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3d printing for the Soller Railway


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Following on from the inspiration in this thread: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/123155-soller-train-and-tram/, I have also been musing over the possibilities of modelling the Soller Railway, in fact it's been in the top ten inspirational list for quite a while and seeing photos from recent visits have stolen my modeling mojo from other things that I am supposed to be progressing.

 

Comments in the above thread pretty much convinced me that 1:100 on 9mm track was the way forward*, but after seeing the excellent and most entertaining Spanish layout "San Maria Gandia" at Andover yesterday (as seen in this video: https://youtu.be/XS2Jv-2-ns8?t=9m29s ) and talking to the builders, they had an obvious case for modelling it in HOm using 12mm gauge track.

 

(* Lets not talk about the rapidly abandoned idea of using T gauge at a 1:300 scale).

 

This got me thinking, and have been considering the comparisons in a few key areas, with a view to modelling Bunyola in a fairly recent era and using commercial parts and chassis where possible. It'd be a fairly simple layout to operate with basically two trains passing each other and the small yard for engineering trains, but could be backdated to earlier times when freight was carried.

 

Stock- This would be CAD designed and 3d printed anyway as there is nothing suitable in either scale, although a few 4w wagons might be useful from HOm manufacturers. The average Soller Railway freight vehicle seems to have a wheelbase of around 8'6", which would suit the Dapol N gauge 12' chassis which is available as a spare if used in 3mm/ft, as are N gauge coach bogies.

 

Motorised Chassis: Plenty of choice for 9mm gauge from Japanese Manufacturers, I've not looked greatly into TT yet but anything with Bemo on looks expensive and I'm not certain that aftermarket chassis are available or can be easily converted to 12mm.

 

Pantographs: More choice and availability in HO scale, although there are a few available in Continental TT such as the Sommerfeldt 882.

 

Couplings: Not so much a case of which to use, but what- I think the typical narrow gauge Centre buffer type wouldn't look too amiss for either scale as it is reasonably close to the large centre buffer of the prototype. 

 

Buildings: There aren't too many at Bunyola and these would need to be scratchbuilt in either scale anyway, but something that impressed me from seeing San Maria Gandia yesterday was the use of suitably altered HO scale American structures.

 

Road Vehicles: Not a problem in HO, just a few possibilities in 3mm.

 

Scenery & Trees: Greater range of scenic accessories in HO scale, but not a stumbling block in 3mm as continental TT or N could be used as a forced perspective.

 

Gauge accuracy: This is the stumbling block for me, HOm is just over 5" too wide, and if you're going to have that level of inaccuracy then you might as well go for HOe and the easier 9mm gauge which is the same amount too narrow...

 

So, based on all of those ramblings, what do you think would be the most suitable scale and track gauge to model the line in using readily available commercial parts where possible...?

 

 

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What's wrong with the exact scale representation using 12mm track and 4mm scale? Since most of your work is scratch built, and suitable vehicles should be available, it seems the perfect choice.

As for propulsion, just looking at Bemo prices is eye watering, but you can pick from TT manufacturers, such as Piko and Roco for more affordable solutions, and if you check motorbogies.com they have a wide variety of 12mm gauge power units, from the likes of Halling and Bullant, at prices around a third of Bemo.

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I have toyed with the idea of modelling 3' gauge myself, and because I was not feeling very confident at chassis building, I decided that 1:100 was the way to go.

 

Having said that, because it was an odd scale, the enthusiasm waned a bit, and the freelance micro layout we were building is now gathering dust in my son's room.

 

I still think that 1:100 is an interesting scale, and is actually extremely well catered for by the architectural modelling market.

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What's wrong with the exact scale representation using 12mm track and 4mm scale? Since most of your work is scratch built, and suitable vehicles should be available, it seems the perfect choice.

As for propulsion, just looking at Bemo prices is eye watering, but you can pick from TT manufacturers, such as Piko and Roco for more affordable solutions, and if you check motorbogies.com they have a wide variety of 12mm gauge power units, from the likes of Halling and Bullant, at prices around a third of Bemo.

Thanks for the link, I did briefly look at Hollywood Foundry to see what is broadly available.

 

I hadn't considered anything larger than HO because the Soller Railway trains are quite long at Motor + six coaches, and I would like to fit a passing loop onto two manageable boards without comprising the train length.

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Pecos do H0n3 track (10.5mm gauge).

Remember some 9mm wheels can probably be eased out to 10.5mm and 12mm ones pushed in. For locos, use Gibson wheels on silver steel axles cut to the right length.

 

Halling motor bogies can be bought in 9mm or 12mm versions, so probably you could get a 12mm one and push the wheels in to 10.5mm

 

When choosing a scale - locos and stock you're probably ok scratch building, but figures, vehicles etc. are often trickier so you're best off choosing a scale where those are available.

Edited by brack
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  • RMweb Gold

The Peco HOn3 is spot on for gauge but you'll need more work on regauging mechanisms or something like the Hollywood foundry option. With the wood stock it might be worth asking Worsley Works what it would cost for etch bodies if you have the drawings. 12mm is easier with the tt and Piko, Tillig and Roco chassis options too plus bogies and wagon chassis to choose from. I'd find a front on image of the real thing and manipulate the gauge to see how much it affects the look.

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Given how satisfying large scale models can be, you could consider really pushing the boat out and going to 10mm (or 1/32 to taste) on 0 track :D.

 

Or, as you have to scratchbuild all your stock, you could try S scale on 16:5 mm track!

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1/100 scale, TT3, is reasonably well served. Military wargaming 15mm is stated to be 1/100 scale. Most buildings are Northern Europe(but I have found some which are more Mediteranean). If you are scatchbuild , then it does not matter, and remember that many building kits , said to be HO are actually nearer 1/100 scale.

Vehicles are a problem, but Preiser actually do a trio of cyclists. It is worth while checking out the wargaming suppliers, but most are WW2 period.

Big advantage is the low cost and easy availability of Japanese N gauge chassis.

I also know that some French modellers have managed to extend the 9mm gauge axles to suit 12mm gauge.

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Pressing wheels out to 10.5 from 9mm should be possible on most N gauge chassis with minimal trouble if you drop the wheels out to do it and would allow HOe or 009 chassis and kits to be considered as sources too. Certainly Bemo HOe axles are long enough as they use the same sets pushed out for 12mm. With any 009 kits you could just space the side frames to accommodate the longer axles.

Edited by PaulRhB
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Or, as you have to scratchbuild all your stock, you could try S scale on 16:5 mm track!

This works out at 3' 6" gauge - not 3'! I have used it for modelling New Zealand stuff in the past. Proper 3' gauge track is, however, available for S Scale.

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and 5.5mm/ft is 1:55.4

EM track is pretty close to metre gauge in 5.5mm/ft and even closer to 3'6" although then you might as well build it to scale.

 

For narrow gauge, I'd be tempted to go for a larger scale, but I take your point about the Soller train lengths. I'd still probably go for 5.5mm/ft with 16.5 track. The last narrow gauge I built was (approx ) 1:25!

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if you build your own track and possibly mechanisms then you can model any scale, but most modellers can't so compromise, hence OO9 and O16.5, both of which stretch 2ft(60cm) gauge stock to fit the wider gauge. Nothing wrong in that, and it means it is also OK for other scale/gauges.

I

 also model in 5.5mm/ft for metre gauge on 16.5mmtrack, having looked at S, but loco too small for chassis. Also lots more wargaming(28mm 1/56) available.

One of the best French metre gauge layouts built is Pempoul, and even there it uses EM instead of correct gauge, for practical reasons, and still looks superb.

Edited by rue_d_etropal
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I'd find a front on image of the real thing and manipulate the gauge to see how much it affects the look.

That's a good idea, fortunately there isn't anything on the stock that obviously dictates the gauge (ie cylinders or splashers on a steam loco). TBH the prototypes would look like thgeyre teetering on the edge of balance if their gauge was any narrower...*

 

For narrow gauge, I'd be tempted to go for a larger scale, but I take your point about the Soller train lengths. I'd still probably go for 5.5mm/ft with 16.5 track. The last narrow gauge I built was (approx ) 1:25!

I do have an under-used loop of SM32 in the Garden, but was planning to draw the stock in Sketchup for 3d printing, so the smaller the better. But perhaps not quite as small as 1/300 on T gauge...

 

* a bit like the pair of Bachmann G scale tram cars on 32mm gauge bogies that I converted to hauled trailers for the garden railway.

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I've just received a very nice reply from https://railnscale.com , saying unfortunately they can't scale up their models to 1/100 without a redesign, which they won't be doing. I was hoping to use a few of their items for the intended project, but basing it around people and road vehicles would be like the tail wagging the dog, as there are other ways around these issues.

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Given how satisfying large scale models can be, you could consider really pushing the boat out and going to 10mm (or 1/32 to taste) on 0 track :D.

 

 

Or, as you have to scratchbuild all your stock, you could try S scale on 16:5 mm track!

 

I have been toying with the idea of 3ft/1000mm gauge on 32mm track as a way to:

  • model some of the wonderful metre gauge electric lines in Spain and France
  • make something out of the 1:32/1:35 Timpo coaches that I have picked up here and there
  • be able to run said models on the same track as my SM32/16mm models (but not at the same time!)

 

The passenger section of the Timpo coaches would actually pass OK for the FC de Soller coaches with a new roof:-

http://www.figurenschnapp.de/Timpo-Toys-Rare-Mississippi-Santa-Fe-passenger-carriage-incl-Dr-Tripp

 

Although they are perhaps closer to the Sociedad Explotadora de Ferrocarriles y Tranvías stock from the San-Sebastian-Hendaye line (El Topo):-

http://www.spanishrailway.com/2012/05/07/ferrocarril-electrico-de-san-sebastian-a-la-frontera-ferrocarril-de-san-sebastian-a-hendaya-el-topo/

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  • 1 month later...

I use 1:100 and 9mm gauge track to represent metre gauge. It's a little bit under but let's not forget that unless we follow some proto-standard like P87 or P4 our wheels are wider than scale. The reason for not doing the obvious and going for HOm (which is incidentally half a millimeter overgauge for metre gauge) was train length. I could get an extra coach or an extra two freight cars onto trains, which was important given that long trains are the norm on my prototype. Dropping down to 1:160 on Z gauge would have given still longer trains but I have some Z gauge kit and I am not overly impressed with the running qualities. Using 1:120 and 9 mm gauge track was rejected as it was no better a scale-gauge ratio than 1:100.

 

Using 9mm gauge has proved a good decision. Mechanisms and wheels are readily available, though stuff intended for OO9 is often a better bet. I hand lay track but being able to use OO9 flex track and N-gauge points "off stage" saves a lot of time and bother

 

Scenery stuff is not a big issue. I have discovered that a lot of Faller and Kibri HO kits are effectively 1:100 when you take a ruler to them. I'm not interested in buildings but I have found that things like cement silos and other industrial clobber are 1:100. The Kibri tall crane which I bought to put on a building site matches the dimensions I found on the internet of a real one if it's 1:100, it's too small for 1:87.

 

As 1:100 is an architectural scale, figures and the like are available. Preiser does 1:100 figures and they are also available over the internet from China at give-away prices. The Chinese traders are however loosey-goosey over the difference between 1:100 and HO and some sold as one are in fact the other. I did obtain a large bag of 1:100 scale cars which are right.

 

Over on Shapeways there is a fair amount of 1:100 detailing bits available - aircon units, power transformers (for overhead cable runs), even desktop computer equipment. There is more for 1:87 but an email to the designer usually gets a favourable response and a rescaling.

 

So all in all I do not regret my choice.

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  • 3 years later...

I've resurrected this thread because the SketchUp drawing I've been working on for a Soller Motor is advanced enough to try printing. The current thinking is to model in 1:100 using a Tomytec TM13R chassis and Sommerfeldt 882 pantographs, but having brought a set of the latter and tried them for size on the Soller coach I printed last year, they look as undersized as HO scale ones look oversized. The rest of the equipment I've designed (coach and a few wagons fit nicely on n gauge wagon chassis but I've only printed the former so far), but another option is to follow the lines of Kato's banzai RhB and decrease the body scale to 1:120 to suit the TT scale pantographs but still retain it on n gauge track, using a chassis with 70mm bogie centres. This would obviously same some space on any planned layout but considering how up in the air the exhibition scene is at the moment and a lack of time to exhibit the 2/3 layouts I already have means a radical rethink might be in order.

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Well even without shows having a project keeps an essential little puddle of sanity going ;) 

TT9 sounds a good idea and there’s plenty of kits n bits to support the scale and in 3D prints too. Shows are great but they aren’t the reason for my modelling just a fun extension and with my job I only manage 4-5 a year including those I exhibit at so it sounds like I’m in a similar position on free weekends. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

First "successful" print of the Soller Motor, the wagons less so because of the lack of supports and me not accounting for resin shrinkage in their fit onto their chassis. The motor looks too tall but I put that down to not having any differentiation between us the body and the black box frame section below it. I'm still unsure of what scale to use because although I like the idea of 1:100, the pantographs don't and their appearance looks jarring once noticed....

PXL_20210127_140826109.jpg

PXL_20210127_140922714.jpg

PXL_20210127_140937355.jpg

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