Nearholmer Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 (edited) This raises the vital question of whether the "pre-grouping" of the title refers to a date limitation, at an exact date yet to be established, or to a limitation relating to combination, and, if so, which combination or combinations. For instance, the urban railways in London "grouped" progressively over many years, culminating in the formation of the LPTB in 1933. Clearly, things were not fully "grouped" in that case, until this later date, possibly even later, if transfers of lines are to be discussed, although groups had been formed as early as c1902. This then, is a dating question. But, these urban railways were not "grouped" into the Big Four, so are they included, or not? This is a question relating to admissible combinations. Determination of the above will, I suggest, automatically resolve the Talyllyn Question, and possibly even The West Lothian Question. It might also be wise to resolve at an early stage what, in this context, constitutes a pedant. After all, one man's pedantry is another man's reasonable attention to detail. And, 'weekly': should this be read to mean that it is issued at seven-daily intervals, or that it will be issued once within the span of each calendar week? Very different things, I'm sure you'll all agree. Edited September 9, 2017 by Nearholmer 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 As no one seemed to be keen on my "First 100 Years" solution, how about "Pre 1923"? It would actually suit me better if it were "Pre 1914", or "Pre-Modern Image" as I think of it, but I'm willing to compromise . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 (edited) In another thread I light-heartedly suggested that I would like to see a magazine entitled Pre-Grouping Pedants, although I thought it would have a very limited circulation. Well I think you have probably gathered there's nothing light-hearted about using correct grammatical language, an open can of worms I believe to be your least worry (or is that worries?) at present. We haven't even started to look at syntax and morphology, let alone phonology and semantics. At least there's likely to be plenty of 'ologies in this topic . Edited September 9, 2017 by Penlan 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 "........but I'm willing to compromise." Oh, deary me! I'm afraid that it is barely worth the cost of the ink involved in making an application to become a subscriber. The Board will surely not accept such thinking; the very essence of pedantry is that every detail, however tiny and inconsequential, is vitally important. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 I have an American friend (I know I know surprising isn't it, I do have friends) she collects antiques and uses the term Victorian which as I've pointed out being a traitorous ungrateful former colonist its not really a relevant term for her and her fellow country folk To which she'll shrug and say its a handy cut off reference date which is how I believe we should approach this using the grouping as a general date regardless of whether the particular company was part of the main grouping or not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talltim Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 What about railways that closed before the grouping? Or even track layouts or infrastructure that was removed or replaced before such date? Chronologically pre-grouping, but the grouping never happened to them Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talltim Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Of course when Australians talk about something being Victorian, they may be talking geographically rather than chronologically. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 "........but I'm willing to compromise." Oh, deary me! I'm afraid that it is barely worth the cost of the ink involved in making an application to become a subscriber. The Board will surely not accept such thinking; the very essence of pedantry is that every detail, however tiny and inconsequential, is vitally important. Pistols at dawn then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runs as required Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 What about railways that closed before the grouping? Or even track layouts or infrastructure that was removed or replaced before such date? Chronologically pre-grouping, but the grouping never happened to them And nowt abowt the Lanky nor the Norf Lundin 'cos they'd been merged down into the LNW just before the grouping. dh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Surely the only word in the title that isn't awfully ambiguous is 'pre', meaning before, or prior to. Anything that happened before "grouping" must be admissible, even if, for the time being at least, exactly what "grouping" means is unresolved. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Northroader Posted September 9, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 9, 2017 Ere, young Poggy, you got this going, a day later and it's on the third page, what have you done?? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brack Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 I don't mean to spoil all the silliness but at some point we probably ought to stop having fun and talk about er, non-postgrouping trains and stuff. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Actually by RMweb standards I think the discussion about the name went rather quick but I think your right time we moved on. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runs as required Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Actually by RMweb standards I think the discussion about the name went rather quick but I think your right time we moved on.But what exactly is "your right time" ? Travelling in a north-south direction or across east-west with the sun - and will Joyce of Whitchurch get a mention, or the mid day time signal telegraphed from Paddington. dh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Actually by RMweb standards I think the discussion about the name went rather quick but I think your right time we moved on. I have the feeling there's a comma or two missing in the above sentence... And as we are mentioning pre-grouping pedants, the Victorians and Edwardians - who could write - were very particular about there grammar etc., 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 (edited) I don't mean to spoil all the silliness but at some point we probably ought to stop having fun and talk about er, non-postgrouping trains and stuff. Silliness? Agreed, post-grouping is NOT in the scope of the OP, though wandering astray is perhaps in the best tradition of RMweb, but... Contributors to this topic are not talking, we are just typing or texting. Edited September 9, 2017 by Penlan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 But what exactly is "your right time" ? Travelling in a north-south direction or across east-west with the sun - and will Joyce of Whitchurch get a mention, or the mid day time signal telegraphed from Paddington. dh Joyce of Whitchurch, the epitome of Railway Time.... Occasionally, on the BBC "Bargain Hunt" the show visits the Joyce workshop in Whitchurch as it's now an auction room. Happily, there is a working clock mechanism just behind the auctioneers podium! http://www.trevanionanddean.com/about/ 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcD Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Should we be sponsoring some sort of awards, ie 'Rivet counter of the week', 'Pedant of the month'? If yes then could you nominate yourself? Marc Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 "....... there grammar." Discuss. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brack Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Contributors to this topic are not talking, we are just typing or texting. What, am I the only person who vocalises what I'm writing in a cut glass RP accent as I type? I'd assumed everyone did, if they aren't then suddenly this forum seems a lot less cultured. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Actually by RMweb standards I think the discussion about the name went rather quick but I think your right time we moved on. I have the feeling there's a comma or two missing in the above sentence... And as we are mentioning pre-grouping pedants, the Victorians and Edwardians - who could write - were very particular about there grammar etc., Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 What, am I the only person who vocalises what I'm writing in a cut glass RP accent as I type? I'd assumed everyone did, if they aren't then suddenly this forum seems a lot less cultured. You obviously haven't been here very long . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Northroader Posted September 9, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 9, 2017 (edited) should we really be contemplating the pre buyout era, rather than the pre grouping era, as this would expand the range further?(and it might help those of us with American spell checkers doing auto corrects) Edited September 9, 2017 by Northroader Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Modelling "pre-Grouping"? No different from the pre-Raphaelites, painting after, err, Raphael. He was my favourite turtle too. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 He was my favourite turtle too. Jason Nahhh. Donatello gets MY vote..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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