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Brighthelmstone Loco Works - Inspired by Brighton 1870's


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Hi Everyone!

 

Some people may remember a little while ago I posted a status talking about a baseboard I had built, a baseboard that needed to remain a secret as I was banned from having any more layouts! Well here is the idea.

 

When perusing the internet one evening learning about LB&SCR "stuff" I found myself looking at the Brighton Loco Works website and more precisely the top image on this page of Brighton works in 1871, which seemed to have a very modelable area for a photo plank. This was good as the area of Oak Hill I had planned to be used for photos unfortunately doesn't get very good light, however a small layout could be moved to where the light is good.

 

So which area of the picture are we talking about? This bit:

post-22762-0-88506900-1493708359_thumb.jpg

 

So what do we have here? We have a section of the works exterior with 2 sides surrounded by walls with what appears to be a filled in turntable at the open end. I decided I want the turntable to still be in use on my model and spent time planning how this could work, and with some help from a friend came up with this plan:

post-22762-0-35561200-1493708360_thumb.jpg

 

Now as I already have a baseboard, including backscene I could mock-up the layout, giving us the image below:

post-22762-0-33291300-1493708359_thumb.jpg

 

The backscene images are not necessarily to scale but they give a good impression of what I am after.

 

My plan will be to make this look like it is in the late Victorian period so the whole of the layout will be covered with ash, luckily I know someone who can get that for me.

 

The layout will only need 3 lengths of flexitrack and then lots of Plasticard so should be quite an easy build (he says). I plan on sratch building everything except the grounded bodys, I will use the ones in the photos for that.

 

I would love to have some feedback so please do let me know what you think of this project.

 

Thanks for looking, hope you enjoyed,

 

Gary

Edited by BlueLightning
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  The turn table might not be filled in especially at this early date it could just have the well boarded over which was not unknown at some works and even depots at this period.

 

  1871 seems very early in the grand scheme of things to be out of use plus looking on the picture its lined up with the middle road and it looks like the open wagon is on the nearer road so if the tables out of use how did that get there.

 

  At that date it would have been about a 45ft or no bigger than about a 50ft table even at a works as in 1871 the 4-4-0 was about as big as they come unless it was made big enough for a little 0-4-0 works shunter to be able to move dead locos around.

 

 If you are doing it about 1871 or even turn of the century the coaches would have to be about forty years ols so there designe must reflect that. Its no good using say the Ratio grounded coach body as in 1900 it would most likely been still in use.

 

Great idea though and like all your projects I look forward to seeing it progress.

                       

                                                                                                                      Steve

 

Edit add - looking again I don't think the well is filled in It might just be in shadow I might try and blow the picture up later.

 

Edit add two - No looking again I would still say the pit is boarded over. PS look at all those bird cage brakes in the foreground I can see at least six.

Edited by Londontram
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Thanks Steve,

 

Looking at the photo again I think you are right about the turntable I had looked at the photo and thought I could see a set of points joining the road with the wagon, clearly I was wrong, I can now see the end of the road on the turntable. I have planned it as a 40ft as all the turntables on The Brighton were relatively small.

 

I believe from looking at various photos from over time that the area I have was covered over by a building not too long into Stroudley's tenure as CME and I think this may be the only picture showing it outside. If someone could now come and prove me wrong and provide some more pictures that would be great!!

 

As for the carriages I have used they are just ones I had lying around to fill the scene. I would like something more accurate, but as this is designed to be a cheap build that can be done while the misses is at work I think I shall stick with altering what I have, for the time being at least. Unless someone has some Craven era carriages they want to part with on the cheap :jester: .

 

I will most likely cut a section out of the middle of the wagon as per the one I am doing for Oak Hill as they are quite similar to a Brighton design when done.

 

Gary

Edited by BlueLightning
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That is a very good question Steve. I haven't really considered this as anything more than somewhere to take pictures of my stock. Which as can be seen on Oak Hill ranges from the introduction of the Terriers in 1872 upto my L Class that I am building which rolled out the works in 1922!! so somewhere in that range!

 

My main plan was "Late Victorian" so towards the end of the 1800's possibly turn of the century, but I hadn't put a huge amount more thought than that into it.

 

Gary

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Great idea.  Depending upon how accurate you want to be, most of those grounded coaches are identified in Volume One of the 4 & 6-wheel coach book, and drawings are provided. For instance, the left-hand coach, in the corner formed by the buildings, is a Parliamentary coach of c.1845.  The 3 long objects next to it at right angles are carriage roofs.

 

I assume you are familiar with this site: http://www.brightonlocoworks.co.uk/old-photos-of-the-engineering-works-exterior.php

 

I have not been able to find a clearer view of the TT, but would concur with Steve; probably boarded.

 

There is always a danger that grounded coach bodies on layouts are too modern.  Most coaches lasted 30-40 years.  The Great Eastern was very fond of using grounded coach bodies for stations, but, in the 1900s, these would be 1860s coaches, nothing as modern as, for instance, the Ratio Grounded Coach Body kit, which is based upon their GW coaches of the 1890s.

 

Castle Aching will use Wright coaches of the 1850s as grounded bodies.  So, for a Brighton layout set, say, 1870-1900, pre-Craven coaches would be perfectly sensible, and I see that a couple of the bodies are 1830s style, which sets the right tone, I think.    

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Thanks James,

 

All very helpful info. I really must get that book at some point! I had assumed the long objects were carriage roofs however I had no further info but I did have some carriage bodies in stock. I wonder if I can make the ratio carriage look more "Craven" in style even if I just use the roof!

 

Gary

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Highbridge offers a nice compact works and the track layout, with some photos, are available in Judge & Potts An historical survey of the S&DJR.

post-14351-0-24104400-1493741491_thumb.jpg

Edited by phil_sutters
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James that image is absolutely brilliant!! Just the sort of detail I need

 

Phil images like that are the reason I was even looking at loco works sites. What beautiful locos and such a nice setting, however it is a scene I don't think I have ever seen modelled and it gives me the perfect excuse for my locos to appear ex-works in the images!!

 

Gary

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Guest Midland Mole

Yet more of your work I will enjoy following. Great idea and should look marvellous when finished. :)

 

Alex

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I really like the idea of this, a nice little cameo layout, just somewhere to have stock. What's the size Gary?

 

Andy g

 

Thanks Andy, it is 3' by 11.5" just small enough small enough to be hidden under Oak Hill along with all my tools!!

 

Yet more of your work I will enjoy following. Great idea and should look marvellous when finished. :)

 

Alex

 

Thanks Alex, I hope it looks marvellous when it's done. That's why I show it to RMWeb, all you wonderful people that can tell me what I'm doing wrong to make sure it does!!!

 

Gary

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James that image is absolutely brilliant!! Just the sort of detail I need

 

Phil images like that are the reason I was even looking at loco works sites. What beautiful locos and such a nice setting, however it is a scene I don't think I have ever seen modelled and it gives me the perfect excuse for my locos to appear ex-works in the images!!

 

Gary

I am pleased it hit the spot. Here are a couple of photos of the outside, way after the works closed and not long before the whole line was axed. If it helps I can pm you the track plans.

Edit - of course to get the whole works!?! you could buy or borrow Colin Maggs slim volume 'Highbridge in its heyday.' It has photos of most departments, locos, workers and track plans ++ - copies on Amazon from £4.99 to £13.00.

post-14351-0-82355900-1493747758_thumb.jpg

post-14351-0-09372000-1493747760_thumb.jpg

Edited by phil_sutters
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Those are some nice images Phil. I think I have a 2MT around somewhere. You lot will get me in serious trouble with all this temptation you know!!

 

Gary

Thanks Gary

There's more! http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/album/4076-sdjr-somerset-central-burnham-to-evercreech-junction/

Colin Maggs book is a really good source of details for a small loco works. Highbridge only built one loco, one of the Radstock shunters, but as you can see they could strip down 4-4-0 and 0-6-0 tender engines and tanks and rebuild them. There were carriage and wagon building shops alongside. They even had their own photographic facilities and a small gas works.

Paul Townsend has been building a very impressive finescale model of Highbridge station, which ends with the works more or less as a back drop. https://www.scalefour.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1867

I am working on a diorama of a much condensed Highbridge Wharf, on which I will be able to park my 50-year-old SDJR rolling stock, eventually. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/album/4186-the-highbridge-wharf-project/

Edited by phil_sutters
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James that image is absolutely brilliant!! Just the sort of detail I need

 

Gary

 

And now you have a 4mm scale drawing of same!

 

 

Thanks Gary

There's more! http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/album/4076-sdjr-somerset-central-burnham-to-evercreech-junction/

Colin Maggs book is a really good source of details for a small loco works. Highbridge only built one loco, one of the Radstock shunters, but as you can see they could strip down 4-4-0 and 0-6-0 tender engines and tanks and rebuild them. There were carriage and wagon building shops alongside. They even had their own photographic facilities and a small gas works.

Paul Townsend has been building a very impressive finescale model of Highbridge station, which ends with the works more or less as a back drop. https://www.scalefour.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1867

I am working on a diorama of a much condensed Highbridge Wharf, on which I will be able to park my 50-year-old SDJR rolling stock, eventually. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/album/4186-the-highbridge-wharf-project/

 

Seems to me that Highbridge could provide inspiration for the West Norfolk's version of Melton Constable.  A nice little plank to operate separately from CA?

 

Thanks, Phil, I'll have to investigate the literature.

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Highbridge Works, I have the foreman's swivel chair,

rescued from the works as we (I was on the M5 RE's Staff) started to set out the Motorway etc.,.

Beautiful mahogany. 

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Highbridge Works, I have the foreman's swivel chair,

rescued from the works as we (I was on the M5 RE's Staff) started to set out the Motorway etc.,.

Beautiful mahogany. 

Can you see yourself here or on the other two shots taken around the same time in the M5 fly-ash era - http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/image/76422-m5-spur-6606-6985-empty-flyash-hoppers-from-m5-spur-10-7-71/

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So the secret project continues,

 

Most of my modelling has consisted spending money!! in this case 3 lengths of Peco Bullhead rail and as this is the first time I have seen it up close I must say it looks bl00dy impressive!

 

So impressive in fact that when I put it on the layout I couldn't help but to get some locos out and have a photo session:

post-22762-0-38770300-1494357363_thumb.jpg

 

You will also notice in the picture above I have painted the "Rocket" carriages into Brighton colours and they do look remarkably similar to the "4 wheel three compartment First (type 2)" as seen on the 5 and 9 models website I am certainly happy using these!

 

However thanks to James (Edwardian) I will be replacing the Ration GWR carriage with the actual prototype from the original image of Brighton Works, I have begun work on this today:

post-22762-0-95873600-1494357369_thumb.jpg

 

This should give the scene a much more realistic look and I am looking forward to getting it finished and in place!

 

Thanks for looking, hope you enjoyed,

 

Gary

Edited by BlueLightning
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So the secret project continues,

 

Most of my modelling has consisted spending money!! in this case 3 lengths of Peco Bullhead rail and as this is the first time I have seen it up close I must say it looks bl00dy impressive!

 

So impressive in fact that when I put it on the layout I couldn't help but to get some locos out and have a photo session:

attachicon.giftrack.jpg

 

You will also notice in the picture above I have painted the "Rocket" carriages into Brighton colours and they do look remarkably similar to the "4 wheel three compartment First (type 2)" as seen on the 5 and 9 models website I am certainly happy using these!

 

However thanks to James (Edwardian) I will be replacing the Ration GWR carriage with the actual prototype from the original image of Brighton Works, I have begun work on this today:

attachicon.gifcarriage.jpg

 

This should give the scene a much more realistic look and I am looking forward to getting it finished and in place!

 

Thanks for looking, hope you enjoyed,

 

Gary

 

Top banana!

 

I am also looking forward to seeing it complete.

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