S7 scratch building

[airnimal]

I have read somewhere that the GWR had a daily pickup goods service starting from Manchester and going through Stockport taking the Altrincham line and on to Market Drayton. 

 I do have a Lee Marsh GWR 0-6-0st on order but I'm not sure if I really want one. I don't have a single GWR wagon in my collection and the money paid might have been better spent acquiring a NSR loco. Still I have read that the have all been accounted for before they have been delivered so I can always sell it on when it finally arrives. 

 

As for this horse lorry I am trying to build, my heart isn't in it. I have put the loops on that hold the shafts to the front of the vehicle but I think that's as far as I am going.  I will put it away for another day.

[Compound2632]

4 hours ago, airnimal said:

I don't have a single GWR wagon in my collection

 

That at least is something you could change easily enough!

[Simond]

5 hours ago, airnimal said:

I have read somewhere that the GWR had a daily pickup goods service starting from Manchester and going through Stockport taking the Altrincham line and on to Market Drayton. 

 I do have a Lee Marsh GWR 0-6-0st on order but I'm not sure if I really want one. I don't have a single GWR wagon in my collection and the money paid might have been better spent acquiring a NSR loco. Still I have read that the have all been accounted for before they have been delivered so I can always sell it on when it finally arrives. 

 

As for this horse lorry I am trying to build, my heart isn't in it. I have put the loops on that hold the shafts to the front of the vehicle but I think that's as far as I am going.  I will put it away for another day.

Shame it’s not floating your boat, it looks like another cracking build.

 

never mind, if your heart’s not in it, there’s no point, it’s a hobby after all!

[airnimal]

I need to do something to save myself from going daft until the lockdown is relaxed so I will try and finish some of my half completed wagons. This cattle wagon needs brakegear making from scratch because I have run out of castings that Adrian Swain let me have years ago. I never thought I would use them all but it was 2004 when he gave them to me. 

 

So I have cut out the brake block from an old brass washer that was the right thickness.  The brake hanger was made from a length of square brass tube.

[Mol_PMB]

Restarting abandoned projects can be hard because there was always a hood reason for stopping work before. But in this case it looks like a little work now will complete another superb wagon so well worth it! 

[Guy Rixon]

What is a typical thickness for a brake hanger when it is a single, iron bar bolted to the face of the wooden block? It's not marked on any drawings I have.

[airnimal]

Guy, I don't have written evidence of the size ( I am not an historian ) but scaling from the drawings  this works out at 3" 1/4"  The castings I have used in the past from Adrian all work out to this size or as close as possible and I have used brass tube which is slightly smaller than that. Steel brake shoe hangers are tapered and are thicker. 

[airnimal]

I have reprofiled the brake shoe and soldered it to a base plate that screws to the floor. I have also added the cast white metal brake pivot plate. 

[airnimal]

I have fitted an Ambis brake rack with a brake handle cut from nickel. This is the last my own axleboxes and I still have 5 more wagons needing them. I am starting to struggle for fittings now. I will have to spend a bit of brass and stock up. I know lots of people buy stuff online but although I do have occasional buy parts this way I do prefer to buy parts at exhibitions. I will hope to paint this cattle wagon tomorrow. 

[Nickey Line]

1 hour ago, airnimal said:

I know lots of people buy stuff online but although I do have occasional buy parts this way I do prefer to buy parts at exhibitions.

 

If you're not comfortable buying online, there's always the phone... or snail mail!

At least you'd be able to re-stock?

[Tricky]

13 hours ago, airnimal said:

I have fitted an Ambis brake rack with a brake handle cut from nickel. This is the last my own axleboxes and I still have 5 more wagons needing them. I am starting to struggle for fittings now. I will have to spend a bit of brass and stock up. I know lots of people buy stuff online but although I do have occasional buy parts this way I do prefer to buy parts at exhibitions. I will hope to paint this cattle wagon tomorrow. 

Is this the same cattle wagon that made an ‘appearance’ on Midland in Bristol?!

[airnimal]

Richard, the answer to you question is no it is a different one. I have built 3 now with this latest one. 

I would like to build a few more open topped ones and make a small cattle train. In the NSR wagon book there is a photograph of Uttoxeter goods yard in approx 1912 which has such a wagon still in existence and with the large lettering on the side. But I have run out of etched bars and other parts to make any more. I find these early cattle wagons attractive and there is not likely to be many or any kit manufacturers bringing out models of them. 

I have seen it written somewhere that open topped cattle wagons were to be outlawed quite early but they obviously hung on for sometimes after the cut off date.

[MarcD]

As a side the Furness Rly open topped cattle vans lasted long enough to make it to the LMS diagram book in 1928.

 

Marc

[airnimal]

With the sun shining I managed to get the rattle cans out and put some paint on the cattle wagon.

I made a little jig to hold the axleboxes while I spray them. 

 

Thinking about the roofless cattle wagons being outlawed early on I suppose that they could be used for barrels of beer. That may explain why we have photographs of them as late as 1912.

[Coal Tank]

The roofless ones do look good 

 

Rule 1

[airnimal]

Progress has been quite swift today with a lot of work completed on the cattle wagon. It will need numberplates ( which I dont  have ) and other lettering before it can be weathered and lime washed.

I am not sure what to do with the roof. I think they were white when newly built but I am sure they turned very nearly black in the 1890's. 

[bgman]

Whilst I thoroughly enjoy your craftsmanship I am not going to comment until it is finished and you're happy with it ! 

[wessy]

On 03/04/2021 at 16:53, airnimal said:

I have read somewhere that the GWR had a daily pickup goods service starting from Manchester and going through Stockport taking the Altrincham line and on to Market Drayton. 

I've had a look in a couple of LNWR working timetables for GWR goods trains going through Stockport. There are a few, but they were not stopping trains although there were limited stops at important traffic hubs. In general the trains arrive in the early hours and leave in the evenings

In the July 1888 WTT there were three GW express goods which came from Gresty Lane and terminated at Ordsall Lane with stops at Edgeley, Longsight and then via London Rd. Arrivals were at 2.30am, 6.20am and 8.55am, and departures from Ordsall Lane were at 8.25pm, 9.30pm and 11.5pm (all Mondays excepted).

In the October 1909 WTT, the arrivals were at 2.30am, 5.24am and 7.10 am. The 2.30 arrival would be routed by the Styal line if the special express goods from Gresty Lane to Leeds was running. (Although the special express goods is noted as starting from the GW yard at Crewe, it is not labelled in the timetable as a GW train.) The only departure listed was at 9.0pm (Saturdays excepted). On Saturdays the departure was still at 9pm, but it would pick up at Longsight and Heaton Norris if required. 

 

There is no indication of what happens to any of these trains on the other side of Gresty Lane.

 

This is all more information than is needed to help build models, but it all adds to the overall picture!

 

Tim Birch.

[Coal Tank]

Soooooo nice

[airnimal]

I said I didn't have any numberplates for this cattle wagon well ......

When looking at the photograph in LNWR wagons Vol 1 at this wagons to see how much lime wash was on the body I went through all the information and numbers that have been recorded and the first on the list was 934. That rang a bell in the old grey matter, so I went looking through my bits box. Sure enough I had just such a pair of that number. Also there is a tare weight listed so both these were fitted along with screw couplings. I have also painted the roof the same colour as the body.

Tomorrow I hope to paint  the roof a darker  colour and give it a good coating of lime wash providing the weather is kind and a bit warmer. Then it will be finished. 

[Compound2632]

3 minutes ago, airnimal said:

I said I didn't have any numberplates for this cattle wagon well ......

When looking at the photograph in LNWR wagons Vol 1 at this wagons to see how much lime wash was on the body I went through all the information and numbers that have been recorded and the first on the list was 934. That rang a bell in the old grey matter, so I went looking through my bits box. Sure enough I had just such a pair of that number.

 

Just goes to show that there has been a plan all along, even if you weren't aware of it.

 

On the brake block mounting, I felt sure from a mechanical point of view that there must have been iron pieces on both sides of the block but no, a look through LNWR Wagons Vol. 1 has convinced me there was only the one, on the outside face. Crude but presumably just sufficiently effective! The other day someone asked why there's more wood on the side of the bracket away from the wheel than on the wheel side - was it Bill @billbedford or Simon @Regularity? (It's the sort of awkward question either of them would ask.) Puzzles me but then I'm just a simple-minded Midland enthusiast.

[billbedford]

Just when I get something sewn up and done someone will come along and say it wasn't so...

 

I think I want to see more evidence of you startling brake block discovery. 

[Compound2632]

26 minutes ago, billbedford said:

Just when I get something sewn up and done someone will come along and say it wasn't so...

 

I think I want to see more evidence of you startling brake block discovery. 

 

I was startled too. The wooden brake block photos are in LNWR Wagons Vol. 1, in the D1 and D2 sections. Almost all are broadside on, so don't help. There's one, p. 58, taken from the non-brake side but the rear of the brake block is too much in shadow to draw any conclusion. So my case rests on the photo of 24945 on p. 59, which is taken at a bit of an angle - just sufficient, I think, to see that the bracket is on the outside only. Also the photo of D32 54895 on p. 10 of Vol. 2.  The Earlestown drawing of the D2 on pp. 64-65 is no help as there's no plan view of the brake gear. 

 

A representation of this in 4 mm scale would need etched brass for the bracket. I've been perfectly content with your printed version; my own plasticard attempts are cruder, resorting to a transverse support at the back. I can't quite se what Mike has done here and need to go back through the thread to look at his previous models.

[airnimal]

I am happy that the brake block is correct as modelled. I have copied the castings that came from Adrian Swain and would have used one if I had any left. I am aware that one should not make models of other models but most people would say Adrian was a stickler when it came to being accurate about details. One of the photographs is from the rear of  a brake shoe that came from ABS.

 

I have painted the roof a darker grey but as yet I haven't done the lime wash. 

If fact I have been to my youngest daughter school where she is a teacher. Some of the equipment has been damaged and was being thrown away that just needed some small repairs costing very little in monetary terms but just a bit of attention.  

Edited May 22, 2021 by airnimal

[Caley Jim]

Pages 82 and 84 of Mike Willaims' book on CR wagons have GA drawings of 7T mineral 'bogies' which show the brake blocks as hidden lines on the plan views.  Both confirm that the strap was only on the outside of the block in the way Mike has modelled it.

 

Jim