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charliepetty
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I'd be very tempted by one of those.  I have to admit, I haven't bought any of the 156s and don't plan on any 142s at the minute, purely because of the cost of replacing my current detailed ones (9 x 156s and 4 x 142s), as a mixed fleet would look odd so I'd want to replace all of them, and it's just not a financially viable option, rather than a comment on the quality of Realtrack's models.  I have a pair of 144s, and I'd add a red/cream 141 if there were one on offer.  

 

After that, of course, there's the 140... I'm not sure I could justify one but might be tempted, certainly if anyone were to do a 151 I'd have one too... 

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Does this thread still have an end goal, for Realtrack to actually produce a new diesel locomotive based on public opinion?

If the answer is yes and in light of what is now being completely re-tooled as in the Class 55, Class 59 & Class 66 (plus others in the works) then I'll go back to what I've & many others have said yonks ago how about an all-new Class 37 or Class 47, you'll have 60 years of liveries and several different era's thus surely a winner with either of these classes. 

Edited by classy52
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5 hours ago, classy52 said:

Does this thread still have an end goal, for Realtrack to actually produce a new diesel locomotive based on public opinion?

If the answer is yes and in light of what is now being completely re-tooled as in the Class 55, Class 59 & Class 66 (plus others in the works) then I'll go back to what I've & many others have said yonks ago how about an all-new Class 37 or Class 47, you'll have 60 years of liveries and several different era's thus surely a winner with either of these classes. 

It serves us well as we can see opinions and thought re products, like the 104 DMU which sadly has limited liveries!!   Surprised a 120 has never been mentioned, OR the item we are doing!!!!!

 

Charlie

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5 minutes ago, charliepetty said:

It serves us well as we can see opinions and thought re products, like the 104 DMU which sadly has limited liveries!!   Surprised a 120 has never been mentioned, OR the item we are doing!!!!!

 

Charlie

Well that is at least two sales.

 

There's green with speed whiskers, and green with yellow panels........what else do people want? I bet there are some with more modern taste and would like Notwork Southeast. :tomato::tomato::tomato:

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3 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Well that is at least two sales.

 

There's green with speed whiskers, and green with yellow panels........what else do people want? I bet there are some with more modern taste and would like Notwork Southeast. :tomato::tomato::tomato:

Green with no Whiskers

Green with Whiskers

Green with Yellow panel

Blue

Blue with white body stripe

Blue and Grey

Blue and Grey Experiment with Black stripe on cab front

Network Southeast

Mexican Bean

 

Some had white cab roof

 

Is that not enough liveries for the 104? 

66738

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3 hours ago, charliepetty said:

It serves us well as we can see opinions and thought re products, like the 104 DMU which sadly has limited liveries!!   Surprised a 120 has never been mentioned, OR the item we are doing!!!!!

 

Charlie

 

I notice that the original request for which 'diesel locomotive' people would want has simply become an 'item'.  There is still plenty of items that I'd like that are not diesel locomotives.

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18 minutes ago, 66738 said:

Green with no Whiskers

Green with Whiskers

Green with Yellow panel

Blue

Blue with white body stripe

Blue and Grey

Blue and Grey Experiment with Black stripe on cab front

Network Southeast

Mexican Bean

 

Some had white cab roof

 

Is that not enough liveries for the 104? 

66738

To add to the above. 

 

Green small yellow panel, NER repainted lining, straight under windscreen not upturned.

Blue small yellow

Blue small yellow white cab roof.

 

There were differences, all NER DTC, DMC, TC, TS and TBS had a luggage rack opposite the toilet not seating as found on the LMR sets.

 

As for a 120, me and my mate would buy a 119 if you done that instead.

 

 

 

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On 07/03/2019 at 19:20, charliepetty said:

It serves us well as we can see opinions and thought re products, like the 104 DMU which sadly has limited liveries!!   Surprised a 120 has never been mentioned, OR the item we are doing!!!!!

 

Charlie

 

Yes it has, I mentioned it the day before... 

 

On 06/03/2019 at 22:42, JDW said:

I'd be very tempted by one of those.  I have to admit, I haven't bought any of the 156s and don't plan on any 142s at the minute, purely because of the cost of replacing my current detailed ones (9 x 156s and 4 x 142s), as a mixed fleet would look odd so I'd want to replace all of them, and it's just not a financially viable option, rather than a comment on the quality of Realtrack's models.  I have a pair of 144s, and I'd add a red/cream 141 if there were one on offer.  

 

After that, of course, there's the 140... I'm not sure I could justify one but might be tempted, certainly if anyone were to do a 151 I'd have one too... 

 

:laugh::o

 

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On 07/03/2019 at 19:20, charliepetty said:

...  Surprised a 120 has never been mentioned, OR the item we are doing!!!!!

 

Charlie

 

So you’re doing the Fell?

 

Respect!

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Class 139! I count four liveries, one in service, three various prototypes/trials.

 

No-one else has done it.

 

It's not a 10 car DEMU.

 

You could build a massive flywheel into the floor driven by a small vertically mounted coreless motor to try and stay more "true" to type. And no need to worry about smoke.

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Well the engines I would have gone for and suggested have both been announced, so I must have been onto something  - being class 66 and then class 55. Only one that escaped was the class 20 - but will that change with the Bachmann 20/3 upgrade and then follow with the standard variant afterwards? Id expect so, but then Bachmann again have announced the Turbostar as a hands off statement, but just how long will that take or will it slip like the 158 has done.

 

I still don't think the 104 has the potential for sales, as compared with other first gen units out there that also have already been done and while class 141 hasn't been done I do wonder if there's enough repeat sales afterwards for this to be wanted as well.

 

If I was going to suggest things next then the class 20 still has potential to be there, but coming front and centre is class 37. Lots of liveries and details that can be done and if Realtrack is willing to charge in and take on everyone like Hatton's have done with 66, then I'm sure they are well placed to do a 37 capable of all the differences. The downside to this is just how many would swap the Bachmann 37 for the Realtrack one as the Bachmann 37 I think is a better stage and overall impression to the real thing than the 66 was by comparison.

 

The other suggestions to consider now would be class 58 and class 31 - if there are enough people to think the Hornby one is that much away from the real thing. Personally I don't think it is at all so expect that one not really to run.

 

However, Charlie has dropped the hint about the next potential model being an 'item' and thus not a locomotive. In that case and if I was taking an educated guess for a decent DCC Sound and lit model of a British prototype that's not been done well in model form but could be a model that's bought for novelty and thus get many being sold - then I would suggest a British model of a.... Tamper.

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A DCC Tamper vehicle, with all the "Bells & Whistles" would be a welcome addition to the Modern scene.

 

It would certainly create a lot of interest at exhibitions, as it would look good either "on the move" or parked up in a siding.

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3 hours ago, The Black Hat said:

The downside to this is just how many would swap the Bachmann 37 for the Realtrack one as the Bachmann 37 I think is a better stage and overall impression to the real thing than the 66 was by comparison.
 

 

There are also new people entering the hobby every year, and those who leave the hobby (for whatever reason) don't all sell their existing models - a lot end up being thrown away or being put into storage for 20 years.

 

So any new model of an existing product doesn't have to rely entirely on people upgrading.

 

3 hours ago, berwicksfinest said:

Always check ebay for what is being sold in quantities 

 

Seems a lot of Class 89 kits on :unsure:

 

Not a surprise - with new models of the 86/0, 87, 90, 91, 92 all either recently released or coming there is a very good chance that at some point in the next couple of years someone will do the 89 I would guess (similarly I would be surprised if Heljan doesn't continue and do later 86's or someone else announces them).

 

Also wouldn't be surprised, although more a long shot, to see an overhead EMU for the late 80s/90s period be at least attempted given that all the locos are essentially now covered.

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2 car DMUs are probably easier to sell than 4 car EMUs.

 

you could sell 2x as many DMUs to make a 4 Car train, equivalent to 1x 4 car EMU with half the cost of tooling that 4 car EMU, meaning you could make 2different 2 car DMUs for the price of 1x 4 car EMU.

 

most people would only buy 1x 4 car EMU of any one class.

 

My Logic suggests 2 car units are a better bet, theres not many 2x car EMUs, so a DMU is better.

 

 

Edited by adb968008
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1 hour ago, adb968008 said:

2 car DMUs are probably easier to sell than 4 car EMUs.

 

you could sell 2x as many DMUs to make a 4 Car train, equivalent to 1x 4 car EMU with half the cost of tooling that 4 car EMU, meaning you could make 2different 2 car DMUs for the price of 1x 4 car EMU.

 

most people would only buy 1x 4 car EMU of any one class.

 

My Logic suggests 2 car units are a better bet, theres not many 2x car EMUs, so a DMU is better.

 

 

 

I think it would depend on how the prototype ran as to the length of model I'd be looking for, I'd have plenty Class 303/311/314/318/320 3-car units!!

 

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58 minutes ago, GordonC said:

 

I think it would depend on how the prototype ran as to the length of model I'd be looking for, I'd have plenty Class 303/311/314/318/320 3-car units!!

 

There were also some English 3 car EMUs BR standards 501, 504, 305, 308, 304 (later in life) LMS Oerlikon, GEC, 502, 503, 505, LNER 306, 506, BR PEP design 313, 507, 508 later designs 323, 333, and more.

 

Many EMUs are unfortunately limited geographically by which services they worked but conversely many had long lives and many liveries.

 

Oh! forgot for a short period some of the 309/1s that had been lengthened to 4 car units gave their Trailer SO to some of the 309/2 when the buffets were withdrawn making them 3 car units and some of the buffet sets also ran as 3 car units. Once the additional hauled TSOs were converted to Trailer SOs and the platforms at Shenfield (and a few other places) were lengthened to take 12 cars then all Clacton units were 4car.

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4 hours ago, adb968008 said:

2 car DMUs are probably easier to sell than 4 car EMUs.

 

you could sell 2x as many DMUs to make a 4 Car train, equivalent to 1x 4 car EMU with half the cost of tooling that 4 car EMU, meaning you could make 2different 2 car DMUs for the price of 1x 4 car EMU.

 

most people would only buy 1x 4 car EMU of any one class.

 

My Logic suggests 2 car units are a better bet, theres not many 2x car EMUs, so a DMU is better.

 

 


Actually if an AM10/Class 310 were to be made, I'd end up buying original blue with small yellow warning panel, blue with full yellow panel, blue/grey, NSE(with flat windscreens), Provincial/Midline and Regional Railways.  That's six, and I would be prepared to spend around £400-500 for a top quality rendition.  It would be a similar situation with the Class 304, original green with small yellow panel, blue with small yellow panel, blue with full yellow panel and blue grey (and if a model of a 304/3, Regional Railways if offered).  One single livery model wouldn't fit my plans simply because I would need multiple liveries to span the timescale of the layout I'm constructing.

Problem is the two LMR EMU classes which would sell as contemporary with available or soon-to-be available AC locos (Classes 304 and 310) each have four different vehicle bodies so would probably cost well north of half a million to tool up for.  Even my multiple sales wouldn't make a dent in that amount.

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Don’t get me wrong! and I don’t disagree..

 

a 304/5/8 and a class 504 would be great (and the 504 is a 2 car)..

but the reason the 304 is a different class to a 305 or 308 is because they are different.

Which means more toolings... a lot of money.

 

whilst I would buy a few EMUs is there enough people to buy something like 6000 of them to make it worth it ?

 

A 2 car class 104, I can imagine a few more making a home on my layout than class 304’s... as it’s less toolings and thus easier, cheaper it’s suggests in my mind to be lower risk.

 

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15 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

whilst I would buy a few EMUs is there enough people to buy something like 6000 of them to make it worth it ?

 

 

I agree the numbers are more difficult, but there have been some (presumably) successful 4 car 3rd-rail EMUs done and so the question comes down to 2 things for any manufacturer:

 

1) does the recent increase in overhead locos translate into a larger overhead electric market as maybe more layouts get built, thus making a viable market

 

2) do recent external issues change the financials that existed when the 3rd-rail market was deemed to be large enough.

 

(as an aside, while not quite the same in terms of tooling variations recent announcements with their bundling of coaches to force buying of complete trains appear to have been happily accepted by the market, so maybe the market is either different or more diversified than conventional wisdom has long indicated).

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