, will not be correctly aligned.

 

The non-bodging solution is the replacement links made by Keen Systems, which are a straight swap for the Bachmann parts but give the correct length and height. If you run your coaches as a fixed rake you only need one at each end.

 

I fit them with Kadee #19s if using corridor covers, or #18s if not.

 

Within the set, the most economical course is to keep the Bachmann links but fit Hornby R8220 coupler heads.

 

John

John beat me to it!  This is exactly what I was about to post.

One further solution is to attach a #19 or #20 UNDERNEATH the Bachmann NEM box.  I drill a small hole through the coupling and box and fit a small screw to hold it in place.  A drop of canopy glue between the NEM box and the shaft of the coupling stops it pivoting on the screw, but allows removal if need be.

HTH

Bob.

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Guys,

 

I think I've overcome this particular problem and it's very much along the lines of Phatbob's suggestion.  I've merely superglued a #19 coupler to the underside of the NEM box.

 

I haven't even popped a screw in, It overcomes the Bachmann NEM height problem, the fouling of the end beam and facilitates good uncoupling .

 

I may be back to eat humble pie later, but in the meantime, thanks for all the info and advice.

 

No doubt speak soon

 

Drew

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  • 3 weeks later...

To get a Kadee coupling on a Bachmann Mk1 coach, it is best to use two 1mm thick cardboard pieces and to mount a #5 on it. The height matches up perfectly then.

DSCI3100.JPG

 

White in this instance, but black is preferred by me. Picture courtesy by my friend McRuss who is on here too.

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To get a Kadee coupling on a Bachmann Mk1 coach, it is best to use two 1mm thick cardboard pieces and to mount a #5 on it. The height matches up perfectly then.

 

DSCI3100.JPG

 

White in this instance, but black is preferred by me. Picture courtesy by my friend McRuss who is on here too.

 

But now you've lost the benefits of the close-coupling mechanism.  Using the Hornby version of the Roco coupling - at least for the inner connections of fixed sets -  the corridor connections of Bachmann MK1s are touching on straight track (and hence look very realistic) but open out on curves as needed.

Edited by RFS
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As you can see the Kadee in the picture is set to a gap of 1mm between corridor connectors. That is close enough not to distract the eye.
 
Retaining the wrong coupler height gives unreliable connection to the loco if the coupler pocket on the coupler is at the correct height. Furthermore, if you run long rakes the close coupling mechanism can turn into a disadvantage as it increases the play, especially in long rakes or when pushing (OK, pushing does not apply to Mk1 does it).

 

Having fixed rakes is uncomfortable for some of us as well.

27984100812_ae71160506_c.jpg
Short on locos by – FelixM –, auf Flickr

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But now you've lost the benefits of the close-coupling mechanism.  Using the Hornby version of the Roco coupling - at least for the inner connections of fixed sets -  the corridor connections of Bachmann MK1s are touching on straight track (and hence look very realistic) but open out on curves as needed.

Alternatively, you can use the Bachmann NEM EZ-Mate coupler which is compatible with Kadee, but doesn't have the swivelly bit the NEM Kadees have. Downside is only one length, but it is spot on for the Bachmann MK2's on 2nd radius and up whilst giving close to touching corridor connections on the straights.

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To get a Kadee coupling on a Bachmann Mk1 coach, it is best to use two 1mm thick cardboard pieces and to mount a #5 on it. The height matches up perfectly then.DSCI3100.JPG

 

White in this instance, but black is preferred by me. Picture courtesy by my friend McRuss who is on here too.

What's your minimum radius? With your couplings fixed to the body don't they restrict you around curves?

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No they actually perform better as the train is more "stiff" and less likely to derail. My minimum radius is 3ft which is PECO medium point which they take well, even when pushing at great speed. But it would be easy to push them out a bit to allow for tighter curves.

 

HTH!

Edited by FelixM
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There's this

 

http://www.clag.org.uk/kaydees-mk1.html

 

...or this which we will probably be adopting on Balcombe. They are used on 'Eridge' very successfully.

 

attachicon.gifimg377.jpg

 

Glad you brought this up John,  I take the opportunity from time to time to raise this.  You'll be happy to know (I hope) that this is a method I have adopted and I find it works very well.  This is the method Tony Wright uses.

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/64295-wright-writes/page-21

 

I also use folded paper gangways.

 

Kadees have too much slop and close coupling can't be maintained. 

 

John

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  • 3 years later...
On 13/03/2017 at 21:30, FelixM said:

To get a Kadee coupling on a Bachmann Mk1 coach, it is best to use two 1mm thick cardboard pieces and to mount a #5 on it. The height matches up perfectly then.

DSCI3100.JPG

 

White in this instance, but black is preferred by me. Picture courtesy by my friend McRuss who is on here too.

I received two brand new Bachmann Mk1s today for my layout.  I use Kadee couplings and I also rely on the delayed action uncoupling via a magnet at the entrance to the sidings  (it's a carriage /parcels sidings layout). As expected, the Kadee is too high so the delayed action doesn't work.  The passenger trains are 5 coach fixed rakes with Bachmann pipe connectors on the inside coaches and a kadee at each end. The annoying thing is that I have two Hornby BGs which work fine, so I may have to stick one on the end of the Bachmann set to work with the locos (which even more annoyingly) are both Bachmann.  I have butchered a cheap 2nd hand Hornby CCT to fit a Kadee and it works. I just need to pluck up courage to hack away at my nice new Mk1s. 

Edited by 9C85
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On 13/03/2017 at 21:30, FelixM said:

To get a Kadee coupling on a Bachmann Mk1 coach, it is best to use two 1mm thick cardboard pieces and to mount a #5 on it. The height matches up perfectly then.

DSCI3100.JPG

 

White in this instance, but black is preferred by me. Picture courtesy by my friend McRuss who is on here too.

My method is similar to this, but cutting further into the headstock so that the coupling is at the same height above rail level as the buffers. This is just as the protoype.

 

By setting the coupling out from the body perhaps a smidge further than here, my coach sets will negotiate 27" radius curves, and I also fit small home made card "concertinas" in the corridor connectors to "close the gap".

 

Yuo have to be careful if you stick with the Bachmann close coupling device on these coaches as on changes of gradient the bogies can foul the mechanism and this can cause derailments.

 

Kadee 5's fitted on this or my method do give a nice firm ride as said, with the coaches supporting each other. It works pushing as well, I can push uphill, round a curve and through facing pointwork without a problem.

 

John.

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I fit KD ~5s to the floor of the coaches. I take a chunk out of the buffer beam to do so BUT the coupling is now where the real one sits on a Mk1.

 

(also note that the Bachmann Commonwealth bogie sits the coach at a slightly higher level than the Mk1 bogies. This can cause problems with using the NEM sockets as well..even if using an alternative coupling.)

 

From operating some coaches with the "hook and upright" fitted on an exhibition layout we have found that they are just as awkward as other couplings when it comes to deviations in track level and they just don't work on stock which needs to be pushed rather than pulled. (I suppose that would depend upon if you don't get buffer lock on your curves/points. With standard MK1s with retracted buffers this is a problem).

 

Biggest problem though is - for something made to a "Standard" the heights of the boxes from all manufacturers are... not standard,

 

Baz

 

 

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On 21/02/2017 at 19:24, Dunsignalling said:

 

The non-bodging solution is the replacement links made by Keen Systems, which are a straight swap for the Bachmann parts but give the correct length and height. If you run your coaches as a fixed rake you only need one at each end.

 

I fit them with Kadee #19s if using corridor covers, or #18s if not.

Hello,could you please point me in the direction of these links? I am just about at the point where I am going to seriously bodge my nice new Bachmann Mk1s , and I am pretty sure I will make a mess of it. I will need the finished articles to work with the delayed action uncoupling magnet.  Any advice  would be appreciated.  Thanks. 

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1 hour ago, 9C85 said:

Hello,could you please point me in the direction of these links? I am just about at the point where I am going to seriously bodge my nice new Bachmann Mk1s , and I am pretty sure I will make a mess of it. I will need the finished articles to work with the delayed action uncoupling magnet.  Any advice  would be appreciated.  Thanks. 

 

Keen Systems - http://www.keen-systems.com/Couplings.html

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