Bachmann J72

[micklner]

The NER green livery version is a wrong, it is based on a photgraphic Grey liveried J72 photo. It maybe a cheaper version to buy in due course.

[Compound2632]

8 minutes ago, micklner said:

The NER green livery version is a wrong, it is based on a photgraphic Grey liveried J72 photo. It maybe a cheaper version to buy in due course.

 

... if you want to try very neatly cutting 2 mm out of the bunker!

[Bernard Lamb]

13 hours ago, Sam Moss said:

Lovely little model but ouch! at the price. £105.99 at Kernow and that's with some discount on RRP. The Hornby new tooling Terrier in comparison being available for £35 less! Can see these sitting on the shelves for a while!

 

The price sounds about right to me.

Welcome to 2019.

Please do not take an interest in the ex GER area as a much smaller loco, the J70 , will cost you a lot more.

To be fair the Rails Terrier would be a better example of a similar size and quality for a modern model to compare it to.

Model trains are not a mass market item and as such have to find their level in a changing world.

Moaning about it will not change it.

Several years ago I first made a comment about the new price increases of that time and stated that in a few years time that they would be considered to be something of a bargain. Things do seem to have moved that way and I do not see that we have yet reached the limit.

As for the new  J72. It does look rather nice at first glance but is limited in scope for many modellers. I am sure their are many branch line modellers who will dream up a story that it is replacing a bigger loco that is out of action. 

Bernard

[GeoS]

On 04/11/2019 at 08:55, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

A J72 carves up into the ex-GER J67/69 reasonably well. The Worsdell connection.

Can anyone say if the chassis will take the body from a Wills Finecast J69 kit?

[woodenhead]

14 hours ago, Sam Moss said:

Lovely little model but ouch! at the price. £105.99 at Kernow and that's with some discount on RRP. The Hornby new tooling Terrier in comparison being available for £35 less! Can see these sitting on the shelves for a while!

 

Don't compare it with the Hornby model - designed to a price.

 

Compare it with the Rails Terrier at £110 and a similar level of fidelity at £110 - making the J72 £5 cheaper.

[Bernard Lamb]

49 minutes ago, GeoS said:

Can anyone say if the chassis will take the body from a Wills Finecast J69 kit?

I would very much doubt it as the wall thickness on a white metal kit is usually a lot thicker than on a  RTR model.

Using parts of the body kit such as the cab and bunker sides might be a viable option.

Bernard

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

2 hours ago, Phil Parker said:

Surely that depends on whether you want a specific loco for your layout or just any tank engine. If your layout needs a J72, then your options are buy Bachmann, use an old model or kitbuild...

The great truth here is that for anyone using RTR to model steam on the dry side of the UK, there's a  grand choice now of just three 0-6-0T in current standard models. One of these is the delightful but very limited in application J70, then there is the solidly muscular J50, and now the petite J72. (In the 'also ran' section are dated J52 and J94 models, and an antediluvian travesty claiming to be a J83.) So for a good small 0-6-0T of NER/LNER/BR origin that's reasonably widely appropriate, the J72 is it for now.

 

57 minutes ago, GeoS said:

Can anyone say if the chassis will take the body from a Wills Finecast J69 kit?

Not yet! But I would be confident of it being able to be made to fit with some work, based on past experiences of fitting Bachmann mechanisms into various old whitemetal kit bodies. I got a Bachmann 56xx mechanism to fit into the first Wills N7 body, and have transplanted numerous Bachmann 57xx and 3F mechanisms into all sorts of old whitemetal bodies whose original anciently adapted RTR mechanisms were well and truly worn out.

 

Between releasing screwed on castings, taking a saw to any part of the main casting where it needs to shrink in size, and some whittling of the whitemetal body interior, it will be made to go. There is a hazard awaiting, and this applies to any kit or indeed fully RTR model of a Buckjumper. Stratford inconsiderately fitted not a vestige of a splasher above the front wheels, just a level footplate. Clearance so that the flanges don't create a dead short by permanent contact with the metal body work must be arranged. (Cut a clearance hole, 'plate over' with thin plasticard.)

 

Personally I shall be using my Mainline plastic J72 body anciently hacked about to represent a J69. The flanges only rub on plastic, no problems!

[Phil Parker]

Bachmann also give you a full cab interior decoration, flickering glow fire box, and for those of a DCC persuasion, a factory fitted speaker.

 

The cab interior sounds good to me as I try to figure out what to do with the metal bits in the Mainline upgrade I'm working on at the moment.

 

 

I think I'm just going to stick a figure leaning out of each side and call it quits...

[micklner]

2 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

... if you want to try very neatly cutting 2 mm out of the bunker!

2mm why ??

 

I would suggesting a respray into Black as a option on the fictional NER  version.

[Compound2632]

3 minutes ago, micklner said:

2mm why ??

 

 

To produce one of the 1898/9 engines in NER green, preserving the Bachmann factory green livery.

[micklner]

1 minute ago, Compound2632 said:

 

To produce one of the 1898/9 engines in NER green, preserving the Bachmann factory green livery.

Ahh, that now makes sense, I presume that version carried the Green Livery ( I have'nt checked)?.

 

I wouldnt like to try and do that ,and still manage to preserve the livery !!

[Compound2632]

7 minutes ago, micklner said:

I presume that version carried the Green Livery ( I have'nt checked)?.

 

 

Black was adopted for goods and mineral engines in June 1904, so the first twenty Class E1 engines would have been green until the first time they needed repainting after that date [J.M. Fleming, North Eastern Record Vol. 3 (HMRS, 2000)].

[Porcy Mane]

3 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

... if you want to try very neatly cutting 2 mm out of the bunker!

 

Easy enough on the old Bachmann/Palitoy/Mainline version so I can't see it being too difficult on the updated version. Still enough room for a decent Knowles speaker in there.

 

 

P

Edited December 10, 2019 by Porcy Mane

[Worsdell forever]

4 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

The very basic difference is that the 1950s locos, in fact all the locos built from 1914 onwards, had extended rear frames and 6" longer bunker than the 20 engines built 1898/9 - hence the Bachmann and Mainline models are not suitable for these nineteenth century engines without major surgery.

 

The 1898/9 locos had Ramsbottom safety valves with brass "trumpet" covers; the 1914 locos had Ross pop safety valves; subsequent boiler changes and renewals mixed things up a bit. Likewise buffers varied over time. I've just re-read the J72 section of Locomotives of the LNER Part 8B (RCTS, 1983) but am still confused about what safety valves the BR-built engines were given from new - I have the impression that there may have been a reversion to Ramsbottom valves and trumpet cover?

 

In short, the RTR model does not represent the first 20 engines, in BR-speak, 68670-68689.

 

BR built ones had the rear sandboxes below the footplate rather than in the cab.

 

As far as I'm aware the later 'trumpets' were fitted over Ross Pops to counter steam drift.

 

 

[Compound2632]

22 minutes ago, Porcy Mane said:

 

Easy enough on the old Bachmann/Palitoy/Mainline version so I can't see it being too difficult on the updated version. Still enough room for a decent Knowles speaker in there.

 

Yes, but for what I have in mind for the new Bachmann NER green debunkering, one would have to cut further forward to preserve the curved corners of the lining panel, but not so far forward as to impinge on the curve of the bunker top into the cab side sheet. I think there is enough room to do that. One would need a new numberplate, of course, but I think the one on the model is just printed.

[Worsdell forever]

34 minutes ago, Porcy Mane said:

 

Easy enough on the old Bachmann/Palitoy/Mainline version so I can't see it being too difficult on the updated version. Still enough room for a decent Knowles speaker in there.

 

 

P

 

There's a few things you can do by cutting up old Mainline bodies, a "class 44" being one of them.

[Compound2632]

1 hour ago, Worsdell forever said:

 

There's a few things you can do by cutting up old Mainline bodies, a "class 44" being one of them.

 

I'd thought of linking to that but, like the Class E / J71, it involves a new chassis which would be a distraction for this topic.

Edited December 10, 2019 by Compound2632

[Worsdell forever]

1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I'd thought of linking to that but, like the Class E / J71, it involves a new chassis which would be a distraction for this topic.

 

Only mentioned it as Uncle Porsee showed us a cut 'n shut, otherwise I wasn't going to.

[GNR Dave]

8 hours ago, micklner said:

The NER green livery version is a wrong, it is based on a photgraphic Grey liveried J72 photo. It maybe a cheaper version to buy in due course.

 

Really ?

I'd put money on the NER livery being the best seller. Regardless of prototype fidelity the world loves a pretty loco and this one qualifies IMHO. 

[Porcy Mane]

14 minutes ago, Worsdell forever said:

There's a few things you can do by cutting up old Mainline bodies, a "class 44" being one of them.

 

Wouldn't it be easier to start of with a Mainline Class 45 body?

 

https://flic.kr/p/TDnrwv

 

 

1 hour ago, Worsdell forever said:

 

 Uncle Porsee 

 

Waaaatch iiiit!        Jazziest uncle you'll ever have.

 

37 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Yes, but for what I have in mind for the new Bachmann NER green debunkering, one would have to cut further forward to preserve the curved corners of the lining panel, but not so far forward as to impinge on the curve of the bunker top into the cab side sheet. I think there is enough room to do that. One would need a new numberplate, of course, but I think the one on the model is just printed.

 

Trying my hardest to stay current; just my opinion but disguising that joint line, even with most of it covered by an etched plate will be a bl**dy hard job if you're trying not to repaint/line the panel. Luckily looking at the cads it looks as though the bunker back may be separate moulding/casting to the running plate which would save the cruellest cut of all (bar one).

 

Purely for comparison here's no.1 of the short bunkered variety compared to one of the BR built batch.

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/101015-mikemegs-workbench-building-locos-of-the-north-eastern/page-19#entry2823178

 

https://flic.kr/p/CgJjRa

 

P (I only have two nieces but 17 god kids)

 

[Compound2632]

5 minutes ago, Porcy Mane said:

Trying my hardest to stay current; just my opinion but disguising that joint line, even with most of it covered by an etched plate will be a bl**dy hard job if you're trying not to repaint/line the panel. Luckily looking at the cads it looks as though the bunker back may be separate moulding/casting to the running plate which would save the cruellest cut of all (bar one).

 

 

Yes, I think it would be tricky - I started off tongue in cheek but as the idea required explanation, it grew.

 

You know Paul's done a Class 59 too?

 

 

[ArthurK]

When the longer coal bunker was added to the NER E1 (edited) class (later J72) the  frames were not extended. They remained at twenty five feet.  The only change at the rear was to add a wooden baulk behind the rear buffer beam. This, together with an additional steel plate added 5 3/8" to the length. The bunker was extended by this same amount. It then overhung beyond the actual frames. The footplate on the original E projected eight inches beyond the buffer beam, more than enough to accommodate the additional bunker length.

 

ArthurK 

Edited December 10, 2019 by ArthurK
Correction

[Porcy Mane]

29 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

Class 59

 

Nothing ever surprises me

about enterprising Mr G.

[Worsdell forever]

44 minutes ago, Porcy Mane said:

 

Wouldn't it be easier to start of with a Mainline Class 45 body?

 

https://flic.kr/p/TDnrwv

 

 

So, what wheel arrangement is that?

 

44 minutes ago, Porcy Mane said:

 

https://flic.kr/p/CgJjRa

 

 

Shows the later sandboxes very well.

[Porcy Mane]

3 minutes ago, Worsdell forever said:

So, what wheel arrangement is that?

 

 

Erm-Erm.  I think the one behind is a Rme-Rme