S7 scratch building

[Dave Hunt]

1 minute ago, Western Star said:

Mike,

 

I am not sure what you mean by "disguising" the join...  given the period when this tank body was built I expect that the top / sides were held together by rivets through inside angle iron (or similar) hence a join between top and side was visible with an appearance just like that shown in the last photo of your most recent post.

 

regards, Graham

 

Agreed. If you look at some preserved locomotives, tenders, wagons etc. they would make the joints on Mike's tank seem to be the epitome of neatness.

 

Dave

[Tricky]

3 hours ago, Dave Hunt said:

Mike, what do you use for drilling all those holes - a drill obviously but what make and is it mounted in a Dremel, hand held pin chuck etc. Just drilling all the holes for the Masterclub bolts and rivets in plastic for my match wagon was bad enough but to do hundreds of them in metal.....

 

Dave

My life just got shorter thinking about it…!

[airnimal]

The men in white coats are at the door carrying with them a coat with very long sleeves in my size !

Agreed it is a bit mad but we all do daft things now and again it just that I do daft things all the time. 

 

If I had embossed the rivets perfectly then I would have just soldered the tank together as normal and wouldn't have had to go to the trouble of using Masterclub rivets. But a few wayward rivets and a poor join left me with little choice but to go down this route. 

 

Dave, the holes are drilled with a hand held Mincraft drill. I have broken 3 drills so far but my stock of small drills are getting very blunt. I have also had to order more rivets from Historex.  

 

When I get the other side on I will have to see how well the ends are going to fit because the side plates have stretched by a small amount.  This may make the fitting interesting and bad language may be forthcoming and it could all end in tears.

 

 

[Dave Hunt]

Mike, that looks very realistic to me and I would be more than happy with it. I admire your work with the Minicraft as I use one of those myself and to drill that number of holes whilst breaking only three drills is an achievement. I'd probably use a few dozen and fail to produce such a neat job. Which make of drills do you use?

 

Dave

[Western Star]

1 hour ago, Dave Hunt said:

Mike, that looks very realistic to me and I would be more than happy with it.  ... to drill that number of holes whilst breaking only three drills is an achievement. I'd probably use a few dozen and fail to produce such a neat job.

I do not generally do "me too" posts...  this is a rare exception because the most recent post from Mike shows a very realistic appearance to the join between top and side.  I am waiting with anticipation to see the result.

 

regards, Graham

[airnimal]

Dave, you asked about what drills I use.  Just standard drills from the likes of Squires or Eilleen's.

Someone did recommend a source a few pages back but with my memory is so bad I cannot remember now. 

 

Anyway I have tacked the other side on before I run the solder down the full length.  

Of course the solder fills the holes upon some of the holes which means drilling them out again but solder is a lot easier to drill than nickel.  I have propped the end on see how far out it will be because the side have stretched a few thou which will need dressing back without making a mess of the holes on the ends. 

Edited July 28, 2021 by airnimal

[airnimal]

The first end has gone on with a small amount of cutting back the sides by a few thou.

I am pleased with this end now , just got to do the other end as good and the rest of the wagon should be a doddle. 

[airnimal]

A small amount of progress with the basic frame made. I have made it so the tank clips over a couple of lengths of Evergreen strip. I don't think there will be a lot more done for a awhile because there is mutterings of helping out at our daughter's school again with decorating been mentioned again. 

[Dave Hunt]

Looks to me like another stunningly good piece of work in the making Mike. I knew that you were a master of plastic but your metalwork is also a joy to behold.

 

Dave

[Tricky]

Beautifully bonkers!!

[airnimal]

Blimey my head won't fit through the door with all this praise.  But many thanks for that all the same. 

 

I don't like working with metal at all, I find it gets my hands dirty as well as the work bench. 

I must prefer plastic. Clean and easy to work.  Perhaps I had a bad experience as a child or something else I am unaware of. 

 

I have done a small amount this morning while the boss is sleeping but I have had instructions to wake her at 8.30 to see what she has plans for me today. I better get a move on looking at the time !

Edited July 29, 2021 by airnimal

[airnimal]

All the brown points earned yesterday have been used up today because I have got out of going to our daughter's school. My good lady has gone instead leaving me to modelling time again.  

 

So I have put the stanchions on with the help of a little jig. It is starting to look like a tank wagon now. 

[NeilHB]

Lovely work Mike - coming along very nicely! 

[airnimal]

I took the opportunity to crack on with the W-irons and wheels when things were quite.  

When I came to see how the nameplate fitted I was horrified to find that it overlapped the solebars. Quick check against the drawing showed it was my mistake because I had assumed that the solebars would be the standard 11" high when they were in fact 12" high. 

The only thing to do other than start again was glue a strip of 20 thou Evergreen along the bottom of the solebars.  This is what I have done hoping that after cleaning up it won't show once painted.  

On time will tell. I made a set of jigs for the 8' 4" wheelbase the same as I have done for other wagons.  

I am not sure what  to do about the tank filler on top. I have played around with plastic tube but I'm not convinced my efforts so far are going to be good enough.  I found a brass casting in my bits box but it not the right sort or size, so the jury's still out on that one.

[Compound2632]

10 minutes ago, airnimal said:

When I came to see how the nameplate fitted I was horrified to find that it overlapped the solebars. Quick check against the drawing showed it was my mistake because I had assumed that the solebars would be the standard 11" high when they were in fact 12" high. 

 

While the solebars and headstocks of railway company wagons (at least those I'm most familiar with, Midland and L&NW) were usually 11" x 4½", the RCH 1887 specification drawings for private owners' wagons show 12" x 5" [A.J. Watts, Private Owner Wagons from the Ince Waggon & Ironworks Co. (HMRS, 1998)].

[airnimal]

I have cobbled together the brake gear from bits of etched parts in my bits box. There wasn't  really any other way because the brake gear is offset to one side. The V hanger is a solid piece that won't be found on any commercial parts etch so that was scratch built. The buffers are Peco parallel G.W.R. ones which are sold separately. I have used these on quite a few of my wagons minus the base plates. 

 

[airnimal]

Finally the brakegear is done. It is a bit unusual but that's  what attracted me to in the first place.

Hopefully now I get on with all the details before I get to fill in all the holes with Masterclub rivets. 

 

Other news is we are going for paint today for the dreaded deco...............

Never mind I did get to go on my bike the last 2 weekends, so I haven't done bad ! I even did a few hills and found a couple of new routes and tracks. 

[wagonman]

That brake gear is indeed unusual...

Edited August 4, 2021 by wagonman

[Compound2632]

Is the offset to compensate for the different angles of the push rods? I'd need to sit down with a damp towel round my head to work that out...

 

And what is the odd rod attached to that bracket on the solebar?

[Dave Hunt]

I can see how it works but why it works like that is beyond me. And I too am puzzled by the rod attached to the bracket.

 

Dave

[MarcD]

I have seen the offset brake arrangement before but the little vertical rod is a new one on me.  What is it for?

 

Marc

[airnimal]

Gentleman,  I am the same as you are to why the brakegear is like it is but that is what is on the drawing. I do have the photograph of this wagon in a Constructor some where in the loft but it would take forever to find it. I have just taken what was on the drawing and copied it. The only thing i would guess is the bar is some sort of support for the brake shaft.

[Compound2632]

As you've modelled it, Mike, there's only the triangular plate supporting the cross-shaft - although I wonder if there should in fact be a support for its inside end, that would be hidden from view in an elevation drawing? Otherwise it looks as if the mystery rod is supporting a bearing that helps hold the cross-shaft. 

 

What is the drawing? Is it an original works drawing or a "modeller's drawing"?

[airnimal]

Compound 2632, it is a modellers drawing from a favourite book by Len Tavender. Both books are full of drawings and information for use early modellers of the pre-grouping era. The wagon here is in the book on the right. I am sure there are mistakes and guesswork because of the subjects but without them I might not have attempted this wagon. I have not seen the photograph that the drawing was produced from for many years when about 40 years of MRN, Constructor, RM went into the loft. 

As you say there could be another plate similar to the one shown in the drawing behind the first one, but without any more information I don't think we will ever know.  The wagon in question could be about 130 years old if it was still around now.

I have come across so small errors in other wagon drawings from these books where I have found other information when doing my own research in Libraries but nothing that I am going bother about to much. 

 

[chris p bacon]

As our club is in the process of moving (eviction) we are clearing out lots of old books and files, one large box file contained at least a hundred wagon drawings which I am scanning as they are of railways such as the NSR, CR, Taff, MR, GN, GE, FR, L&Y, GNoS, SECR, Plus many others. 

I am currently working away from home but I'm happy to share what I have scanned when I return.

They are all from Modelling magazines, some from the 50's and the majority from the 60's. Whether the current wagon is in the pile I couldn't say.

 

As is usual with this thread it's modelling to a really high standard, superb