Teaky's attic

[Mallard60022]

Blimey Teaky that is a first class job and I am now very jealous. If I'd still been in FT work I may have gone for a decent 'opening out' conversion with 'frills'. As it is and as you know, SOSJ sits in an 'unconverted' loft space except for the various reinforcements for the floor and removal of the header tanks etc. My budget wouldn't really allow for more as I spend far too much on 'toys'!

You will have such a wonderful space. I look forward to seeing it 'develop'.

Congratulations and ATB.

Phil

[teaky]

On 02/11/2017 at 21:06, teaky said:

Oh, and as a final item the BCO suggested a type of insulation that might be worth considering.  I've tracked down the manufacturer's website and had a quick skim and it certainly looks worthy of consideration.  Further research required before I commit to buying insulation.  There are still things to do before I get to installing insulation, so that's fine.

 

The insulation is called Hybris and made by a company called Actis.  If anyone knows anything about this stuff, please let me know.

After reading the manufacturers website and attached literature then doing some searching for alternative/independent views on this insulation I am not convinced it will perform as claimed and I have decided to stick with PIR insulation as originally planned.  It won't be as easy to install and will be messy but I am more confident that it will do what is required.

Edited August 11, 2022 by teaky
Typo

[teaky]

Blimey Teaky that is a first class job and I am now very jealous. If I'd still been in FT work I may have gone for a decent 'opening out' conversion with 'frills'. As it is and as you know, SOSJ sits in an 'unconverted' loft space except for the various reinforcements for the floor and removal of the header tanks etc. My budget wouldn't really allow for more as I spend far too much on 'toys'!

You will have such a wonderful space. I look forward to seeing it 'develop'.

Congratulations and ATB.

Phil

Thanks Phil.  Since I'm doing the rest of the work myself, I'm sure I'll be able to get the 'first class' job down to 'second rate' by the time it's finished. 

[Mallard60022]

After reading the manufacturers website and attached literature then doing some searching for alternative/independent views on this insulation I an not convinced it will perform as claimed and I have decided to stick with PIR insulation as originally planned.  It won't be as easy to install and will be messy but I am more confident that it will do what is required.

The foil stuff is good but needs a 'professional' that is actually trained to do that sort of thing correctly. My stuff was put in by nice but dim and I had to take remedial action, with ventilation. However the material does work well especially in summer.

Phil

[teaky]

The scaffolders arrived just before 08:00 this morning and made great progress taking the scaffolding down.  True to form they stopped for a break at 11:30 and I haven't seen them since!   

 

They really are in a world of their own aren't they.  I'm hoping they will be back tomorrow to remove the scaffolding from the back of the house and half way along both sides but who knows. 

 

It hasn't impacted me much though.  I've been finishing off the loft entrance which is almost done.  Just need a few bits of trim which I'll go and buy tomorrow.

[chris p bacon]

What tends to happen is they fill the truck with the top lifts or the front/sides then take that to another job to erect. Most of the trucks they use are 7.5 ton with long beds on so although they look as though they can get a lot on it they can't take the weight.

 

When I paint the fascia on the house I have to have it scaffolded, each time it takes 3+ lorry loads of scaffold and board.

[teaky]

What tends to happen is they fill the truck with the top lifts or the front/sides then take that to another job to erect. Most of the trucks they use are 7.5 ton with long beds on so although they look as though they can get a lot on it they can't take the weight.

 

When I paint the fascia on the house I have to have it scaffolded, each time it takes 3+ lorry loads of scaffold and board.

That makes sense.  They do have a 7.5 ton long bed.  I did wonder if they were doing two jobs at once.  It also fits with the sequence and arrival time when they put it up in the first place.  Funnily enough they erected it over parts of three days too.

[chris p bacon]

It's also cheaper to store it at your house too. . . . .

[teaky]

The scaffolders must have another job with building work scheduled to start on Monday.  They returned at 08:30 to finish removing everything from the back half of the house.  Hooray!

[teaky]

I'm just having a cup of tea after undercoating the slimmed down airing cupboard and new/revised door frame.  Surprising how an otherwise simple task becomes more tiring when you can't quite get into the space to paint and have to reach in and do most of the painting left handed.  It's taken me over an hour and that's just the first coat.

 

I also slapped some emulsion onto the filler I put in/on last night where I had patched the old loft hatch.  It needs a little more filler in a few places in order to take the eye away from the square outline but it looks like I may get away with it and not have to get the whole landing ceiling re-plastered.  So I'm happy about that.

 

Finishing these small tasks will mean I can clear my tools and materials from the landing.  My wife has been at a conference in Portugal since Tuesday so I set myself a target of having things tidy by her return tomorrow afternoon.  This is probably the only task which has a deadline, albeit self imposed.  Everything else I can just steadily plod my way through.

[Stubby47]

Nowt wrong with doing things left handed...

[chris p bacon]

Was boarding the loft part of the builders contract?  If not I wouldn't go too far with decorating until you've got the boards upstairs as at 8'x2' they're a bit awkward and can easily scrape edges. 

Same goes for plasterboard.

[teaky]

On 10/11/2017 at 10:39, chris p bacon said:

Was boarding the loft part of the builders contract?  If not I wouldn't go too far with decorating until you've got the boards upstairs as at 8'x2' they're a bit awkward and can easily scrape edges. 

Same goes for plasterboard.

No, not the builders, that's one of my jobs.

 

Thanks for the warning but fear not, I am not going beyond undercoat until everything is done.  Just having door frames in white is enough to take away the feeling of living in a building site for the rest of the family even if is matt.

 

You're right about the boards being awkward.  In order to give the builders something more substantial to stand on I put 9 boards in the loft and it took some energy.  The first floor ceiling is just too low for the boards to stand upright and they would only go through the old hatch on the diagonal.  Fortunately my eldest son helped by standing in the loft and taking them off me.  I currently have another 7 sitting in the car waiting to go up but I'm hoping they will be a little easier with the slightly larger new opening.

 

I've decided to go for the smaller (1.8 x 0.9m) sheets of plasterboard in order to make handling easier.  Entry through the new hatch might be tricky but at least there will be no problems with standing them up and getting through doorways.  It seemed worth the extra cost.  (That reminds me: I must measure the size of the temporary opening to make sure everything fits.)

Edited August 11, 2022 by teaky
Typos

[Fastdax]

Teaky - we need pictures of your new manspace! :-)

[Mallard60022]

No, not the builders, that's one of my jobs.

 

Thanks for the warning but fear not, I am not going beyond undercoat until everything is done.  Just having door frames in white is enough to take away the feeling of living in a building site for the rest of the family even if is matt.

 

You're right about the boards being awkward.  In order to give the builders something more substantial to stand on I put 9 boards in the loft and it took some energy.  The first floor ceiling is just too low for the boards to stand upright and they would only go through the old hatch at on the diagonal.  Fortunately my eldest son helped by standing in the loft and taking them off me.  I currently have another 7 sitting in the car waiting to go up but I'm hoping they will be a little easier with the slightly larger new opening.

 

I've decided to go for the smaller (1.8 x 0.9m) sheets of plasterboard in order to make handling easier.  Entry through the new hatch might be tricky but at least there will be no problems with standing them up and getting through doorways.  It seemed worth the extra cost.  (That rinds me: I must measure the size of the temporary opening to make sure everything fits.)

Drill two small holes in one end of the board. Loop a 'rope' through those to make a long, loopy 'handle' and hoist em up. You may still need a 'Banksman/woman' but they won't have to heave ho as much. I did that with some layout baseboards, full scenic from an existing bought in, ex exhibition layout, many years ago. It was so easy.

ATB Phil

Edited November 10, 2017 by Mallard60022

[teaky]

Teaky - we need pictures of your new manspace! :-)

Thanks for your interest Duncan, but I'm afraid it has hardly changed since post 155.  The most recent jobs have been those fiddly little things that take up a disproportionate amount of time.  Other stuff is completely invisible as it is nothing more than measuring and thinking but that should pay off later.

 

I'll see what I can do tomorrow after I get my son to assist with getting more flooring panels in and after today's painting has dried.

[Richard_A]

Are you just using a loft hatch and ladder for your room?

 

I thought you'd need a staircase in

[teaky]

Are you just using a loft hatch and ladder for your room?

 

I thought you'd need a staircase in

At present I get into the loft via a hole in the ceiling and some stepladders in what was the airing cupboard.  The staircase will eventually go into the same space after I have cut through the back wall of the airing cupboard and pinched some space from the built-in wardrobes behind.

 

I ordered the staircase earlier this week and it is due before the end of the month.

[teaky]

A less productive morning than I would want due to fixing my son's car.

 

The flooring panels are in the house at least and we figured out the best way to manoeuvre them up into the loft.  It may be a three man task but perhaps not.  Either way, my son is off to work after he has finished his lunch so the panels will have to stay where they are for now.  At least the next step will be completed quickly.

 

Although not actually of the new loft room itself, I have managed to take a few snaps.

 

The revised airing cupboard.

 

The entrance arrangements: cupboard to the left and loft entrance to the right.  Originally this was a slightly wider door to the right (opening the other way) and blank wall to the left with a larger airing cupboard which once housed the hot water cylinder too.

 

[teaky]

Although it wouldn't be good enough in, say, the lounge, I'm happy enough with the ceiling patching where the old loft hatch used to be.

 

It looks less convincing close up but the main thing is that it doesn't catch your eye so you only see it if you're looking for it.

 

At present, I am not planning to have the ceiling re-plastered.

 

And with those exciting photos of a ceiling I'm downing tools for the day because a) my wife is home today and b) the autumn internationals are on the telly.

 

[Mallard60022]

A less productive morning than I would want due to fixing my son's car.

 

The flooring panels are in the house at least and we figured out the best way to manoeuvre them up into the loft.  It may be a three man task but perhaps not.  Either way, my son is off to work after he has finished his lunch so the panels will have to stay where they are for now.  At least the next step will be completed quickly.

 

Although not actually of the new loft room itself, I have managed to take a few snaps.

 

The revised airing cupboard.

cupboard.jpg

 

The entrance arrangements: cupboard to the left and loft entrance to the right.  Originally this was a slightly wider door to the right (opening the other way) and blank wall to the left with a larger airing cupboard which once housed the hot water cylinder too.

entrance1.JPG

Is that the fire door Teaky? I might consider having one put in the door space in the small bedroom from which the loft ladder ascends to my space. The 'escape route' is out a fully opening window in that room.

P

Edited November 11, 2017 by Mallard60022

[teaky]

Is that the fire door Teaky? I might consider having one put in the door space in the small bedroom from which the loft ladder ascends to my space. The 'escape route' is out a fully opening window in that room.

P

Yes it is Phil.  In fact, all four of the doors in that picture are fire doors.  To comply with regs. it is necessary to create a fire proof corridor to the exit, so in my case that means all the doors on the landing and in the hall have been changed except for the bathroom & downstairs toilet.

 

The narrow door on the cupboard probably did not need to be a fire door but it was easier to chop down a solid door than to cut and re-brace a hollow one and with it being right next door to the loft stairs it makes me more comfortable.  At the moment the dividing wall between the cupboard and where the new staircase will go is just a sheet of structural ply with bracing but the plan is to face the walls on either side of the stairs with fire rated plasterboard.  Possibly this is overkill but I'll only be spending an extra £20 to do this.

 

I recommend having a look on eBay for fire doors.  Check the description and sizes carefully and if you're collecting don't forget fire doors are heavier than standard doors.  (Oh, and "used" is fine, just not "fire tested" !)  If you read the appropriate part of the Building Regulations Approved Documents it will tell you what to look out for in terms of certification labels.

Edited November 11, 2017 by teaky

[bgman]

Just to clarify the use of FD's, it isn't necessary to have them in bathrooms or wc's as you quite correctly say Rob, however, I would be very guarded when/if purchasing " used " firedoors and check if there are any labels still attached to them ( usually found on the tops of them ) and if you decide to purchase any "second hand" run it passed your local BCO who is there to help.

 

FWIW..... Its not worth skimping on fire safety, I'm sure many viewers would agree, and there are quite a few unscrupulous sellers who would be happy to pass on doors as approved FD's. During my career as a BCO I had to ( happily ) reject quite a few doors for obvious reasons, and despite the initial upset I was thanked for my intervention later during the builds.

Edited November 11, 2017 by bgman

[teaky]

Sound advice there bgman.  I have added a sentence to the end of my previous post directing people to the Approved Document.

 

I purchased some used fire doors previously but they all had labels.  I only wanted one but the seller wanted to get rid of all seven or not at all and they were assorted sizes and styles.  I ended up using the best one and cutting others to make the sides and top of a unit to house appliances in the utility which means we have a fire proof utility unit.  Sadly, no one wanted to buy the leftovers so, lacking the space to store them, they were sawn up and taken to the wood recycling skip at the tip.  The scrapped/recycled doors weren't that attractive since they had come out of an office and since I paid only £7.50 + £2.50 in petrol for all seven it wasn't a financial loss.

 

The doors I have used this time are seconds with only small faults/blemishes and come from the manufacturer, complete with appropriate labels.

[teaky]

This simple bit of boxing in seems to have taken me ages.

 

 

Using the original truss rafter at the end of the room I have added horizontal and vertical pieces.  They could be straighter but it isn't critical as long as they coincide with the joints of the plasterboard and give something to screw into.

 

I have also boxed in the flue and ensured that there is the required 50mm separation between the flue and any combustible material, and you can just about see the pieces of fire proof board that I have also fitted to separate the flue from the soil vent pipes where they exit through the roof tiles.