rembrow Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 There has been some discussion on the design of the trusses. What effect does this modification have on those? It doesn't affect the trusses and they are still clear of the track, so don't catch at points or crossovers. This doesn't address the depth of the trusses, that's a separate issue. Looking at Paul Bartlett's photos of the prototype, I think that the issue is around the lower position of the brake hangers, as on the prototype, they are attached, at their end point, to the start of the angled truss, at it's lowest point, whereas on the model they are a couple of mm higher, finishing on the vertical support. It may be possible to cut through the 4 vertical supports at the bottom of the brake hangers and a vertical cut to the angled supports where they join the vertical, lose the excess from the cut off vertical supports and re-glue in place, then adjust the angled trusses to meet the adjusted vertical supports. Will be a fair bit of work and I'm not sure I'm going to tackle it, as the trusses look ok to me from my normal viewing angle of looking down on the model Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southernman46 Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Please sort the trusses out first - they're about a foot too low Please sort them for the BEV then ............................... ?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 I'm surprised no one has yet commented on the most unusual thing about the coupling mounting. Is this the first RTR piece of bogie rolling stock on which the coupling isn't attached to the bogie but to the main body? And has anyone yet tested a rake on tight-radius curves to see how they behave? These are short wagons, shorter than, for example, the Tube that Bachmann model. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 It doesn't affect the trusses and they are still clear of the track, so don't catch at points or crossovers. This doesn't address the depth of the trusses, that's a separate issue. Looking at Paul Bartlett's photos of the prototype, I think that the issue is around the lower position of the brake hangers, as on the prototype, they are attached, at their end point, to the start of the angled truss, at it's lowest point, whereas on the model they are a couple of mm higher, finishing on the vertical support. It may be possible to cut through the 4 vertical supports at the bottom of the brake hangers and a vertical cut to the angled supports where they join the vertical, lose the excess from the cut off vertical supports and re-glue in place, then adjust the angled trusses to meet the adjusted vertical supports. Will be a fair bit of work and I'm not sure I'm going to tackle it, as the trusses look ok to me from my normal viewing angle of looking down on the modelAre drawings available? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
26power Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 See post 62 in this thread. Are drawings available? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 ... Prototype drawing Bartlett, Paul W. & Mann, Trevor., (1985) Non Hoppered Steel Ballast Wagons. Part 4 The Plaice and Turbot. Model Railway Constructor vol 52 part 615 pp 418 — 422 & 444 — 445. Paul Unfortunately second hand magazines are advertised in year and month order, so which year is volume 52 and in which months do pages 418-422 and 444-445 appear? Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted February 25, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 25, 2018 Unfortunately second hand magazines are advertised in year and month order, so which year is volume 52 and in which months do pages 418-422 and 444-445 appear? Regards A google search may help; https://britishrailwaybooks.co.uk/magazine/modelrailwayconstructor.php Mike. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 A google search may help; https://britishrailwaybooks.co.uk/magazine/modelrailwayconstructor.php Mike. Thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Steven B Posted February 26, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 26, 2018 BR Diagram book 350 has a drawing of the Turbot (http://www.barrowmoremrg.co.uk/Prototype.html) Steven B Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 BR Diagram book 350 has a drawing of the Turbot (http://www.barrowmoremrg.co.uk/Prototype.html) Steven B No, it has a diagram. They are very different, especially if we are discussing details such as the trussing. A diagram is to guide the staff to order suitable wagons for the job they have to do. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted February 27, 2018 Share Posted February 27, 2018 Unfortunately second hand magazines are advertised in year and month order, so which year is volume 52 and in which months do pages 418-422 and 444-445 appear? Regards To answer my own question, it would seem that it is August 1985. Non appear to be available at present either on eBay or the Magazine Exchange Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted February 27, 2018 Share Posted February 27, 2018 These are short wagons, shorter than, for example, the Tube that Bachmann model. Paul They were used for Duport's traffic from Llanelli to Great Bridge for this very reason; they were the only bogie vehicles that could access the loading area through some very sharp curves. One day, a Bolster C was mixed in with the empties- the overhang knocked out a lineside hut before the error was discovered. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FelixM Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 The wrong height of the coupling was evident from the CAD pictures. If I remember correctly, the Dapol Turbots will have the NEM pockets at the correct height. In my opinion realistic details come second after compatibility to existing stock. Accurascale, are you listening? Your Nem pocket height gives reason for some concerns too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
26power Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 Hi. Have you posted your Accurascale concerns on an appropriate thread, or passed them on to them directly? If not it seems a bit ambitious to expect them to pick up your concerns here. The wrong height of the coupling was evident from the CAD pictures. If I remember correctly, the Dapol Turbots will have the NEM pockets at the correct height.In my opinion realistic details come second after compatibility to existing stock. Accurascale, are you listening? Your Nem pocket height gives reason for some concerns too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Accurascale Fran Posted March 3, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 3, 2018 (edited) The wrong height of the coupling was evident from the CAD pictures. If I remember correctly, the Dapol Turbots will have the NEM pockets at the correct height. In my opinion realistic details come second after compatibility to existing stock. Accurascale, are you listening? Your Nem pocket height gives reason for some concerns too. Hi Felix, As we have stated elsewhere our factory is moving our NEM pockets to correct height before production. It's something we have acknowledged and are well aware of. Cheers! Fran Edited March 3, 2018 by 071 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rembrow Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 Having carried out the bogie height adjustment I previously described, which made a great improvement to the gap between the bogie and the underframe as well as bringing down the buffer height, I left things for a few days, however having mulled it over, I just wasn't happy with the truss depth, which is far too deep, and the bogie gap adjustment has made this more noticeable. Having studied a large number of prototype photos on Paul Bartlett's site, I came to the conclusion that the problem lay with the vertical truss supports, which extend down too far below the vertical brake hanger. The prototype photos show that the brake hanger at its lowest point, is level with the top of the horizontal truss support and is attached to the angled truss, rather than in the model, being a couple of mm above the angled truss. These links to Paul's photos show this well with excellent detail of the relationship between the angled and horizontal truss bars and the brake hanger. http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/img/s1/v20/p452797175-3.jpg http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/img/s3/v24/p472815275-3.jpg I therefore hatched a plan to modify the model, which involved cutting off the lower truss section. I cut the two vertical bars next to the two brake hangers level with the bottom of the brake hanger, then made a plasticard template of the revised vertical truss bar height and used that to mark and cut the other two verticals. I then cut through the 4 angled truss bars at the point where they join the vertical bar. This allowed the cut off vertical trusses and the cross pieces to fall away. The angled trusses remain attached to the model chassis and with pressure from my thumb on the whole length, I was able to bend these closer to the body to what would be their new height. The cut off section was now addressed and the crosspieces were carefully removed to be re-used. The remains of the cut vertical bars were cut from the horizontal bars so that the horizontal bar retains its original length. After tidying up of cuts, the horizontal bars can be reattached to the cut down vertical bars that are on the model chassis. Once dry, the angled truss bars need to be filed gradually at the cut end, until you get the correct length to be able to glue them to the end of the reattached horizontal bar. I then tidied up the glued joints with an emery stick and 1200 wet and dry, finally attaching the crosspieces across from side to side. Hopefully these photos will show the effect. I believe the height of the truss is much closer to prototype and certainly the relationship between the truss, the brake vacuum V brackets and the vertical brake hanger is much better. Three YCVs converted and 3 to go. I attach another prototype photo with a good side on view, which was previously posted in the Dapol Turbot thread. Unfortunately I suspect this design error will be carried over to the Bogie Bolster E and I'm not sure I will want to carry out more changes, but we'll see. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 978002 needs that end step removing Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonC Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 wow that looks like a big improvement!! really shouldn't have to go to that effort with an off-the-shelf RTR model though. It does stick out like a sore thumb as not looking right Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogbox321 Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Personally, cannot understand why people have not just waited for Dapol's version, and then made an informed decision on which of the two Turbot models the individual thinks is best! Regards, C. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WILLIAM Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Personally, cannot understand why people have not just waited for Dapol's version, and then made an informed decision on which of the two Turbot models the individual thinks is best! Regards, C. Kernow have already sold out of the Dutch examples so waiting not really an option unless there will be another run. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob D2 Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 Personally, cannot understand why people have not just waited for Dapol's version, and then made an informed decision on which of the two Turbot models the individual thinks is best! Regards, C. You think Dapol will still make this ? I don’t Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 You think Dapol will still make this ? I don’t They are. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGR Hooper! Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 You think Dapol will still make this ? I don’t Dapol have publicly stated that they're going ahead with their Turbot, the specs are better than the KMRC model also. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogbox321 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 Dapol have publicly stated that they're going ahead with their Turbot, the specs are better than the KMRC model also. I asked Dapol in an e-mail after Kernow made their intentions known, Joel the MD got back to me, and said we are assessing it - give us a couple of weeks. Then replied saying they were, and a couple of CAD's came out a couple of weeks later. Personally, I were never too keen on the Kernow bogies either, hence wanted a decision off Dapol, and with them saying "Yes" decided to wait. Clearly with Kernow selling out of Dutch, there is a market and if you look at the Cads, they look very good (assuming we don't get any silly mistakes as per MJA's with lamp irons on the wrong end etc). Regards, C. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 KERNOW MODEL RAIL CENTRE PRESS RELEASE - MORE TURBOTS Following the sell-out of our Dutch Turbots in OO Gauge (within 1 week of arriving!) we are pleased to announce six further versions. Two will be pristine and four weathered, all will be priced at £29.99 each. As previously, you can pay up front and save £5 per wagon. Delivery is expected later this year. SB006Y DUTCH YCV Pristine Turbot Pack of 2... £49.98 Pre-order pay in full SB006Z DUTCH YCV Weathered Turbot Pack of 4... £99.96 Pre-order pay in fullINDIVIDUAL MODELS SB006I YCV Turbot DB978021...£29.99 PRE-ORDER PRICESB006J YCV Turbot DB978051...£29.99 PRE-ORDER PRICESB006K YCV Turbot DB978066...£29.99 PRE-ORDER PRICESB006L YCV Turbot DB978002...£29.99 PRE-ORDER PRICESB006M YCV Turbot DB978002...£29.99 PRE-ORDER PRICESB006N YCV Turbot DB978002...£29.99 PRE-ORDER PRICE Please note the images of the pristine models are the previous version, which are identical other than the running numbers. The weathered version is the first sample, the pattern and colour of rust will be improved for production. Further information is available from our website at the dedicated Turbot page http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/pg/161/YCV-Turbot Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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