artfull dodger Posted April 6, 2017 Share Posted April 6, 2017 The 45mm LGB track is so much more robust, it can be floated in ballest to some extent. Mine is on a hard packed dirt roadbed, then ballested and shimmed as needed to level it out. Every spring, the track crew must relevel and tune the track before derailment free operation happens. This will come to an end this summer as a new raised railway along my wood fence will be under construction. Between our new Beagle thinking everything on the old layout is a chew toy and my aging back, its time to get up off the ground or nearly ground level railway. Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owd Bob Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 The only option i can see Mike is that you dig the foundation channel deeper or step it up or down depending on the ground levels you have. I use small flat wooden pegs say one inch by one inch which are hammered into the centre of the trench, set the first pegs top to the final height level you want, and then knock pegs in all the way along the trench at what ever distance the length of your spirit level is, all leveled in and set at the same height as the first one, obviously you'll make your way along the trench and might get the top level of the pegs dropping lower or rising higher in the trench, this is then when you will have to step up or dig out your foundation trench deeper.....think that might help you a bit???? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Storey Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 The only option i can see Mike is that you dig the foundation channel deeper or step it up or down depending on the ground levels you have. I use small flat wooden pegs say one inch by one inch which are hammered into the centre of the trench, set the first pegs top to the final height level you want, and then knock pegs in all the way along the trench at what ever distance the length of your spirit level is, all leveled in and set at the same height as the first one, obviously you'll make your way along the trench and might get the top level of the pegs dropping lower or rising higher in the trench, this is then when you will have to step up or dig out your foundation trench deeper.....think that might help you a bit???? We think alike on that score! That is exactly how I have done it before, and intended to do again. But my question related to spotting, what I think, is VJoneslong's different method. Where the track bed goes some way above ground on one side (where the ground slopes at an angle to the track run), I use formwork to support the concrete bed as it is laid, and remove it when set. That normally leaves a very flat and obvious side to the concrete base (which is disguised later with whatever). But looking at his pics, there are no such obvious traces of formwork having been used (on the curve of the main blockwork). If there is a method to avoid using formwork, which I find takes up most of the preparation time, that would be fantastic. But I may have misunderstood what I am looking at in his pics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owd Bob Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 I see what you mean now Mike! if it helps i never use any kind of shuttering or board or foam i just bank up the soil dug out from the tench and chuck it out on both sides and firm it down, as you say its not going to be seen once its covered up so it do'snt have to be a neat or straight edge. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Storey Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 I see what you mean now Mike! if it helps i never use any kind of shuttering or board or foam i just bank up the soil dug out from the tench and chuck it out on both sides and firm it down, as you say its not going to be seen once its covered up so it do'snt have to be a neat or straight edge. Good point. I am probably trying to be too neat. My problem in a few areas is that I will have to dig very deep to make any trench at all, due to the slope, and the sub-soil here is not just rock-hard, it is rock in most places! But you have made me think again, I should look at building up the soil from elsewhere into those stretches, and then move most of it again when set (has to be that way, or I will block paths and other features). Moving earth twice is something we are supposed to avoid, but in this case, it makes sense. Thanks! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold vjoneslong Posted April 7, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 7, 2017 Great to see how you get such a smooth and level trackbed Idris. Presumably this removes all of the packing and tamping that goes with less solid/well-laid trackbeds. I've never understood how the 45mm boys cope with the 'floating' track that some of them use - possibly something to do with the much chunkier LGB-style track, but I much prefer your method. David Thanks David, you are correct. Previous incarnations of the DFLR have used the floating track bed principle. I found it relatively maintenance free in the first year, but after that I would end up spending more time on maintenance than running trains. Thats why I decided that once I owned a garden I would adopt a far more permanent approach. Well, now that you mention it.....From your pics, it looks like you have laid a continuous concrete bed for the continuous blockwork curve (prior to the viaduct blocks) with one side above ground level, but no sign of having used formwork (which is what I am dreading, having done this twice before). My usual method has been to dig down below ground level each side and use the earth as the former (or wood offcuts where needed, and pegged to get the level.) Am I right, and if so, how did you do that and still manage to get a good level? Was it a semi-dry mix or some other secret method?! No form work. Each block is laid on a bed of mortar, the same mix as you would use when brick laying for a house. I use put a couple of trowell fulls down, then check levels, adding and removing mortar as necessary until the brick/block is the correct height. In some cases I have ended up using very little, in others almost a whole bucket to sit one block! Once the block is level and correct, I usually neaten it off with a very thin trowel (like a builder uses for mortaring) to make it look nice. I intend to cast some extra support around some of the blocks, which will require form work, however I'm not going to do that until I can borrow Dad's mixer again. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold vjoneslong Posted April 7, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 7, 2017 Good point. I am probably trying to be too neat. My problem in a few areas is that I will have to dig very deep to make any trench at all, due to the slope, and the sub-soil here is not just rock-hard, it is rock in most places! But you have made me think again, I should look at building up the soil from elsewhere into those stretches, and then move most of it again when set (has to be that way, or I will block paths and other features). Moving earth twice is something we are supposed to avoid, but in this case, it makes sense. Thanks! Could you not work from the highest point of your garden as the lowest point on your railway and build up round it? How much slope are we talking about? Could always blast your way through the rock.... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Storey Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 (edited) Could you not work from the highest point of your garden as the lowest point on your railway and build up round it? How much slope are we talking about? Could always blast your way through the rock.... Slope problem is not to do with track slope but 90 deg slope to one side of the track bed. Whilst moving even more earth today, I have cracked it. So progress will follow, but not necessarily immediately - I have been given other instructions. These regard the planting of half a dozen, large, tree-like objects, which I had managed to defer until now. They involve the cracking of said rock to a depth of about a metre in each case. Apparently the presence of the digger has resurrected this insane gardening concept.....lining said big holes in the ground with stonework to retain the backfilling with special compost (these are bleeding olive trees, for goodness sake, not their natural habitat in this region) is going to take me much of next week. These will be BIG holes. Rome was not built in a day, but it was built a darn sight quicker than my railway. Nonetheless, the "melange" (what real people call ballast) has also arrived with plenty to spare for the first stages of trackbed (about fifty metres), and I already have the cement. D-day cannot be far off. Edited April 7, 2017 by Mike Storey 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold vjoneslong Posted April 10, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 10, 2017 Slope problem is not to do with track slope but 90 deg slope to one side of the track bed. Whilst moving even more earth today, I have cracked it. So progress will follow, but not necessarily immediately - I have been given other instructions. These regard the planting of half a dozen, large, tree-like objects, which I had managed to defer until now. They involve the cracking of said rock to a depth of about a metre in each case. Apparently the presence of the digger has resurrected this insane gardening concept.....lining said big holes in the ground with stonework to retain the backfilling with special compost (these are bleeding olive trees, for goodness sake, not their natural habitat in this region) is going to take me much of next week. These will be BIG holes. Rome was not built in a day, but it was built a darn sight quicker than my railway. Nonetheless, the "melange" (what real people call ballast) has also arrived with plenty to spare for the first stages of trackbed (about fifty metres), and I already have the cement. D-day cannot be far off. Excellent news, I look forward to reading about its progress on here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold vjoneslong Posted April 10, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 10, 2017 So a little more progress has been made. By mid-day Sunday, the piers were up to the required height. IMAG0781 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr IMAG0782 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr IMAG0783 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr This enabled block laying to beginning for the main trackbed this evening. IMAG0784 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr IMAG0785 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr IMAG0786 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr Its absolutely easy when you have spent the time levelling before hand. The six blocks took less than 45 minutes. I would have finished but I ran out of sand. I have a large bag being delivered after Easter, but I think I might have a trip to B&Q and pick a couple of bags up so I can finish it off on Wednesday evening. Will have to wait and see. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
77philg Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Are those blocks the concrete versions or the light weight ones? phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owd Bob Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Great to see so much progress Idris, i've been watching you progress for a few years now so you must be really chuffed to finally get so far, looking forward to seeing the next stage and dare i say? the finished line this Summer? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold vjoneslong Posted April 11, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 11, 2017 Are those blocks the concrete versions or the light weight ones? phil They are the aerated foundation blocks. I had terrible trouble getting hold of the standard aerated blocks last summer and eventually ended up with these. I have been able to cut them in four which enables lots of progress, but its a hard slog! Great to see so much progress Idris, i've been watching you progress for a few years now so you must be really chuffed to finally get so far, looking forward to seeing the next stage and dare i say? the finished line this Summer? Thanks Pinzer. Thats the aim. I'm taking the week off after Easter (well uni is shut Monday and Tuesday so I get 5 days holiday for the price of 3 days Annual leave) in which I plan to try and break the back of the work. Keep fingers crossed its still like this next week. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owd Bob Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Good job them big blocks have handles on 'em Idris thats all i can say Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold vjoneslong Posted April 11, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 11, 2017 Good job them big blocks have handles on 'em Idris thats all i can say They are light as a feather They aren't too heavy, I can just manhandle them into place. In other news I started working on making the door stops (not sure of technical term - I'm sure someone can fill me in) for two wagons. Managed to cut out and bend some thin brass strip to the required shapes, working from an example that had fallen off one of my Accucraft wagons. IMAG0787 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr IMAG0788 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr I've ordered some rivets so hopefully I can knock these up over the next couple of weeks and that will be another job done. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyram Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Great to see the progress on this railway. I love the video of the love steam operating. I would love something like that on my line. It is looking like a really impressive garden railway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narrow Minded Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Great progress on the foundation work Idris, and those "door bangers" look the biz Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold vjoneslong Posted April 11, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 11, 2017 Great to see the progress on this railway. I love the video of the love steam operating. I would love something like that on my line. It is looking like a really impressive garden railway. Thanks very much. It won't be a terribly interesting line operational wise, but I'm hoping that it will "feel" like the train has gone/been somewhere unlike my previous incarnations. Great progress on the foundation work Idris, and those "door bangers" look the biz Cheers NM! Is that the technical term? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyram Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Thanks very much. It won't be a terribly interesting line operational wise, but I'm hoping that it will "feel" like the train has gone/been somewhere unlike my previous incarnations. d: I certainly hope to develop the same idea with my garden efforts! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narrow Minded Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 I certainly hope to develop the same idea with my garden efforts! I've followed your Skaleby micro's (as inspiration for my own yet-to-be-started efforts), and I reckon you've already got the techniques mastered Think of your garden railway in the same way as a series of "linked micro's" and use appropriate 'view blockers' (structures, plantings, natural features) between them, and you'll create the effect of space. If you can stand just about anywhere in the garden and not see all the line, you'll have that magical ingredient of trains appearing and disappearing as they pass on their journey. My own small line is a basic loop for continuous running, but "operates" end-to-end. The two passenger terminus stations (freight operations are 'supposed' to continue beyond them - and why I'll be attempting two micro or boxfile layouts) are almost adjacent to each other, separated by little more than the garden path This short, featureless section of track is simply the equivalent of a "fiddle yard" in indoor layout terms Oh, and while I'm hijacking the thread, the continuous loop adds a bit of operational interest for end-to-end operation by allowing you to "stretch time" - simply by completing a set number of 'laps' of the circuit between each station stop Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyram Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 I've followed your Skaleby micro's (as inspiration for my own yet-to-be-started efforts), and I reckon you've already got the techniques mastered Think of your garden railway in the same way as a series of "linked micro's" and use appropriate 'view blockers' (structures, plantings, natural features) between them, and you'll create the effect of space. If you can stand just about anywhere in the garden and not see all the line, you'll have that magical ingredient of trains appearing and disappearing as they pass on their journey. My own small line is a basic loop for continuous running, but "operates" end-to-end. The two passenger terminus stations (freight operations are 'supposed' to continue beyond them - and why I'll be attempting two micro or boxfile layouts) are almost adjacent to each other, separated by little more than the garden path This short, featureless section of track is simply the equivalent of a "fiddle yard" in indoor layout terms Oh, and while I'm hijacking the thread, the continuous loop adds a bit of operational interest for end-to-end operation by allowing you to "stretch time" - simply by completing a set number of 'laps' of the circuit between each station stop Thanks that is very kind. If you not seen my thread yet, the layout is called "The Keepers Grange Light Railway". It uses some of the view blocking you have mentioned. Skaleby West is out at an exhibition in Sheffield in October. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold vjoneslong Posted April 12, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 12, 2017 Wise words NM. I'm lucky with this garden in that the greenhouse is roughly half way down, so this acts as a natural break anyway. I also find that having a change in height helps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold vjoneslong Posted April 13, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2017 So after a quick trip to B&Q, some more progress was made last night, with the last of the blocks for this part of the station area going in. IMAG0796 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr IMAG0797 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr IMAG0800 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr I found that one block was going to basically float in mid air, as I hadn't quite got the pillar spacing right. So this required some cutting. IMAG0793 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr IMAG0795 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr This was fortunate as it meant I didn't need to cut a block for the end, and it all just fell into place. IMAG0799 by Matthew Jones, on Flickr What mortar left over was used to pack between the blocks. Now for a brief pause while the rugby is on, then the push to get as much done as possible next week while on holiday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owd Bob Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 Impressive stuff Idris wish i could have the room to have such a big line, but swmbo owns 4/5ths of the back yard ..and i'm having to breath in when i open the gate to my bit Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyram Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 More great progress. I look forward to following developments next week during your holiday. I hope to make further progress on Keeper's Grange too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now