RMweb Gold teaky Posted October 29, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted October 29, 2017 I run a string line from one side to the other so they're all in line.....just saying... They won't stay like that. I wouldn't be able to stand it. The eaves will need cleaning once the scaffolding has gone and I'll be able to tweak things then. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted October 30, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted October 30, 2017 All windows are in. Tile vents for soil vent pipes re-positioned and fitted. I've just been up and connected the flexible pipes to both of them and redirected the pipe on one of them. The other will need a pipe cutting and refitting which one of us will sort out tomorrow. Then a few brackets to secure them to the wall and that'll be another small job done. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted October 31, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted October 31, 2017 Floor joists and cutting webs Large wooden joists have gone in today, the ends of which sit on the bottom plates of the steel beams. These are doubled up around the opening for the stairs. I could have done this task myself but there are a couple of dozen joists plus noggings and at 40kg each the thought of manhandling each one up two flights of stairs and in through a small hatch prior to fitting wasn’t appealing and it is fairly swift job for three experienced builders, especially since the joists can be passed up the scaffolding and in via a hole in the roof. The roof itself is supported by the beefier rafters and the steel beams. The floor is supported by new joists between the steel beams. The steel beams transfer the load to the end walls. The horizontal parts of the original roof trusses now have no other job to do than to hold up the first floor ceiling (plaster, plasterboard, mesh and insulation) which they are perfectly capable of doing. The triangulating webs which were originally a key part of the structure of the roof can now be cut and the builders have been taking them out one at a time as they progress along the loft installing the floor joists. The builders are about three fifths of the way through this task so it will be finished tomorrow. I will take some photos then. At the lead builder's suggestion I have emailed the BCO and requested an inspection on Thursday. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted October 31, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted October 31, 2017 I cannot get in the loft this evening because the original access hatch is now blocked and I have yet to cut a new one. Before the builders closed up the roof I went up and had a look. It was great to be able to stand on a sheet of flooring, on top of the joists, with most of the old webs out of the way and to get a real feeling for the size of the space and the amount of headroom there will be. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 1, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 1, 2017 All floor joists are now in. Just a few noggings to complete the task. Before (posted previously): After (less than half the loft is in shot but you get the idea): One of the soil vent pipes awaits completion. The flue is temporarily disconnected. When I went to adjust it last weekend the adjustable bend at the bottom end just fell apart. I'm not convinced I broke it and actually suspect it may have been like that from when the house was built. I looked at fixing it but it isn't that simple and since it is a safety critical component I've ordered a new bend. In case anyone is wondering, I asked the builders to leave the last of the original rafters/webs in place. I am going to add further battens and use this to form the frame for boxing in the soil pipes. 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgman Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 (edited) Always a good stage to reach, gives you heart and I'm sure you're already visualising a completed room. Edited November 1, 2017 by bgman Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 1, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 1, 2017 I've just remembered. The installation of the floor joists revealed that there is a discrepancy in the gap between the steels beams. They are further apart at one end than at the other by a whole 2mm ! 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold chris p bacon Posted November 1, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 1, 2017 I've just remembered. The installation of the floor joists revealed that there is a discrepancy in the gap between the steels beams. They are further apart at one end than at the other by a whole 2mm ! I'd tell the builders, as if that was us, we'd open it out to at least 30mm. . . .. takes a lot to keep the reputation we've got. . . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 2, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2017 I'm not sure they're proper builders. I caught them eating sandwiches with salad in followed by fruit. Surely no proper builder would be without some form of pastry?! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted November 2, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2017 Rather than a whole flat wall to box in / hide the pipes, could you include some enclosed shelving as a feature ? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 2, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2017 Rather than a whole flat wall to box in / hide the pipes, could you include some enclosed shelving as a feature ? I have been considering an option of just boxing in the lower section once I know the exact route of the second soil vent pipe. This would create a narrow shelf. I like your idea though. Definitely worthy of further thought. That would probably be a neater solution. Thanks Stu. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold chris p bacon Posted November 2, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2017 I'm not sure they're proper builders. I caught them eating sandwiches with salad in followed by fruit. Surely no proper builder would be without some form of pastry?! That sounds a bit suspicious, check their van for pasty crumbs as it sounds like they're trying to mislead you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 2, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2017 An 'interesting' day today. It turned out that they completed all the noggings yesterday. The additional tile vents to provide ridge-level ventilation have been installed. I didn't manage to get a photo before it went dark but they are neat and tidy. These are to ventilate the gap between the felt and the insulation (see earlier posts). The replacement bend for the flue arrived this afternoon so I'll be able to get that connected at the weekend. The builder kindly cut the soil vent pipe which will allow me to finish connecting that too. Restraint straps have also gone in to tie the new rafters and the end walls together. The builders finished bricking up the steel beams. Largely a day of finishing things. All the builder's "inside" tasks are now complete and tomorrow will see them mixing mortar and repointing the verges. And whilst they are at it they will look at some additional repointing I asked them to do. Tomorrow should see most of this completed I think but it may run into Monday. I managed to finish fitting a couple of new doors inside which just need architrave cutting and fitting. These form the entrance to the converted loft and a slimmed down airing cupboard. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 2, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2017 Today was also inspection day. The BCO turned up, expressed astonishment at the size of the steel beams, had a good look around the loft, asked the builders a few questions, commented on several things and said good a lot and then said he wasn't happy with the short posts between the steel beams and the rafters. We discussed this and I said I'd speak to the Structural Engineer. The BCO thought that the short posts wouldn't be strong enough and might disintegrate when subjected to a crushing load e.g. heavy snow. He suggested it might be necessary to fix ply plates and/or metal angle brackets to each side of the posts in order to tie them to the rafters more firmly. I phoned the Structural Engineer this afternoon and after he stopped laughing he explained that even if the timbers were smaller section than we have here and were 2.5m long they would still be up to the job they were being asked to do. I exchanged emails with him including photos and details of how the posts were fixed in place# and he confirmed in writing that it was all compliant with Building Regs. I have since forwarded a copy to Building Control. Hopefully that one's dealt with. # For anyone who is interested in such details the posts are the same timber as the rafters (150 x 75mm) and fixed with glue, two 80mm screws on each side driven diagonally down into the timber plate, a fifth screw driven from the front and a 120mm larger gauge screw driven up into the rafter via a drilled and countersunk hole so that at least 75mm is in the rafter. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 2, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2017 (edited) The BCO also made another comment regarding the ridge ventilation which he thought was insufficient. I think he's wrong but I'll have to go digging for information to demonstrate this. BTW I'm not feeling bad about this inspection. Oddly, it's nice to know there is someone ensuring things are done correctly. He's on my side. I trust the builders I am using but anyone unfortunate enough to engage some cowboy builders would benefit from this kind of protection. It's what I am paying for after all. Edited November 2, 2017 by teaky 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 2, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2017 Oh, and as a final item the BCO suggested a type of insulation that might be worth considering. I've tracked down the manufacturer's website and had a quick skim and it certainly looks worthy of consideration. Further research required before I commit to buying insulation. There are still things to do before I get to installing insulation, so that's fine. The insulation is called Hybris and made by a company called Actis. If anyone knows anything about this stuff, please let me know. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgman Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Hi Rob, Re: Hybris Its a new one to me, mind you i've been retired from Building Control for over three years so these products do evolve. Its not too dissimilar to one I have seen in the past. One comment I would make on the foil insulations is that some people have had reception problems with tv's etc when the ariels have been left in the roof space. Not a major issue but thought I would mention it. Glad to hear your BCO is being helpful. Grahame 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 4, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 4, 2017 No update yesterday as we were attending our eldest son's graduation ceremony. The builders were still at work though and finished putting the remaining roof tiles back into place and made decent progress on pointing the verges. They'll be back on Monday to finish the pointing and re-point a few other areas which I asked them to look at whist they were up there. I'm not sure they will complete everything on Monday but it isn't impossible. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 4, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 4, 2017 I went up top this morning once it finished raining and took a couple of snaps of the tile vents. They look quite neat and tidy now they're in. I'm glad I went for this option. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 4, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 4, 2017 (edited) I've been busy with some of those smaller tasks which always seem to take longer than you expect. I started with cutting a hole in the ceiling where the stairs will be. It isn't large enough for the stairs at this stage. I have simply taken out some plasterboard between a pair of the ceiling rafters. This allows me to get into the loft from inside the house once more which I haven't been able to do since Wednesday when the floor joists went in. I then took out the old hatch and, with a few battens, fitted it to the new access hole so that it limits the loss of warm air for the time being. I have fitted a few battens around the edge and across the centre of the original hatch opening and made a start on covering it with some of the plasterboard taken from the new temporary opening. This is a bit of an experiment and I am re-using the plasterboard because we have a random plaster textured finish to the ceilings. If I don't like the result then it will simply act as a base for a new coat of plaster at the same time as the new loft room is plastered. So the only time I'd lose would be for the fiddling about trying to disguise the joints. Next I finished the remaining soil vent pipe. The builder had kindly sawn the pipe where requested using a reciprocating saw in what would have been an awkward space to use a hand saw. (Taking the pipe out wasn't an option since the lower joint is now behind the steel beam.) No more soil vent pipes to fiddle with now. (Stu - I don't think your idea of putting a display cabinet/shelves is going to work. Pity. It was appealing. Once the pipes and the nearby flue are boxed in there will be so little wall space left that it isn't worth the effort.) I then moved on to the flue. This proved to be impossible to do single-handed. It is two lengths of straight pipe between two adjustable bends. To engage the flue pipe you line up the dimples, push together then twist. I simply couldn't get the twist bit done due to the adjustable bends being designed to rotate and the diameter of the flue being too large to grip with one hand (knees, feet and armpits don't work either!). I think it will be easier once there is someone around to assist. Then there is sweeping and vacuuming up all the mess. Once the hatch and entrance area are sorted I will be able to move tools and materials into the loft. As a result I won't need to tidy everything away at the end of each day and, other than moving materials up the stairs, mess will be restricted to the loft (which will certainly please my wife). Edited November 4, 2017 by teaky 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 5, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 5, 2017 Finished the flue with assistance from my son. Almost finished patching the old hatch but ran out of filler. Measured various heights and did some thinking about the best approach to things. I have established that there will be sufficient headroom (at least 2m) to have a flat section down the centre of the ceiling with insulation above and a gap above that near the apex which means that the air spaces between all the rafters will be linked together. Therefore, the BCO will be satisfied without me needing to explain why the vents are OK as they are. I like this idea anyway because not only does the airflow improve but it will allow me to fit some LED down lighters in a tidy fashion. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 5, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 5, 2017 It occurs to me that I should point out that we do not have a gas fire. The moment you bring a gas supply and appliance into the equation any work on the flue should be done by a Gas Safe registered professional. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 6, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 6, 2017 Verges and ridge tiles repointed. A neat job with cement dye included to darken the mortar to a shade similar to the roof tiles. Everything was left neat and tidy. I will definitely be recommending them to anyone who asks and they will be top of my list if I need a builder in the future. I called the skip company too and rather than the "two to three days" quoted, it has already been taken away. The driver also managed to prune a crab apple next to the drive at the same time. Suits me, as it was on my to do list. I was planning to use a saw and some loppers myself but a skip lorry works just fine! I did get the loppers out to cut the pruned branches down and the driver helped me put them into the skip then took them away. What service. The builder is due to return first thing tomorrow to go through the payment(s). Scaffolding is scheduled for removal on Wednesday. Judging by tomorrow's weather forecast it should be nice and clean by then. 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 7, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2017 All the builders' work is now complete. I have discussed the final invoice and payments. Everything looks good to me and the BCO is satisfied so I have just paid. I don't like to keep small businesses waiting when cash flow can be important. It's down to me from now on. Eeek! 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted November 7, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2017 It sounds like you've had a first class service all round. Good to hear in these days when so many cowboys do shoddy work. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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