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4 hours ago, Jack P said:

 

I'll have to have a hunt and see if I can find the discussion. I'd like to 'fix' it if I can.. god forbid doing a whole bufferbeam, only to find after the fact...

Been there, done that, cussed GW. 

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On 11/08/2020 at 00:22, 30368 said:

Jack,

 

I have built a DJH D1/E1 and like you I found it very front heavy. All that smokebox/boiler white metal! I'm not saying that a scratch built chassis would not help but it won't cure all that weight over the bogie which tends to lift the trailing driver.

 

I trimmed out some of the weight by adding lead sections under the cab. It didn't cure it completely but the loco runs well. You will find too that when the loco is coupled to the tender, which is also heavy, this will help to compensate.

To be fair to DJH all 4-4-0's display a tendency to be front heavy (I have no experience of compensated chassis) its just that cast kits are worse.

 

Great work. Building wee loco's is a journey of discovery! I continually strive to improve with each build until the eyesight or something else gives up!

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

Thanks Richard! 

 

Chris W has built a fantastic chassis with a pivot beam on the front driver/bogie. I'll probably look to replicate this arrangement as best I can. Worst case; if I can't produce something decent enough to use, i'll just tart up the begeezus out of the DJH chassis and spring the front bogie, as well as hang the tender on the draw-bar as Pete did. 

 

You're certainly right about this hobby being a journey. I love looking back to the first few pages of this thread and comparing that to where i'm at now.

 

On 11/08/2020 at 03:23, gz3xzf said:

Hi Jack

I've found that I have had to add some additional weight at the front to overcome the spring they supply, I have mine quite well balanced currently.

The only problem I have noticed recently is that the loco and tender both appear to be riding high, not sure how I am going to cure the tender, but I am guessing I'm going to have to either remove metal from the chassis or the superstructure.

I am amazed how quickly you guys work, my L class build has been going for 3 years now! :O;)

 

I'll try and cram as much weight in as I can over the drivers. I can't seem to find any springs that really suit 4mm locos.. they all seem much too hard!

 

The loco sitting too high can be cured by removing the 'pads' at the front and rear of the underside of the footplate (about 1.5mm). The addition of the ashpan helps with the airy look these locos seem to take on as supplied by DJH.

 

It's not as quick as it might look.. I'm usually awake till the wee hours too - most normal people don't do this (i'm told)

 

On 11/08/2020 at 04:16, Daddyman said:

Been there, done that, cussed GW. 

 

.. I scribed a line and tried to do a row of rivets along it. Ended up looking more like a bow of rivets. Maybe i'll give Mr GW a call and ask about it.

 

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Posted (edited)

I've cleared the bench of the DJH L until some suitable material arrives for me to try and make some frames. 

 

I picked the W up again, and have made some progress. I managed to come up with a solution for making the roof removable. It's not as hard to remove as it might look, filming and holding is more difficult than it sounds.

 

 

Excuse the messy soldering. It's my first fully etched kit, and there's been a lot of trial and error. 

 

The rain strips on the roof are a little bit oversize, but i'd gotten to a point with the roof where there was a compromise between having larger rain strips, or a gap between the roof and the cab sides. I chose the former. The cab roof opening is also wrong, on the W they opened forwards, not backwards, and the closed position of the hatch is bang on the middle of the cab. For a class of 15 they really were all very different. 

 

It's not going to be a 'finescale model' as much as I might wish it was, but it will look like a W, and (hopefully) run well. I can only try and do better on the next one!

Edited by Jack P
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On 15/08/2020 at 03:36, Jack P said:

  

 

Thanks Richard! 

 

Chris W has built a fantastic chassis with a pivot beam on the front driver/bogie. I'll probably look to replicate this arrangement as best I can. Worst case; if I can't produce something decent enough to use, i'll just tart up the begeezus out of the DJH chassis and spring the front bogie, as well as hang the tender on the draw-bar as Pete did. 

Hanging the tender on the drawbar works well on very well laid track especially in EM gauge but when I do it the tender either rocks on its rear wheels or derails or both.  Separating the tender body which bears on the drawbar from the tender chassis which does not or arranging the centre and front tender wheels on a sub frame or bogie which stays firmly on the track are solutions but my current attempts on a City of Truro and a K's (?) Dukedog is to spring the tender drawbar so that much of but not all the tender weight is on the drawbar

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On 16/08/2020 at 04:56, Daddyman said:

I wouldn't bother - see the comments in Mike Edge's thread. 

 

I just read that.. Ah well. I'll push on, and just keep the 'issues' in mind.

 

On 15/08/2020 at 15:14, DavidCBroad said:

Hanging the tender on the drawbar works well on very well laid track especially in EM gauge but when I do it the tender either rocks on its rear wheels or derails or both.  Separating the tender body which bears on the drawbar from the tender chassis which does not float or arranging the centre and front tender wheels on a sub frame or bogie which stays firmly on the track are solutions but my current attempts on a City of Truro and a K's (?) Dukedog is to spring the tender drawbar so that much of but not all the tender weight is on the drawbar

 

Thanks David. I'd though about springing the tender/loco drawbar, i'll keep a couple of options in mind for when I get back around to the L.

 

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Posted (edited)

I've made some progress - lots of firsts! 

 

Using Gibson wheels and building valve gear. Both much easier than I thought they'd be. I only used rivets in one place, the rest are all 16BA nuts/bolts, it really is like metal knitting, but the end result is so pleasing. 

 

50238648381_85f32f821f_h.jpg

 

I also used some scrap etch to connect the cylinders with the two motion brackets. This makes the whole valve gear removable.

 

Confession time - the combination lever is on the outside of the motion bracket, instead of behind it-  but the compromise was between this and good running. I couldn't get the bits inboard enough to ensure enough clearance for the crosshead. I don't think it spoils the look.. much.

 

 

Not much left to do now. A feew cosmetic items to add to the cylinder chests, and then they can be primed and painted. The motion will all come off again to be blackened and the wheels/brakes painted in situ. The body needs a few small details added, mainly the tank tops and the front lamp irons. I might make some cab doors too. 

 

I'm glad I packed the tanks with lead, even with that added, the loco is very light. I might try and get some more lead sheet into the cutout in the boiler/firebox.

 

I'm really happy with the decision to move to Gibson wheels, the GW press is so easy to use, and I really like the fidelity of the spokes and flange. These will be my go-to wheels from now on. 

Edited by Jack P
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14 hours ago, Jack P said:

Using Gibson wheels and building valve gear. Both much easier than I thought they'd be. I only used rivets in one place, the rest are all 16BA nuts/bolts, it really is like metal knitting, but the end result is so pleasing. 

 

I also used some scrap etch to connect the cylinders with the two motion brackets. This makes the whole valve gear removable.

 

Nice one Jack,  I agree with you on valvegear, it can be a really daunting prospect, but I usually find it a lot LESS fiddly than the brakegear.

 

Good idea to connect the valve gear brackets together to form a complete removable sub-assembly, makes it SO much easier to work on.

 

One minor problemmette, your expansion link is back-to-front.  The inner part of the radius should be facing forwards.

There is a really good demonstration model of Walschearts Valvegear on Youtube here:   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7NABUkyGok

 

All the best, Dave.

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On 19/08/2020 at 01:04, hayfield said:

Jack

 

Very impressive, I like your idea of attaching the motion brackets to the cylinders

 

Thank you! I can't really claim credit for the idea though, DLT provides endless inspiration and good ideas, much of what I try and implement has come from the pages of his thread. It does make it much easier to pull the gear in/out.

 

On 19/08/2020 at 01:26, DLT said:

 

Nice one Jack,  I agree with you on valvegear, it can be a really daunting prospect, but I usually find it a lot LESS fiddly than the brakegear.

 

Good idea to connect the valve gear brackets together to form a complete removable sub-assembly, makes it SO much easier to work on.

 

One minor problemmette, your expansion link is back-to-front.  The inner part of the radius should be facing forwards.

There is a really good demonstration model of Walschearts Valvegear on Youtube here:   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7NABUkyGok

 

All the best, Dave.

 

Thanks Dave! As I said above, an idea taken from yourself, many photographs and write-ups of your work has proven to be extremely helpful.

 

I see what you mean about the expansion link.. The drawing was unclear, and the nub appear to face this way on the prototype. Another case of leaping before looking I think. I'm not sure if I will rectify it now though - possibly just chalk it up to experience. I think If I revisit the W I will made additions to the valve gear, the valve spindle crosshead and guides are poorly represented and it would be nice to add them in. 

 

It certainly feels like i've broken a barrier. Two things which previously were daunting, are now less so. 

 

Jumping back a bit, I decided to have a go at fitting the pony truck.

 

50245685083_fa95e4c9a0_h.jpg

 

It had a real tendency to flop about. I'm not an expert on compensation, suspensions or springing, but I decided to add a bit of wire and some tube inside the frames to retain it. 

 

50246320026_28bb4dbf50_h.jpg

 

If anyone has any other suggestions for bogie/pony springing, please do let me know. 

 

I'm not under any illusion that people are waiting with baited breath for my next update, but; modelling will now be put on hold until at-least the end of the month. My partner, some friends and I are spending some much needed time away by Lake Taupō

 

50246528962_6c4aef8124_h.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Well then Thank you both for a great idea

 

Have a great holiday, something may here are getting frustrated about. Our previous plans were to go to Italy this year, then changing this to France, both now seem unlikely. Waiting for school holidays to end then a UK destination looks on the cards. Still at least we live in a nice bit of the country and can get away for a few hours easily and the coast is not far away.

 

Enjoy yourselves and stay safe

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And then there were two...

 

50284141482_d9f55d715e_h.jpg

 

Acquired from an auction site, it was listed as a 'Port Line' model. Upon arrival, it hesitantly burst into life. 

 

 

It sounds rather quiet in the video, but in person it's extremely loud. 

 

Upon further examination, it occurred to me that this loco must be the predecessor to the PDK kit, the instructions and box confirm it is actually a 'Crowline' product. 

 

It didn't take long before things were being attended to.

 

50283988901_e01c321ccd_h.jpg

 

The Gibson buffers had locked up solid, and the intention had always been to repaint the thing anyway. The body has been built to an acceptable standard (similar to my own), however the chassis was another story entirely. I'm not sure what type of motor the large, loud thing inside this was, but in order to fit it the builder had to make compromises.

 

50283308743_42114bd03c_h.jpg

 

Luckily I have spare motion brackets from my PDK kit, which (unsurprisingly) fit perfectly. After some careful cutting and de-soldering I managed to build up a similar arrangement as the other, in order to make the valve gear removable. The bits are now sitting in a bath of simple green to strip the remaining paint. I'll touch base with Paul at PDK and see if I can get a spare etch for the valve gear and some other little odds and ends. I'll replace the wheels with gibsons and fit a highlevel/Mashima combo. The next job will be cleaning up the leftover bits and figuring out what's reusable. 

 

The other W is nearing completion, only final little bits are needed 

 

50283988891_7efea50129_h.jpg

 

50284141887_72721a5f6f_h.jpg

 

50283988866_2aef8a9bc3_h.jpg

 

Apologies for the average pictures. As with any loco there is a vast number of final details - since these photos were taken, i've added the vac/steam heat pipes and lamp irons to the front, as well as a shunters step on the rear. The body is now ready to go into the ultrasonic bath, and then into primer. 

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More progress;

 

50284613533_cd61123b1b_h.jpg

 

Everything is now going to be left to dry for a few days. I need to pick out a few other details. I'll add the buffers and coupling hooks soon. The rear bogie needs the brake assembly attached. I decided to glue this on, as the wheels won't  be removable once this is in place.

 

I've run into a bit of an issue, I thought I could run pickups underneath, but everything is very close to the brake rigging and I can't seem to get it quite right. I'm also struggling with using 0.31mm N/S wire. I don't know if i'm going to be able to run backscratcher pickups either, there doesn't seem to be all that much room under the footplate. Does anyone have any suggestions?

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37 minutes ago, Jack P said:

I've run into a bit of an issue, I thought I could run pickups underneath, but everything is very close to the brake rigging and I can't seem to get it quite right. I'm also struggling with using 0.31mm N/S wire. I don't know if i'm going to be able to run backscratcher pickups either, there doesn't seem to be all that much room under the footplate. Does anyone have any suggestions?

 

Do you have a photo of the underside of the body unit?  Or one of the chassis with just the footplate on it, before the rest of the bodywork was attached? 

SHOULD be plenty of room for backscratchers

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1 hour ago, DLT said:

 

Do you have a photo of the underside of the body unit?  Or one of the chassis with just the footplate on it, before the rest of the bodywork was attached? 

SHOULD be plenty of room for backscratchers

 

Hey Dave, thanks for dropping in.

 

50284922143_b9c6aec6f8_h.jpg

 

I don't have any other photos of the chassis/body mid assembly. 

 

I just need to bite the bullet and put another motor mount in place to level it out, instead of having it lean down to the rear. Then i'll should have enough room.

 

Do you have any tips for preventing shorting in tight areas?

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I usually "mount" the motors by using a piece of brass or nickel silver wire soldered to the pickup plate and the motor contacts, rather than a length of cable.  This supports the rear end of the motor and does away with the need for any form of mounting.  Thus the space between the frames below the motor remains clear.

Backscratchers would be the ideal solution for this loco, as I found with my W, the brakegear etc gets in the way of conventional underside-mounted wipers.  With the motor held in a horizontal(ish) position there should be plenty of room

My Finecast W and E1/R chassis, both Backscratcher fitted:

521346537_Wfirstpics012small.jpg.430c3892448e8eec243dbd0fb0c99221.jpg

 

291825236_IMG_8213small.jpg.69f8a8b4279727b16104328ab25aad3f.jpg

 

If you use Phosphor-Bronze strip for pickups, make sure you bend it gently into a curve.  Do not put a sharp right-angle bend in it, as the metal will break very easily.

Cheers, Dave.

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Thanks Dave, as usual, your work inspires me greatly. 

 

Having said that, I'm not above admitting when i'm beat. Doing battle with the W for almost the entirety of my Birthday proved to be completely useless, and despite my best attempts trying many different tactics; I couldn't reliably get the loco to run under its own power. It will soon be winging its way around the world for Dave to expertly finish off.

 

50292324231_c4fed97b28_h.jpg

 

50292324236_3a5b1ea404_h.jpg

 

This is how she's sitting at the moment. A few compromises - both with my own skills and the kit, but it certainly looks like a W. Hopefully I can restore the other one to a similar standard. exactly what i'm going to do with 2 W's I don't know..

Edited by Jack P
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I've been having Deja Vu, the second W has been stripped and almost entirely disassembled. I'm trying to clean up the parts as best I can, but i'll need to make a new cab front and floor, no biggie. But my desire to continue working on it has been waning a little.

 

So I decided to work on something else..

 

50303384198_4b4d375ddc_h.jpg

 

50304070026_4546e5f5dc_h.jpg

 

This is the RT models etch. There aren't any instructions, but it's simple enough to put together (if a bit fiddly). I'm not 100% sure I've got the cab roof curve right, it is just placed there for the photo, and I think once it's actually araldited in place it will conform  to the profile much better. 

 

There are RT draincocks and front steps to fit too, I also replaced the ashpan assembly. I've also got some short smoke deflectors to fit but i'd like to avoid that if I can. I'm hoping to model an Eastern or Central section locomotive (circa 1947) if anyone has any suggestions.

 

A friend of mine also asked if I would do some work to his A4 Kingfisher. Nothing major, just a light weathering and fitting etched plates

 

50303449288_b518aa906c_h.jpg

 

50304287542_ddeb182cb6_h.jpg

 

I understand that the plates on boiler sides weren't fitted until after nationalisation, but this is how he wanted it. It was an enjoyable experience, I haven't actually seen an A4 model in the flesh before.  

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1 hour ago, Jack P said:

I've been having Deja Vu, the second W has been stripped and almost entirely disassembled. I'm trying to clean up the parts as best I can, but i'll need to make a new cab front and floor, no biggie. But my desire to continue working on it has been waning a little.

 

So I decided to work on something else..

 

50303384198_4b4d375ddc_h.jpg

 

50304070026_4546e5f5dc_h.jpg

 

This is the RT models etch. There aren't any instructions, but it's simple enough to put together (if a bit fiddly). I'm not 100% sure I've got the cab roof curve right, it is just placed there for the photo, and I think once it's actually araldited in place it will conform  to the profile much better. 

 

There are RT draincocks and front steps to fit too, I also replaced the ashpan assembly. I've also got some short smoke deflectors to fit but i'd like to avoid that if I can. I'm hoping to model an Eastern or Central section locomotive (circa 1947) if anyone has any suggestions.

 

 

 

Hi Jack

Looking good.

I have the RT parts in stock but have not yet got around to them - did you cut the existing cab away or is the etch overlaying it?

Tony

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2 hours ago, Tony Teague said:

Hi Jack

Looking good.

I have the RT parts in stock but have not yet got around to them - did you cut the existing cab away or is the etch overlaying it?

Tony

 

Hey Tony, Thanks for stopping by.

I tried to keep as much of the cab in place as I could so there would be enough surface to secure the new cab to

 

50303941293_849154300d_h.jpg

 

I wanted to retain the rivet detail so I put some tape over the rest of the body and filed down the old cab sides. They probably need a little bit more taken off before I'm happy.

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Thanks Jack

 

I think the main things that are putting me off are the re-painting job (so I will see how you get on!), plus the fact that I have "several" of these and once one is done it will just show up all of the rest!

 

Tony

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3 hours ago, Tony Teague said:

Thanks Jack

 

I think the main things that are putting me off are the re-painting job (so I will see how you get on!), plus the fact that I have "several" of these and once one is done it will just show up all of the rest!

 

Tony

HUMBROL acrylic malachite green is as close to spot on as you can get. It's what I've used when re-numbering my locos and you'd be hard pushed to see where the original colour ends and the new starts. 

 

Brian 

Edited by BSW01
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Humm.... Located a US located supplier for the HUMBROL acrylic malachite green. May add this project back to the English modeling project list.  Both my SR WC's are on the disabled list at moment with stripped drivers caused by hung main rods.  Add to the list for Peter's Spares. 

Edited by autocoach
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Regarding repainting, I have sometimes fully repainted, usually if I have also amended deflectors, or otherwise  I mask the main loco and spray just the new cab with Railmatch Malachite from a rattle can.
Once dry it initially doesn’t look a match for the Hornby finish but after the yellow lining is applied from Pressfix 10a lining I spray, again just the new cab, with Railmatch satin varnish, and this then gives a good final match to both colour and finish. 

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