Ready to plant buildings

[NHY 581]

Like many on here, I have benefitted from Kernow's Ltd Edition ready to plant buildings courtesy of their collaboration with Bachmann.

 

We often see wishlists for locos and rolling stock but what of buildings.

 

Kernow have led the way in terms of retailer commisions.

 

I know I have a personal wishlist of what I consider to be attractive prototypes. No pressure or presumption but what do others think?

 

Would this be of use to Kernow?

 

My would likes centre around the L&SWR........

 

Another run of Boscastle ground frame.

 

Wenford Bridge Goods depot office.

 

Pencarrow Wood stream fed water crane thingy.

 

A typical ground level signal box, Lyme Regis ( I know its in Dorset) sort of jobby.

 

A pack of typical L&SWR ' barley twist' swan neck platform lamps.......and typical station nameboards

 

I am of course mindful that Kernow are a retailer and I hope they won't mind if I say not in possession of infinate resources but are yhe above worth considering in the future?

 

Rob.

[Les1952]

Looking at the stand Kernow had at the GCR (just along the tent wall from us) it seemed there were a significant number of the existing r-t-p models waiting to find buyers.

 

Perhaps there is a limit to the number of people like me who can plant Helston engine shed in a North eastern colliery....

 

Les

[autocoach]

Like many on here, I have benefitted from Kernow's Ltd Edition ready to plant buildings courtesy of their collaboration with Bachmann.

 

We often see wishlists for locos and rolling stock but what of buildings.

 

Kernow have led the way in terms of retailer commisions.

 

I know I have a personal wishlist of what I consider to be attractive prototypes. No pressure or presumption but what do others think?

 

Would this be of use to Kernow?

 

My would likes centre around the L&SWR........

 

Another run of Boscastle ground frame.

 

Wenford Bridge Goods depot office.

 

Pencarrow Wood stream fed water crane thingy.

 

A typical ground level signal box, Lyme Regis ( I know its in Dorset) sort of jobby.

 

A pack of typical L&SWR ' barley twist' swan neck platform lamps.......and typical station nameboards

 

I am of course mindful that Kernow are a retailer and I hope they won't mind if I say not in possession of infinate resources but are yhe above worth considering in the future?

 

Rob.

I will second/third/forth on the swan neck platform lamps. 

 

• DCC concepts green swan neck lamps aside from being an LMS prototype would do fine if I modeled in 7 mm scale. And they never came with the DCC Concepts barley twist base. I bought a set of 3 but have never tried to use them. They are just too gross (in the German  meaning.)

• My Langley pot metal swan neck lamps tend to droop after a few years and snap off. Last I looked they were no longer available and I am out of replacements.

 

And while Kernow is at it, how about a North Cornwall stone station, right hand version for me (waiting room on the right viewed from the platform side), so I can retire the paper version I created about 7 years ago. Would weigh a ton and cost as much as the building for shipping to this far distant shore.

 

I know it is all too much to ask.  But, if we don't ask no one will know our heart's desires.....

Edited July 2, 2017 by autocoach

['CHARD]

I always thought that the photogenic bridge across Little Petherick creek, on the approach to Padstow, would make the most delightful kit....

[autocoach]

I always thought that the photogenic bridge across Little Petherick creek, on the approach to Padstow, would make the most delightful kit....

I have three Airfix/Dapol kits waiting in storage should I ever find the room to build this wonderful curved bridge.  I have also toyed with adapting the much finer plastic bridge components from the US manufacturer Central Valley as an alternative. 

[The Johnster]

Looking at the stand Kernow had at the GCR (just along the tent wall from us) it seemed there were a significant number of the existing r-t-p models waiting to find buyers.

 

Perhaps there is a limit to the number of people like me who can plant Helston engine shed in a North eastern colliery....

 

Les

 

My South Wales BLT, 'inspired by' Abergwynfi, has a station building made of a cut-and-shut repainted pair of Hornby Skaledale resin NER ones with a home made roof featuring Wills valances.  At that rate, the cosmic balance will not be restored until somebody transplants as South Wales building to the West Country...

 

Pontypridd TVR goods shed might make a decent clay dryer.

[phil gollin]

.

 

Of Course, Kernow "could" do a range of Poldark buildings, but many of them aren't in Cornwall.

 

What really is required is a decent "ready-to-plonk" Church.  Most available ones are just not big enough.  Most are just laughable, and almost all the rest just represent very small chapels of doubtful architectural accuracy.  Yes, even a small village church is large, but sooner or later someone "should" produce a decent one.

 

(Of course, Cornwall does have more than its fair share of small, quaint chapels.)

 

.

[Scottest]

Like many on here, I have benefitted from Kernow's Ltd Edition ready to plant buildings courtesy of their collaboration with Bachmann.

 

We often see wishlists for locos and rolling stock but what of buildings.

 

Kernow have led the way in terms of retailer commisions.

 

I know I have a personal wishlist of what I consider to be attractive prototypes. No pressure or presumption but what do others think?

 

Would this be of use to Kernow?

 

My would likes centre around the L&SWR........

 

Another run of Boscastle ground frame.

 

Wenford Bridge Goods depot office.

 

Pencarrow Wood stream fed water crane thingy.

 

A typical ground level signal box, Lyme Regis ( I know its in Dorset) sort of jobby.

 

A pack of typical L&SWR ' barley twist' swan neck platform lamps.......and typical station nameboards

 

I am of course mindful that Kernow are a retailer and I hope they won't mind if I say not in possession of infinate resources but are yhe above worth considering in the future?

 

Rob.

 

I quite agree, Rob, however.....

 

I seem to recall that the prototypes came with either a left hand thread or right hand thread.

I never got to the origins of this difference, but I am sure that it could be important.

 

Scottest.

[it's-er]

On Phil's point about a decent size "ready to plonk" church, TMC's model of St Mary's Church in Goathland is very substantial - I'd love one on my railway, but I don't have space. It is a striking model

https://www.themodelcentre.com/44-101ZLTD/

 

John Storey

[phil gollin]

On Phil's point about a decent size "ready to plonk" church, TMC's model of St Mary's Church in Goathland is very substantial - I'd love one on my railway, but I don't have space. It is a striking model

https://www.themodelcentre.com/44-101ZLTD/

 

John Storey

.

 

Ahhhh . . . . . now there is a good example of what I am concerned about.   I am sure that for many that gives a good "church", and for people who are happy with it  GREAT.

 

Unfortunately, for me it is a bit of a monstrosity.  It may well be modelled on an original, but if so it is a VERY rare example.

 

Simplistically (and NOT always) old British PARISH churches had their chancel (the bit with the altar) at the east end, the nave (the bit where the congregation sit) in the middle to the west end.  The vast majority of bell towers were at the western end, although towers between the chancel and nave are common enough (especially if there are transepts), as are towers built adjoining the nave to the North.  Most churches have at least one aisle (a sideways extension of the nave).   There are innumerable variations and the church modelled may well be exactly right.

 

However (!) looking at it the chancel is much too small (my better half thinks that if it is a real example the chancel must have partially collapsed and been rebuilt on the cheap).  The nave is too small for the money spent on the tower (but it might have been a vanity project by the Lord of the Manor.  The sacristy is too big and on the "wrong side" of the building (they are normally smaller and on the North side (again, anything is possible and you'll find an example for nearly anything).  The South Porch (the main entrance) is out of proportion.  The windows are too small - that church is going to be VERY dark.  That ignores things like how anyone gets onto the top of the tower, heating chimney, etc ....

 

Overall, the church is all out of proportion, too short, and is VERY UNTYPICAL of an English Parish Church.  What I want is something about twice the length and about twice the width (a north or south aisle).  Larger windows, the bell tower at the West end and the sacristy to the North of the chancel.  I.E. much more expensive.

 

As I said above, Churches are BIG.

 

(The Metcalfe card model is MUCH better as a representative church, although I could tear the minor details of that to pieces (aisles too long, chancel side windows VERY suspect, top of tower and buttresses) but I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't quite closely modelled on a prototype - churches got messed around a lot ;

 

https://www.metcalfemodels.com/product/po226-00-h0-parish-church/

 

.

Edited July 14, 2017 by phil gollin

[The Johnster]

.

 

Of Course, Kernow "could" do a range of Poldark buildings, but many of them aren't in Cornwall.

 

What really is required is a decent "ready-to-plonk" Church.  Most available ones are just not big enough.  Most are just laughable, and almost all the rest just represent very small chapels of doubtful architectural accuracy.  Yes, even a small village church is large, but sooner or later someone "should" produce a decent one.

 

(Of course, Cornwall does have more than its fair share of small, quaint chapels.)

 

.

 

So does South Wales, many of doubtful architectural accuracy... round here, chapels looked like engine sheds and engine sheds looked like chapels, the same contractors often building both.  I am assuming that, by 'quaint', you mean the same as I do by it, which is 'derelict'.  I considered a 'bethesda' to hide a baseboard join on Cwmdimbath at one time, but current thinking is for a tin 'non political' club for the sinners; I'm more at home with that!

Edited July 14, 2017 by The Johnster

[phil-b259]

 

 

Overall, the church is all out of proportion, too short, and is VERY UNTYPICAL of an English Parish Church.  What I want is something about twice the length and about twice the width (a north or south aisle).  Larger windows, the bell tower at the West end and the sacristy to the North of the chancel.  I.E. much more expensive.

 

As I said above, Churches are BIG.

.

 

Which is a problem

 

Pretty much ALL resin building producers / commissioners of said buildings have said they deliberately seek to reduce the size of building precisely because most modellers do not have space for big ones. Effectively you are asking said manufacturers to produce something that will be an extremely slow seller and sit on their shelves for ages just to satisfy your needs - and that is simply not going to happen.

 

Of course it may well be that all churches / chapels produced so far have errors (ignoring the deliberate reduction in size explained above) - though given the way the real things varied considerably over the centuries due to all sorts of things, it would be a brave person that stands there saying that they are all 'wrong'

[The Johnster]

Not all churches are big, and the old Airfix construction kit, now marketed as Kitmaster by Dapol and based on a prototype on the Isle of Wight, is a scale model.  Urban Victorian churches and even non comformist chapels tend to be big lumps, as do older ones in prosperous market towns and larger villages, but many rural churches in small villages are not large, particularly if the village does not have a history of hundreds of years of patronage by the local gentry, or was never particularly wealthy in the first place; Cornwall, Wales, and the north of England can provide plenty of such examples, and they are not unknown in the Midlands or South East.  Where towns have absorbed villages as they grew in the industrial revolution, they can sometimes turn up in urban settings surrounded by council estates or factories as well. 

 

Older parish churches, though, even small village ones, are normally set in churchyards, which contain several centuries worth of graves, and these can often occupy a good bit of space!  You can get around this by modelling the frontage of the church close to the road and 'suggesting' a large area of graves behind it; suggest it by a few big trees overhanging the church building.  Important to get the stone right as well; few churches even in affluent areas could afford to bring stone in from any distance, and they are almost always of local material.  So, a Cornish granite edifice looks quite different to a Cotwold limestone one, or a Nottinghamshire Permian red sandstone one, but maybe not so different to one in Aberdeen...

Edited July 14, 2017 by The Johnster

[grahame]

Personally I'd rather suppliers didn't bother with commissioning RTP buildings and concentrated on rolling stock. I've not been impressed with RTP resin buildings, although I've only ever purchased one; I was quite disappointed with it. And the new ODC range has met with a critical response having a number of architectural issues and errors.

 

Specific buildings are always going to involve a lot of compression and compromise (causing the concerns voiced above in this thread) and I suspect will be attractive to fewer modellers (i.e. those who are building a layout of that specific area and period) than those who'd be interested in some rolling stock (even limited to an era or railway company).

 

It is far easier to either adapt/bash building kits or construct them from scratch than to model rolling stock effectively (which have inherent issues of motorising or needing to actually couple up and roll effortlessly along track).

 

Below is a pic of a structure based on a couple of real building that I'm in the process or building (it's not completed) from card and styrene sheet (in N/2mm). There's nothing difficult or complex in the construction of it. Perhaps we should encourage and show enthusiasts how they can make buildings easily and cheaply for themselves. And let commissioners provide our fill of RTR and kit rolling stock.

 

 

G.

 

 

[rue_d_etropal]

There is nothing wrong in doing a few r2p buildings, but I think it has gone over the top, and now with Oxford starting a range. Not only does it reduce the amount of fun you can have building models of buildings, or converting low cost kits, but think of the weight. I wonder how many 'portable' layouts will find themselves not so portable.

I would rather design my own buldings and get them 3D printed. That way I am involved in the design, and don't have to assemble a kit. I can also design them to fit. They may not be cheap,  but they are nice and lightweight, so ideal for some of my small portable layouts.

having said that I am currently building a small French layout in 3mm/ft, and am using wargaming 15mm buildings. Some laser cut kits but mostly either resin or plaster of some sorts. Won't get plaster again as it is fragile. I have found it is actually more difficut working out where to put each building , than if I was designing my own. As each section of the layout is on lid of a boxfile, each box won't be too heavy, until I put several in bag to carry!

 

Overall I think that the increased use of r2p buildings results in too many layouts looking the same, but there is less of an issue with so much r2r locos and stock. Obviously if a layout is built for home use only, and you are the lonly person likely to se it , then it doesn't matter.

At least the r2p buildings are reasonable in quality these days, compared with what was being offer years ago(although some are still being produced unfortunately).

[The Johnster]

I've a few rtp resin buildings on Cwmdimbath, and am happy with my station building.  This edifice is a chop of 2x Hornby Skakedale NER stations, and is loosely inspired by Abergwynfi.  it is one building with an end sawn off and about 2/3rds of another stuck on, to obtain enough doors and windows to represent a supervisor's office, waiting room, porter's mess room, and ladies toilet.  There is no booking office, as there is no entrance on the non-railway side of the building, where a 1,600 foot mountain rears precipitously skywards to remind you that this is the South Wales Valleys.  Tickets are sold from a booth at the gap in the fence where the footpath reaches the platform from the roadway, actually a Peco fogman's hut with a card half-door..  Because Abergwyfi had a canopy, and to hide the join in the roof, I have provided a card canopy edged with Wills valances.  Painted WR brown and cream, weathered, and 'distressed' it is sufficiently mine for me to be both proud of it and ashamed of it's shortcomings; it looks nothing like Skaledale!

 

That apart, there is a resin lean-to corrugated hut, and the rest are kits; as these are mostly huts and fairly standard and non-descript, I am happy enough with them.  A drawback of Cwmdimbath's small baseboards is that they are full of railway and there is little scope for modelling off the railway, but I am gearing up to have a go at the scenic break end, which will involve 2 bridges, a pipe bridge, and the end of Remploy's, which is to give the impression of a post war brick building sort of 'stepped' 3 or 4 floors up the mountainside; nothing in the rtp or kit world will supply this and I will have to cobble it together myself.  It will show it's rear face to the railway, which is a brilliant excuse for all sorts of downpipes, ventilation trunking, back stairways, fire escapes, and odd little metal framed windows with chipped paint all over the place, and I want it to look as if it was build in stages by different contractors to different styles; a mess, in other words, whose purpose is to draw one's attention away from the scenic break.  It is, I suspect, going to be fun!  I'm not going to design or plan it, just fresstyle build it with a general idea of what I want in mind.

 

There is also a baseboard join to hide, with the aforementioned corrugated tin non-political club (these were some of the worst hotbeds of sedition in the country); this will probably be scratchbuild as well for the hell of it, windows with bits of card put in them to hide the fact that there's an illegal afternoon stop on in progress while the latest uprising is being planned, come the glorious day, brothers...  Actually, Skaledale's barrack hut is ideal for this, but at £55 it can remain an ideal!

 

I have a long term plan to replace the station building with something better, as a drawback of resin castings is that you cannot model open or part open doors.  I like these, as they suggest the presence of humans without there being too many humans about the place; if you see an open door, a bicycle leaning up against a wall and a tea can left on a bench, you know that there is a human somewhere in the vicinity!  Sensible thicknesses of walls means that you can have a go at lighting as well, and lit buildings in full daylight if properly done are very suggestive of dull, wet, Valleys weather; this is in itself inspired by an afternoon sheltering in the 'Refresh' at Cwmmer Afan on a soft day in 1969...  But the resin rtp is fine for now, and may be there for some years to come yet.  I am happy with it.

Edited July 15, 2017 by The Johnster

[GWR8700]

I'd personally like another run of the derelict engine house as I missed out on them

[it's-er]

I'd have thought Axminster station would fit well with Kernow's interests. I remember seeing a small photo in Railway Modeller years ago of a superb model someone had made of it, and was drawn to it. There have been models of Axminster in the model press since, and it would make a lovely ready to plant station. It would have to be produced as several sections, to fit together.

 

More widely I've wondered if Hornby Skaledale and Bachmann Scenecraft might produce models of two very recognisable and likeable station building types, which are also relatively small, so readily reproducible. First, from the NER, a G. T. Andrews station like that at Nafferton (modelled by Malcolm Crawley in Thompson's End (British Railway Modelling March 1998) and later in Hornby magazine)) and Stamford Bridge (Peter Goss in Etton (Railway Modeller November 2001)). They are very recognisable with a small portico over the entrance:

http://www.geograph.org.uk/snippet/16458

http://www.petegossrailwaymodelling.co.uk/p31934203

 

Second, the GER '1865 station', of which around 30 were built to a standard design, such as to be found at Clare, Rayne, Takeley and Felsted. These have a neat design, and were built in small, medium and large versions: they could be sold in modules, so the Modeller could make his/her own choice as to size.

http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/c/clare/

https://www.gersociety.org.uk/index.php/home/sales/files-emporium-2/category/2-ds-scale-drawings

 

John Storey

[Joseph_Pestell]

RTP scale church buildings is a non-starter. They would have to be priced at a level which would make them very slow sellers, quite apart from most layouts not having the space for them.

 

Much better to produce a low-relief model of the west end of a church suitable for inclusion in an urban scene. But I do wish that producers of low-relief models would make some that were not rectangular so that streets are not systematically parallel with the backscene.

Edited August 23, 2017 by Joseph_Pestell

[NHY 581]

I'm sure Bachmann did a low relief angled church thingy.

 

Rob

[kernowtim]

I'd personally like another run of the derelict engine house as I missed out on them

I did look at these when they first came out, however they seemed far too small for 4mm scale and all the walls were the same thickness, the wall that supported the beam should be much thicker than the others

[rue_d_etropal]

RTP scale church buildings is a non-starter. They would have to be priced at a level which would make them very slow sellers, quite apart from most layouts not having the space for them.

 

Much better to produce a low-relief model of the west end of a church suitable for inclusion in an urban scene. But I do wish that producers of low-relief models would make some that were not rectangular so that streets are not systematically parallel with the backscene.

Now that is an idea, low relief at an angle. Only difficult part is the roof, unless the back cut is behind the roof ridge.

[it's-er]

Now that is an idea, low relief at an angle. Only difficult part is the roof, unless the back cut is behind the roof ridge.

That is exactly what Bachmann Scenecraft do with their low relief 3/4 view church, item no 44-239.. You will still find it if you look around. It is out of stock at Hattons, but their photos show how it is designed

http://www.hattons.co.uk/60723/Bachmann_Branchline_44_239_Low_Relief_3_4_View_Church_140_x_80_x_125mm_/StockDetail.aspx

 

John Storey

[Joseph_Pestell]

I'm sure Bachmann did a low relief angled church thingy.

 

Rob

I had not seen one of those. Exactly the sort of thing that I meant.

[The Johnster]

RTP scale church buildings is a non-starter. They would have to be priced at a level which would make them very slow sellers, quite apart from most layouts not having the space for them.

 

Much better to produce a low-relief model of the west end of a church suitable for inclusion in an urban scene. But I do wish that producers of low-relief models would make some that were not rectangular so that streets are not systematically parallel with the backscene.

 

Now this is a good point.  A quick look at most street scenes will show that, particularly in older locations, right angled layouts are the exception rather than the rule and that the relationship between the railway and the streets surrounding it is very rarely one of parallels and right angles.  There is a lot of potential in this for theatrical management of sightlines and manipulation of perspective, in which the presence of a large building or series of buildings such as a street of terraced houses can be suggested with only a corner or end gable actually modelled in low relief; the trick is to angle them away from your line of sight.

 

Older churches, particularly village parish churches, tend to be in churchyards and orientated with the alter at the eastern end, closer to Jerusalem, so can be completely out of any alignment with any other local buildings or streets, but Victorian urban churches and chapels, especially non conformist ones, are much more likely to be street facing and open directly on to the pavement.  Catholic churches in the UK will not be older than mid 19th century and distinguished by crosses with a Jesus on them.  Victorian and later churches will be likely to have church halls and such next door or nearby.

 

So there are alternatives to modelling large medieval parish churches surrounded by churchyards!

Edited August 24, 2017 by The Johnster