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Class 230 into revenue service


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It has been announced that 3x 2 car 230s will take over from 150/153 on the Bedford to Bletchley (Marston Vale) line in December.

 

I know we aren't supposed to ask questions on this sub-section, but does anyone know exactly when the change of stock is likely to take place, or when 230s might appear for route familiarisation by crews?

 

Kevin

 

PS: I did search for other threads that might cover this, but there don't seem to be any.

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I don't, but it cannot come a moment too soon.  On Tuesday of this week the 17.40 Bedford - Bletchley and its inward working were cancelled.  I do not know why, this time, but the Bedford - Bletchley units run out of fuel with depressing frequency.  Empty running to and from Tyseley does not help on that score.

 

Chris

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I don't, but it cannot come a moment too soon.  On Tuesday of this week the 17.40 Bedford - Bletchley and its inward working were cancelled.  I do not know why, this time, but the Bedford - Bletchley units run out of fuel with depressing frequency.  Empty running to and from Tyseley does not help on that score.

 

Chris

 

As marvellous a concept as the class 230 is I doubt it's going to address that problem.

 

Does this mean we can look forward to those same empty stock moves with the class 230.

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Even by the standards of the contemporary railway, this is particularly odd! Surely not that difficult to fill up on site even if you had to call in a local tanker lorry.

What's the range of a class 150/153 though.

 

Those units used to do New St - Skegness and back easily on a tank of fuel and New St -  up the Cambrian Coast and back.

 

I also know a class 153 could do the last train of the day Swansea - Crewe via HOW, run light to Llandudno, spend all day working the Blaneau Branch then back empty to Crewe in the evening ready to work the first train of the day back to Cardiff (via HOW), all on one tank of fuel.

 

That last one was a booked working daily when Cardiif were providing the unit for the Blaneau Branch (they may still do).

 

Then how far is Bletchley - Bedford, twelve miles ???

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How very odd!

 

I'd assumed that there was a big tank of diesel at Bletchley, and that basic exams and top-ups were done by a couple of guys popping down from 'wherever' in a van.

The only thing Bletchley gets used for these days is mileage pre-delivery accumulation runs of Electrostars.

 

Now if the line to Calvert hadn't been severed, they could have run to Aylesbury and fueled there, complete opposite of the old BR regime.

 

Dave

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Running out of fuel sounds more like an issue with the unit deviating from its planned diagram, and not ending up back at the fueling point at the correct time. And that's likely to be a side effect of other issues.

 

In this case though Pete, there are only three 150s on the books and only two diagrams - off Bletchley and off Tyseley. It would be pretty elementary to mess the diagrams up !!!!

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It has been announced that 3x 2 car 230s will take over from 150/153 on the Bedford to Bletchley (Marston Vale) line in December.

I know we aren't supposed to ask questions on this sub-section, but does anyone know exactly when the change of stock is likely to take place, or when 230s might appear for route familiarisation by crews?

Kevin

PS: I did search for other threads that might cover this, but there don't seem to be any.

Are these going to be run in multiple as 4 or 6 car trains? Can the 230s do that? I would assume so, but I’ve no definite knowledge.

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Even by the standards of the contemporary railway, this is particularly odd! Surely not that difficult to fill up on site even if you had to call in a local tanker lorry.

 

Although some freight operators do it (I'll mention no names or two locations where I know it takes place) in many areas it is illegal to do so without the proper facilities to cater for any overflow or leakage of fuel plus the necessary arrangements to prevent contamination of the surrounding ground and seepage to water courses.  As far as tanks are concerned it is a simple matter to get hold of and position a double bunded fuel storage and delivery tank - you can buy them off the shelf.  The big problem, and the major cost, is the necessary works to prevent ground contamination and seepage from any spillage and if the relevant locally based authorities involved have had past concerns at a location you can bet they'll be quickly on the case if any new facility appears.

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Did Bletchley depot not have fuelling facilities, for its small fleet of DMUs used on this service, plus at one time Watford/St Albans ? In which case a suitably equipped fuelling area already exists.

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Did Bletchley depot not have fuelling facilities, for its small fleet of DMUs used on this service, plus at one time Watford/St Albans ? In which case a suitably equipped fuelling area already exists.

 

Indeed it did.  There was a time when Marylebone dmus went to Bletchley for servicing but that was a while ago.  Someone told me yesterday that the fuelling point is still there.  Whether it is operational I know not.  The fact remains that with proper management there is no excuse for a unit to run out of fuel in service.

 

Chris

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Indeed it did.  There was a time when Marylebone dmus went to Bletchley for servicing but that was a while ago.  Someone told me yesterday that the fuelling point is still there.  Whether it is operational I know not.  The fact remains that with proper management there is no excuse for a unit to run out of fuel in service.

 

Chris

The site must be fairly secure otherwise they wouldn't be using it as the mileage accumulation base for stock ex-Derby. But wether what is left is now in any way servicable, who knows???

 

Running out of fuel shouldn't happen, but when the rostered steam loco failed at Ely on a Lincoln bound service, the incoming class 33 had to stay on the train, and ran out before Sleaford. Impromtu refuel;

 

Dave

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Although some freight operators do it (I'll mention no names or two locations where I know it takes place) in many areas it is illegal to do so without the proper facilities to cater for any overflow or leakage of fuel plus the necessary arrangements to prevent contamination of the surrounding ground and seepage to water courses.  As far as tanks are concerned it is a simple matter to get hold of and position a double bunded fuel storage and delivery tank - you can buy them off the shelf.  The big problem, and the major cost, is the necessary works to prevent ground contamination and seepage from any spillage and if the relevant locally based authorities involved have had past concerns at a location you can bet they'll be quickly on the case if any new facility appears.

 

That doesn't surprise me, but it's a bit short sighted if freight companies are doing that as they wouldn't have a leg to stand on in the event of an spill being detected. My experience of the EA in England was that they take few prisoners with stuff like that, conversely they were generally very reasonable where you were making every effort to do things properly.

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The site must be fairly secure otherwise they wouldn't be using it as the mileage accumulation base for stock ex-Derby. But wether what is left is now in any way servicable, who knows???

 

Running out of fuel shouldn't happen, but when the rostered steam loco failed at Ely on a Lincoln bound service, the incoming class 33 had to stay on the train, and ran out before Sleaford. Impromtu refuel;

 

Dave

 

Agricultural and road vehicles are often re-fuelled directly from road tankers with no special facilities so I guess there is a procedure which permits it, but it doesn't excuse running out of fuel in the first place. In this day and age when telemetry has the capacity to keep tabs on what the driver had for breakfast, it seems impossible to believe that its an unavoidable operational incident.

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easier said than done. If you're lucky there's a float gauge that might display correctly on the outside, if not just a sight gauge that's usually stained or filthy. In cab fuel levels are a very new thing...

 

...I've had someone in control insist I can just check on the dash board more than once.

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easier said than done. If you're lucky there's a float gauge that might display correctly on the outside, if not just a sight gauge that's usually stained or filthy. In cab fuel levels are a very new thing...

 

...I've had someone in control insist I can just check on the dash board more than once.

The fuel gauge is just next to the iPhone dock...
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Not being awkward here - just asking! I appreciate the "professional" way of the EA being careful about spillages, but what about you and I filling our cars up at the filling station? No different to a freight loco being filled up from a road tanker surely?

 

Stewart

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Petrol stations are a defined place though, and they can take whatever measures are considered necessary to deal with spills; you know where they'll be. Any spills will also be relatively small, unless it's the delivery tanker.

Filling a loco from a tanker wherever it's parked means that any spills will be in an uncontrolled area, so no infrastructure mitigations will be available.

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Not being awkward here - just asking! I appreciate the "professional" way of the EA being careful about spillages, but what about you and I filling our cars up at the filling station? No different to a freight loco being filled up from a road tanker surely?

 

Stewart

 

It can be a considerable difference as freight locos can involve hundreds of gallons and at some locations that is happening daily while at others it is happening more frequently.  At one of the locations I do know about, and have seen photos of how the fuelling takes place, a road tanker drives into the site (which is not on NR property) and fuels the loco, normally a Class 66, on a stub end siding with no environmental provisions at all.  My pal - who was at the site looking at various safety matters - not only pointed it out to the site safety manager but included it in his report to the company and they took no action whatsoever to rectify matters. 

 

In fact overall numerous things were wrong at that site and I was picking up many of them on the railway side from photos - no need to visit the site to find out what was wrong in many areas - but the fact that my pal was not awarded a continuing contract suggests to me that what was going into his written reports was not receiving much attention.  Some associated NR documentation was also of an abysmal standard and would definitely not have been tolerated in the past on the Western Region but my mate could only make 'observations' on that.

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