Kings Cross York Road & Suburban Platforms

[BrushVeteran]

 

 

The climb on hotel Curve was quite steep and as others have said a bit of a ###### to get a loaded train going from there, especially in the wet. But, the 31s were quite up to the job.

 

 

I can well remember Brush Type 2's (They weren't 31's at that stage) showing an array of pyrotechnics from the wheels when pulling the evening commuter trains out of Kings Cross on the final piece of the incline up Hotel curve, especially if the rails were damp. This was of course when they were still Mirrlees engined but when they received the EE power units there must have been improvements to the wheelslip prevention as the pyrotechnics seemed to cease. I also witnessed BR Sulzer type 2's on a couple of occasions unable to start the train away and having a pilot loco attached, causing havoc to the evening departures!

[manna]

G'Day All

 

I know you could come out of the Hotel curve tunnel with the engine flat out (30mph) shut off power, and with the gentlest of brake application, stop just before the end of the platform, once you'd stopped then you had to put the brake on hard, as there was catch points just inside the tunnel mouth.

 

manna

[roythebus]

G'Day All

 

I know you could come out of the Hotel curve tunnel with the engine flat out (30mph) shut off power, and with the gentlest of brake application, stop just before the end of the platform, once you'd stopped then you had to put the brake on hard, as there was catch points just inside the tunnel mouth.

 

manna

 

Yes, but I don't remember the catch points in the tunnel mouth. Maybe they were clipped shut when freight traffic ceased? But they you couldn't see anything in the tunnel and my drivers never mentioned them.

[chris p bacon]

As well as looking at York Rd for a cameo (ish) layout, I also thought about doing KX loco with Hotel curve platform.

 

That's the original KX loco.

 

 

I ought really to put some dimensions to it to see whether the idea floats or not.

 

Did a bit of research this evening (along with 2 Cambrian wagons) and it would have a scenic length of just under 2M and a width of 700mm (6'5" x 2'4")

 

I might investigate this further.

[manna]

Yes, but I don't remember the catch points in the tunnel mouth. Maybe they were clipped shut when freight traffic ceased? But they you couldn't see anything in the tunnel and my drivers never mentioned them.

G'Day All

 

I will admit, I never saw them, (to dark) but I was told they were about a coach length in, so you didn't want to roll back to far.

 

manna

[Guest]

Another unpublished photo for you:

crop0037.jpg

 

That's an interesting photo. Unless my eyes are playing tricks on me, the gas bottles bottom right would appear to be in the 4 foot, meaning the photo was taken after closure. Having said that, there would appear to be a couple of passengers on the platform. Curious. Great shot though.

[Guest]

Here's York Road and environs in 1895

 

KX-Curve-1895.gif

 

Although I knew of the historical existence of those two road bridges, that's perhaps the clearest map image that I've seen. For anyone wishing to model York Road in slightly more recent times and isn't afraid of the dreaded "modeller's license", the additional scenic breaks are a Godsend.

[31A]

That's an interesting photo. Unless my eyes are playing tricks on me, the gas bottles bottom right would appear to be in the 4 foot, meaning the photo was taken after closure. Having said that, there would appear to be a couple of passengers on the platform. Curious. Great shot though.

 

 

I think it's an optical illusion, and the gas bottles are on the low bank in front of the short siding - in fact, you can also see them in the picture in post 6 (note the relative positions of the location case and the speed restriction sign).

[MikeTrice]

That's an interesting photo. Unless my eyes are playing tricks on me, the gas bottles bottom right would appear to be in the 4 foot, meaning the photo was taken after closure. Having said that, there would appear to be a couple of passengers on the platform. Curious. Great shot though.

Photo in post number 6 was taken at same time and shows the position of the gas bottles.

[MikeTrice]

I've been toying with this idea but in the GN era and that track plan is nearly the same.

 

 I was thinking of doing something small to use at our club exhibition and to try a few techniques out before I cock  use them on 'Sandy'

 

Now will it fit in a cake box....

Depends on the size of the cakebox

[roythebus]

Here's a link to the 1933 Harsig signal box diagrams for the Met Line in 1933, this shows the layout of Kings Cross Met and widened Lines.

 

http://www.harsig.org/PDF/Met1933.pdf

[chris p bacon]

For those interested in Hotel curve and it's junction with what is now Thameslink there's this pic showing the start of the tunnel /curve

 

Now I think this is already somewhere else on RMweb, but I couldn't find the original posting of it so unable to credit it to it's owner.

[manna]

G'Day All.

 

Wish those lights were in use when I worked there.

 

manna

[Clive Mortimore]

G'Day All.

 

Wish those lights were in use when I worked there.

 

manna

I bet carrots were on the canteen menu every day.

[simon b]

I was sent this image, supposedly from one of those "urban exploration sites". I don't have the link, but I'm not convinced this is correct. The image is supposed to have been taken at the foot of the descent from York Road station but the gradient is not as steep as I was expecting. It shows 1 in 200 in one direction but having enlarged the image (and just made it more pixelated), the gradient in the other direction isn't any steeper. 1 in 200 doesn't strike me as particularly steep, as every reference I've seen on the web quotes "the line descends steeply and curves sharply away from York Road station into the northern portal of York Road tunnel". Hmm. Not  sure about this.

 

14.jpg

I'm sure I've seen that marker before, I could be wrong but I think that one is located in the tunnels under smithfeild market.

Edited November 6, 2017 by simon b

[Guest]

I'm sure I've seen that marker before, I could be wrong but I think that one is located in the tunnels under smithfeild market.

 

You're absolutely right. Since posting, I'd traced the image to this site (about 1/3 of the way down the page):

https://www.londonreconnections.com/2012/in-pictures-a-walk-on-the-widened-lines/

[rockershovel]

That picture of Hotel Curve reminds me of a past thought.. that a multi-level layout with cut-aways to show the various engineering styles would be a fascinating thing.

[simon b]

That picture of Hotel Curve reminds me of a past thought.. that a multi-level layout with cut-aways to show the various engineering styles would be a fascinating thing.

I've seen a few layout's with a tube station viewed through the baseboard face, though a model of the hotel curve/maiden lane flat junction would be quite something.

 

I did once think of building the depot from the waterloo and city line, complete with a working hoist from the main station. 

Edited November 26, 2017 by simon b

[Guest]

I've avoided this thread for a while, as I was finding it increasingly difficult NOT to think of layout plans, even though the original question I asked was of a prototype nature! The area itself is (was) absolutely fascinating, and thoughts still turn to creating a miniature slice of it, albeit with a lot of "modeller's license" thrown in. Circumstance dictates that my modelling is limited to planning (at least for 6 months or so), so something that may or may not ever get built is shown below.

2 boards, each 5' x 2'. The location of the platforms should be obvious, although they are not shown. Tempted to add the old Congreve St bridge just for interest. I'm finding the idea of joining the dots from "A" to "A" irresistible, even though the loop would need more room. A Class 31 and 3 Mk1 suburbans should fit comfortably in OO, with the main terminal platforms taking 4 and 6 coaches respectively. A very urban layout with minimal scenery, right up my street.

 

[simon b]

york_1.png

 

That would work well Pete, I've got the temptation to add a suburban platform or two between hotel curve and the main platforms?

[Guest]

york_1.png

 

That would work well Pete, I've got the temptation to add a suburban platform or two between hotel curve and the main platforms?

 

I do agree, I just worry about the additional width. Width could be shaved by having the approach pointwork and platforms parallel to the baseboard edge, but that looks kind of boring. I'm also well aware that the approach pointwork is nothing like reality. Compromise, sadly, is essential to fit available space.

[Trev52A]

Here's a view looking down on the York Road platform. That's 55004 departing in the background.

 

Kings Cross on 1st August 1975

 

Trevor

 

Edit for typo

Edited November 26, 2017 by Trev52A

[Enterprisingwestern]

I've avoided this thread for a while, as I was finding it increasingly difficult NOT to think of layout plans, even though the original question I asked was of a prototype nature! The area itself is (was) absolutely fascinating, and thoughts still turn to creating a miniature slice of it, albeit with a lot of "modeller's license" thrown in. Circumstance dictates that my modelling is limited to planning (at least for 6 months or so), so something that may or may not ever get built is shown below.

2 boards, each 5' x 2'. The location of the platforms should be obvious, although they are not shown. Tempted to add the old Congreve St bridge just for interest. I'm finding the idea of joining the dots from "A" to "A" irresistible, even though the loop would need more room. A Class 31 and 3 Mk1 suburbans should fit comfortably in OO, with the main terminal platforms taking 4 and 6 coaches respectively. A very urban layout with minimal scenery, right up my street.

 

york_1.png

 

Or to be more accurate Pete, right up your calle!

 

Mike.

[Willie Whizz]

I seem to recall that, many years ago, probably the early/mid-80s, there was in an early edition of one of the fairly short-lived magazines of those days (possibly 'Your Model Railway') an article suggesting how a model inspired by this section of Kings Cross could be developed.  Think it may even have been called "Kings Cross Suburban".

[simon b]

I seem to recall that, many years ago, probably the early/mid-80s, there was in an early edition of one of the fairly short-lived magazines of those days (possibly 'Your Model Railway') an article suggesting how a model inspired by this section of Kings Cross could be developed.  Think it may even have been called "Kings Cross Suburban".

I've got a copy of that, I'll try to post it on here tonight.