Colour Light Signalling for Model Railways (Out Now)

[St. Simon]

Not wishing to be unhelpful, but I think you might have a minor challenge on your hands here, because relatively few people seem to want to build models set in the ‘modern signalling era’, it might be that the dull efficiency of modern operations is part of the reason, which means that there are fewer archetypal model railway layouts.

 

A modern BLT, on the archetypal single track branch, is likely to consist of not much more than a single track with a platform and a train arrestor (=buffer stops), with no visible signalling beyond some fixed signage. ‘Minories’ is an absolute must. It might also be worth doing a multi-platform through station, with some roads signalled for bi-directional working, because that seems fairly popular as a modern layout concept, and a double line to single line, single-lead junction, which can be used for several different purposes (branchline, bay platform, lay-by loop). One of those odd places where a freight-only line continues beyond the limits of the passenger railway might be interesting too, Aylesbury Vale, or Coombe. Probably also the entry/exit from an MPD, which definitely is a popular them, and the entry/exit to a set of sidings, the sort of thing that could be an intermodal freight terminal or an engineer’s yard.

 

In fact, just throw in a a big fold-out signalling diagram for the Chiltern Railways routes between Marylebone and the West Midlands, including the Aylesbury area; they contain pretty much all that and more. Even a couple of interfacing preservation operations. Start here http://www.opentraintimes.com/maps/signalling/me_1 and continue to Oxford and Birmingham.

 

Hi Nearholmer,

 

No, it's not unhelpful, I know that Modern Layouts are disliked, but this won't be a book purely for 2000's onwards, it'll be for the colour light era from when colour lights become the majority rather than the minority, so BR Blue, Sectorisation, Privatisation etc. I won't be concentrating on multiple unit operation, I will consider loco-hauled stock and freight operations. Even in my day to day work, there is still a lot of variety and interest we have to cater for, which makes for some quite interesting arrangements. I've already drawn and signalled the Minories layout, so that's one off the list!

 

I like the idea of using the Chiltern Line as a Template actually, my parents live half way between High Wycombe and Great Missenden, so I have lots of personal experience of it, plus it'll be easy to go out and photograph!

 

I'm thinking of using the following places as examples:

 

• Bourne End / Marlow Branches
• Reading (or at least a scale down version) / Bristol Temple Meads 
• Workingham
• Aylesbury

But I'm sure there's lots more interesting examples (that aren't in my area!) that I could use.

 

Simon

[Nearholmer]

Banbury is very good, and the junctions north of Oxford to illustrate practice, Princes Risborough with a branchline bay on either side, all those military connections at Bicester. I think I’ve made my point.

[St. Simon]

Hi,

 

I'm a little stuck, I've just started the section on Route Indicators, and I'm having trouble with how to present the information.

 

The problem is that there is a lot of options and rules surrounding the use of route indicators, which will require explaining. Now, I could just write and write about the rules and options or I could put it all in loads of tables (much like our standards) or even a decison flow chart, but how would you guys like it to be presented?

 

I know that people say "show us some examples Simon!", but I think it be best to go over the rules and options and then show how it is applied to layouts.

 

Simon

[PaulRhB]

I think a decision chart would be best. It needs to be simple to follow rather than deciphering tables. There will be those who want an all singing installation and will study exact tables but if you want to sell a few the primary market is the so called average modeller who wants a plausible setup that they understand and what indications it should show.

[St. Simon]

Hi,

 

Thanks guys, a flow chart it is, I'll have a look at the NR one tomorrow and see how I can simplify it (it's quite complex!).

 

Simon

[cal.n]

Look forward to seeing the book. Sounds great so far.

 

An old theatre indicator at Preston used to read ‘FU’ for the Up Fast line when all others were ‘Direction - Speed’ (e.g. UF). Apparently was switched by an S+T crew who had a spare hour during a track possession.

[St. Simon]

Look forward to seeing the book. Sounds great so far.

An old theatre indicator at Preston used to read ‘FU’ for the Up Fast line when all others were ‘Direction - Speed’ (e.g. UF). Apparently was switched by an S+T crew who had a spare hour during a track possession.

That sounds like a pre-planned prank, quite hard to change the indication without changing the whole head.

 

Simon

[The Stationmaster]

Hi,

 

I'm a little stuck, I've just started the section on Route Indicators, and I'm having trouble with how to present the information.

 

The problem is that there is a lot of options and rules surrounding the use of route indicators, which will require explaining. Now, I could just write and write about the rules and options or I could put it all in loads of tables (much like our standards) or even a decison flow chart, but how would you guys like it to be presented?

 

I know that people say "show us some examples Simon!", but I think it be best to go over the rules and options and then show how it is applied to layouts.

 

Simon

 

One way is to build it up the way the real principles were built up (and changed).  Plenty of logic there if you tease it out a bit - JIs and theatres are fairly straightforward but there is a big problem with stencil style indicators which might be best dealt with separately.

[St. Simon]

Hi,

Right, got past my 'writers block' on Route Indicators. 

 

Now the word count is over 13,500 words!

 

Simon

[phil-b259]

That sounds like a pre-planned prank, quite hard to change the indication without changing the whole head.

 

Simon

 

Not really Simon - you are forgetting that before the widespread adoption of LED / Fibre optics we had to rely on backlit stencils (which could be replaced relatively easily) or multiple lamps in Theatre type indicators.

 

For the multi lamp type, many used individual pygmy filament lamps whose holders which were inserted into a square steel sheet full of holes in the necessary pattern to create the characters needed (Thus meaning only a single design of Theatre box was required that could be wired up as required to suit the local conditions).  Different sets of lamps would be grouped together (wired up in parallel within the group) depending on whether they were required to be lit for only one indication or whether they needed to be illuminated for two or more different characters (i.e. the number '2' and the number '3' would end up both using certain groups of lamps.

 

Look closely at this example (W311 signal) http://www.railsigns.uk/photos/p_route1/p_route1.html and you can quite clearly see the holes inside the indicator that have not been fitted with lamps. You can also make out what looks like a colum of unlit lamps on the left hand side plus some heading diagonally downwards from the left hand corner. These are likely to be part of a series of lamps making up the letter M

 

Of course if the route indicator was fitted with lamp proving then a further consideration when deciding how to wire up the lamps would be how many were essential to give the driver a satisfactory indication of the intended route - while at the same time also taking into account that the numeral '3' requires more lamps (and thus draw more current*) to be alight than a numeral '1' and a 'dumb' electromechanical current sensing relay cannot suddenly tell itself 'OK the signal is now displaying 2 yellows or the number 3 so I need to adjust my current sensing capabilities).

 

Many years ago I was given the task of rewiring the internal wires on just such a multi lamp theatre indicator at Redhill - but despite my best efforts i still got in a muddle and miss- wired things resulting in either blown fuses or some rather odd patterns appearing instead of popper letters (Should have given the options of 'T', 'M' and 'R')

 

However this episode proves is that it is quite possible for  sufficiently skilled tech to swap round Letters should they wish to with no need to replace the equipment....

 

* Note, on areas which still use relay based interlocking with 4 aspect signalling, we do NOT lamp prove the top yellow due to the limitations of the aforementioned current sensing relays. This was done to cut down on the amount of wiring and relays needed thus saving money, plus reducing the amount of equipment that could failing but also recognises that although the driver might require a change of underpants, the safety of trains is not compromised (i.e. there is no difference with respect to the amount of braking distance the train has available). Therefore in such areas if the top yellow lamp fails completely (which could of course also include the LED module where a conversion of the signal head has taken place but everything else trackside stays the same) a driver can encounter a G-Y-Y-R sequence instead of a G-YY-Y-R one. Obviously on modern computer based interlockings where equipment is fed directly from data modules, lamp proving can easily be provided on all tsignal aspects / indicators

Edited May 24, 2018 by phil-b259

[St. Simon]

Hi,

 

This is what 20,000 words on signalling looks like:

 

 

Yes, I know it's unreadable, but I thought I'd show you the actual progress being made! As you can see the Route Indicator Flow chart will be included as an Appendix, this may be joined by another flow chart to decide the junction signalling types

 

I'm nearing the end of the big 'wordy' sections of the book, I just have a couple more chapters to do, I'll then get those checked and proof read whilst I start drawing up layouts and examples to fill the rest out.

 

Simon

[St. Simon]

Hi,

 

Right, a nice quiet stay in a Derby Hotel over the past couple of weeks whilst I attend a training course has seen me finish the first draft of technical sections of the book (Chapters 1 to 8) as well as Chapter 13 on train protection systems. Although, this does exclude ATP and I haven't quite finished the words on track design. I've had to add a few chapters and sections from original contents as I realised I had missed some things, so here is the new contents:

 

Contents 14_06_18.pdf

 

It is now a case of printing it off and proof reading it, before first handing it over to some colleagues of mine to check and then I'll hand it on to some very knowledgeable people to rip to shreds!.

 

It's taken a lot of work so far, and just to give you an idea there are, so far:

 

• 29,799 words - some of which I might be have the correct spelling!
• 116 pages
• 71 images and diagrams (all of which I have taken or created)
• 10 tables

Obviously this will all increase, but now the focus will be on getting layouts and examples drawn up whilst the technical content is being checked (I'm not quite sure how long that will take!).

 

Simon

 

[St. Simon]

Hi,

Right, all done!

 

Well, not quite, I've now finished the first draft of the 'technical' bits of the book:

 

 

It is now up to just under 50,000 words and 180 pages. 

 

Whilst it is no where near publishable, I'm now ready to get the technical bits of it checked for both accuracy, readability and grammar (and I think we all know the last is the most important with me!).

 

Whilst I'm doing this, I will start drawing up and writing about layout examples, however, before I do I have a question:

 

• Should the layout examples be broken up into full layouts (i.e. a single layout showing stations, junctions, yards etc. that can be taken straight out and made into a model railway) or be broken up into different elements (i.e. separate diagrams for a station, yards, junctions etc. that the modeller can stitch together as required)?

Plus, whilst I'm in the question mood, here's another:

• Whilst I have written a small section about creating interlockings and control panels, I have yet to go into great detail. I feel this is probably worth a book by itself, would this be something that people would be interested in?

Answers here, or on my blog: https://sjpmodels.wordpress.com/2018/07/02/modern-railway-signalling-an-update/

Simon

[The Stationmaster]

I'm more inclined towards the splitting up of layout examples - very much for the reason quoted as No1 by 'Dutch Master'.  However there is a problem in doing that and it comes with relating one but to other bits, I found it not too difficult to do with semaphore signalling but I fully understood where I was coming from (as you do too of course) and the problem is that the reader might not quite grasp where you are coming from.

 

I think know it can be done but it might require additional words of explanation (and steer well clear ofa. succession of dicvergences involving flashing yellows on several signals and even the odd PRI thrown in - we had enough trouble trying to sort that for a real junction during a SPAD Risk Assessment session.

[St. Simon]

 

1. Do NOT underestimate the stupidity of modelers people. When presented with a plan ready to plonk onto a layout, there'll be scores who'll cry foul: "but my layout is different!"
2. Also, do NOT overestimate modelers ability to see beyond what's on paper. "I've build it as per your instructions but how does it tie in with the rest of my layout?"
3. The control panel section might indeed warrant part 2 of the series

 

 

 

I'm more inclined towards the splitting up of layout examples - very much for the reason quoted as No1 by 'Dutch Master'.  However there is a problem in doing that and it comes with relating one but to other bits, I found it not too difficult to do with semaphore signalling but I fully understood where I was coming from (as you do too of course) and the problem is that the reader might not quite grasp where you are coming from.

 

I think know it can be done but it might require additional words of explanation (and steer well clear ofa. succession of dicvergences involving flashing yellows on several signals and even the odd PRI thrown in - we had enough trouble trying to sort that for a real junction during a SPAD Risk Assessment session.

 

Hi,

 

You are both correct and having the exact same thoughts as I was.

 

My thinking is that I create a 'master layout' that includes everything I want to cover and then break it up into chunks, so that it can be combined or separated as required and then I can relate to things across examples rather than try and squeeze everything on one piece of A4.

 

Of course, that is my other issue, fitting it into a book and make the layout readable. Any people with publishing / writing experience have views on this?

 

Simon

Edited July 3, 2018 by St. Simon

[njee20]

Don't have fold outs or anything, they'll be unnecessarily complex. Just do as you say - "master" view, with detailed areas broken out in subsequent sections.

 

If you can't make a diagram work on a sheet of A4 paper then it's too complex.

[corneliuslundie]

It is possible to include tip-ins (where one edge of the sheet is glued to a page or the inside back cover) or fold outs but both are expensive and the latter will constrain book design as they can only be included at certain points. Tip-ins can be quite large and folded into two or four, but as stated above are prone to being torn. And remember that the sheet has to fold to a size smaller than the page size.

Therefore my recommendation is to keep any diagrams to the size of a single page.

Which means that now is the time to decide on the page size. It is possible to reduce or enlarge a drawing to fit a page but different formats, such as A4 and American Letter, have different proportions and there is also the margin to think about – both the outside edge and at the spine if it is a thick book.

If you have a publisher in mind now is the time to talk about such things as most publishers have their favoured formats. If you are self publishing it is probably time to talk to a friendly book printer.

The HMRS uses Amadeus Press for its printing. They are not the cheapest but are very helpful and are involved with a lot of railway publishers.

Jonathan

[St. Simon]

Hi,

 

I've been thinking about these layouts, and I'm not sure how I can split it up easily specially when we are talking stations. At the moment, I'm looking at basing the layouts on old IRSE Exam layouts, as they are suitably model railway like, but are there classic layouts that people would like to see?

 

The only one I can come up with (that would work in a modern colour light sense) is Minories, but presumably a BLT etc. is needed?

 

I like the idea of using the Chiltern lines as a base, but I don't know how well these fit in model railway terms?

 

Got any ideas?

 

Simon

Edited July 10, 2018 by St. Simon

[The Stationmaster]

Hi,

 

I've been thinking about these layouts, and I'm not sure how I can split it up easily specially when we are talking stations. At the moment, I'm looking at basing the layouts on old IRSE Exam layouts, as they are suitably model railway like, but are there classic layouts that people would like to see?

 

The only one I can come up with (that would work in a modern colour light sense) is Minories, but presumably a BLT etc. is needed?

 

I like the idea of using the Chiltern lines as a base, but I don't know how well these fit in model railway terms?

 

Got any ideas?

 

Simon

 

I don't think you'll find too many BLTs with colour light signals nowadays and any that do exist will have very simple track layouts and little in the way of signals. (all we have here is a Distant board, and it replaced a 2 aspect (R/Y) stop signal, plus a 2 aspect (R/G) 'starter'.   The latter is of considerable interest as it is a 1960s standard WR straight post signal which was rel;ocated in the 1970s and received an LED signal head a few years back under the TVSC scheme.

 

Minories would be a far better example, as a busy urban terminus, to signal to current standards with colour lights.   I think using the Chiltern Lines is not a bad idea, the signalling is almost contemporary and the track layouts are modern simplicity, and i'm sure I can guess where you might find some drawings to act as a starting point for your illustrations

[St. Simon]

Hi Mike,

 

Right, I'll go and start drawing them tonight, it'll get me away from the dam football!

 

Simon

[St. Simon]

Hi,

 

Well, I've made some progress on stuff, I have received some feedback from two of my colleagues, both experienced signalling designers and railway modellers. Most of their feedback related to...can you guess...spelling and grammar, with only minor technical details needing to be corrected. However, the major feedback has been I needed to re-write the history chapter (which is kind of what I was expecting to do), and with help of a very good book recently published by a friend over at Siemens, it is a lot better than my first attempt.

 

Also, I found I hadn't covered actually how to go about converting all the technical content into a model railway signalling system, so I have now added that section in.

 

Whilst I have been waiting on feedback (from some modelling friends and those in the publishing industry) I have been trying to draw up some layouts, trying to take on the comments in this thread. This has been tricky. 

 

I've discovered that it won't be possible to just focus on sections of layouts, as this would simply confuse everyone and be difficult to write. I've also discovered it is very difficult fitting in layouts into A4 (or A3) and make them readable, although this is less of an issue. So what I have done is home in on some popular exhibition layouts / real life examples to cover the common layout types, so far I have drawn out and signalled the following:

 

• Minories - A typical terminus layout
• Black County Blues - For a freight / exchange yard
• Twelve Trees Junction - A nice double junction
• A large (very large) through station based on Reading / Bristol Temple Meads / London Bridge
• A variation on Princes Risborough - To use as a layout to showcase interface between a Heritage railway and the National Network

I'm using planning to do:

 

• A typical TMD (possibly based on Fishterton Sarum)
• Norwood Road / West Croydon (my own exhibition layout)
• A typical country station with a passing loop
• Possibly briefly look at a single line branch

Is there anything I haven't covered which people want or think I should be? Or is there a more suitable layout for any of the above?

 

My reasoning behind using real exhibition layouts is that I can use images (I will be approaching the relevant people soon) to explain certain things and use the actual layout operational requirements to explain on the diagram.

 

Simon

Edited August 11, 2018 by St. Simon

[The Stationmaster]

Simon - one thing you might like to think about, although it could add complexity, is to include or make available a dvd using the same track layouts and allowing them to be enlarged.

[St. Simon]

Simon - one thing you might like to think about, although it could add complexity, is to include or make available a dvd using the same track layouts and allowing them to be enlarged.

 

Hi Mike,

 

Hmm, I hadn't thought of that, or possibly even host them on my blog and provide a link in the book?

 

I have thought about having two books, one with the technical content and one in a bookazine style with the layouts in them.

 

Simon

[The Stationmaster]

Hi Mike,

 

Hmm, I hadn't thought of that, or possibly even host them on my blog and provide a link in the book?

 

I have thought about having two books, one with the technical content and one in a bookazine style with the layouts in them.

 

Simon

 

The big problem with books is the question of number of pages driving up costs = driving up prices.  With a modelling book this can get even worse and fold outs in a bookazine will probably cost even more.  If you've got the prototype:modelling balance right, and that is probably the biggest trick to get right with signalling, ideally I would go for a single volume provided you can keep the retail price at a sensible level - and remember books about signalling probably sell fewer copies than books about locos.

 

As you won't get in decent size drawings (or probably won't) for signalled track layouts I'd be more inclined to put the detailed 'blow ups of those drawings in a separate medium if you can make that work.  What that might also allow - depending again on cost/disc capacity etc - is even although you to backdate from current national standards to past Regional standards on signalling detail - for example I can thing of at least four different ways 'Black Country Blues' would have been signalled and even three different ways the same BR Region would have signalled it had teh scheme been designed over a period of less than 20 years!

[St. Simon]

The big problem with books is the question of number of pages driving up costs = driving up prices.  With a modelling book this can get even worse and fold outs in a bookazine will probably cost even more.  If you've got the prototype:modelling balance right, and that is probably the biggest trick to get right with signalling, ideally I would go for a single volume provided you can keep the retail price at a sensible level - and remember books about signalling probably sell fewer copies than books about locos.

 

As you won't get in decent size drawings (or probably won't) for signalled track layouts I'd be more inclined to put the detailed 'blow ups of those drawings in a separate medium if you can make that work.  What that might also allow - depending again on cost/disc capacity etc - is even although you to backdate from current national standards to past Regional standards on signalling detail - for example I can thing of at least four different ways 'Black Country Blues' would have been signalled and even three different ways the same BR Region would have signalled it had teh scheme been designed over a period of less than 20 years!

You are quite right with the comments on prices Mike, having done some very basic research (actually about getting a first draft professionally printed), I would imagine it would be the £20 mark. I'm thinking that I'll put in detailed extracts of the most interesting parts of each plan to combat the readability of the whole thing.

 

My thinking behind my approach to signalling the layouts is to provide just an introduction to the most common ways of signalling a layout and to introduce the basic concepts rather than going into hundreds of different variations.

 

Simon