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OO gauge Crowdfunded APT-P (Warley announcement)


DJM Dave
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Originally, the toilets were supposed to be of Japanese design with a sprinkler system. This would have done away with toilet paper without a trace. A little known fact is that tilt system was there not for ease of comfort but to ensure the sprinkler remained on target as the train went round corners at high speed.

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Love the banter... great to hear guys.

who was the chief tester for do a big P..... Leave it.... Don't Even go there Jamie... lol

 

and On that bombshell...

being based on a Japanese system then, was it still suppose to dumb the waste on the track like the MK3 Coaches do today or was the APT moving towards a more cleaner way of a storage tanks system, I know that may caused more issues emptying and blockage possible over a flow etc. :nono: but I have to ask the question, even though I'm guessing it would still be the same method as we see it today...?

 

Regards

Jamie

Hopefully this answers your question.

post-25554-0-58192200-1528236159_thumb.jpg

post-25554-0-49105700-1528236176_thumb.jpg

Edited by NJC92
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Hi NJC92

 

Thank you for clearing that up, it backs up Kit Comments to... aka Mr_Tilt

I like the extra information of this fine train of the past, from the input of all other RMWeber's...!?!

 

Regards

Jamie

You're most welcome. The sad thing on the back of that leaflet is under the section 'The Future' Quote 'British Rail hopes to build a fleet of APT's for all the electrified services from Euston to Glasgow, Liverpool, Manchester, N.W. England and the W.Miands. If the government gives authority these services could be running by the mid 1980's.' Such a shame this never came to fruition. At least we can savour what remains of APT and look forward to what sounds to be a cracking model. I'm just having visions of the blue cab, tartan seats and the large InterCity APT legend adorning the power car.
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Question for you KIT as I was intrigued

 

What did this box of tricks do...?

 

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (49).JPG

 

 

 

Sadly I have no idea, I've not seen one of them before.

 

At a guess, looking at the codes on the lights and other stuff there I'd say it was a circuit continuity tester to check out the control cables through each coach. Just like E-Train the control signals from one cab to the other had to remain connected all the time, and some means or another would have been needed to test them out. 

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Hi Andi

 

Yes, I did wonder that, I also remember thinking what colour will the side panels be on the kitchen side on the Model, Is it Brown or Burn Orange... Do those LIGHTS play a role in making that Panel look different colours based on natural sunlight, those are things we need right on the Model.

 

I guess a trip back with  some colour cards from B&Q may identify the right colour shade of Red/Orange/Brown... whatever it is...? not sure if anyone picked that up to, along with the lighting, and Yes The lighting on the Model is a MUST I'd say, personally.

 

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (589) Mod1.jpg

 

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (585) Mod1.jpg

 

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (589).JPG

 

 

Even the Break Glass hammer on the wall in front would be nice to see on the Model to.

I am presuming the A4 Size Empty Panel to the Left of the Break Glass would have had the Buffet Menu in it, I couldn't see what other use or possibly Break Glass instructions, but it looks to far away for that, if I'm honest...!?!

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (190).JPG

 

Regards

Jamie

Hi Jamie.

 

The empty A4 panel next to the emergency hammer, is in fact a mirror, so the buffet staff can see if anyone's approaching down the corridor and vice versa (passengers seeing buffet staff ) before they step out the kitchen.

Brian

Edited by craigy
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Question for you KIT as I was intrigued

 

What did this box of tricks do...?

 

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (49).JPG

 

Regards

Jamie

 

Hi.

It's a "brake testing " unit that was used to see if the friction brakes where sticking. The lights would come one, with a siren to tell which brake and where it was stuck to the wheel. It's on the " A race against time " video and also there was a description above the unit describing it. Brian

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Question for you KIT as I was intrigued

 

What did this box of tricks do...?

 

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (49).JPG

 

Regards

Jamie

 

 

 

 

Hi.

It's a "brake testing " unit that was used to see if the friction brakes where sticking. The lights would come one, with a siren to tell which brake and where it was stuck to the wheel. It's on the " A race against time " video and also there was a description above the unit describing it. Brian

Edited by craigy
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Hi.


It's a "brake testing " unit that was used to see if the friction brakes where sticking. The lights would come one, with a siren to tell which brake and where it was stuck to the wheel. It's on the " A race against time " video and also there was a description above the unit describing it. Brian

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Was this part in Greu the 'Traction Motor' and the 'Transfer Gearbox' in Yellow and the Yellow Object on the RIGHT hand side, attached to the 'Hydrokinetic Brake' system which is connected to the 'Carden Shaft', as shown in Blue on the Power Car Coach outside in the last photo below.

 

<snip>

 

Is that Blue Object in the photo below, is that the 'Carden Shaft', which is connected to the 'Final Drive Greabox' as shown in the Diagram Above...?

attachicon.gifAPT-P Power Car (12).JPG

 

 

 

See below to decode the gubbins in your pic.

 

FO7gJR.jpg

 

And yes, the big blue tube is the cardan shaft that connects the transfer 'box to the final drive box. It whizzes round at horrendous speeds, especially notable when your head is about 9" away from it, as mine was aboard the dreaded Trestrol!!!!!

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Hi Jamie.

 

The generator room behind the cab contained the Cummins diesel engine along with all it's gubbins, on the other side was the batteries, circuit breakers, air tank and brake pumps, the fluid for it is accessed from a panel outside by the cab door.

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So were there two of these on either side where I was standing to take this, as in.... One for each wheel or through I couldn't real see TWO big blue tubes on the outside or if there were I missed it and don't have much of a close up of the cardan shaft that connects the transfer 'box to the final drive box.

 

 

Yes, two per end, making four per Power Car. The cardan shafts cross each other so that the traction motor that sits above any one axle actually drives the opposite axle. It's difficult to see the other cardan shaft as it's on the other side of the bogie and all the traction and yaw brackets are in the way.

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Hi Jamie.

The auxiliary room you have marked, in red is the main diesel engine area complete with it's panels for starting, clock hours etc, the yellow part is the battery charger underneath where the cloth was put are the batteries, that cloth was put there temporarily  to stop people touching or dropping things on the batteries. The mirror by the buffet car door is in fact a kind of reflective tape and not glass. The menu was at the other end of the bar area on the left above the litter bin as you go into the seating area.

 

Brian

post-6042-0-43924000-1528301701_thumb.jpg

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Even after getting leave I was unable to attend due to a small issue with the other halfs car, that small issue being an exhaust valve with a hole in it, so I think it fair to say you all had a better Saturday than I did, the question is who had my sandwich?

.post-5658-0-69893700-1528315781_thumb.jpg

Edited by royaloak
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  • RMweb Gold

Hi All

 

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (52) Mod3.jpg

 

Power Car Pantograph End Bogie

attachicon.gifAPT-P Power Car (12).JPG

 

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (314).JPG

 

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (315).JPG

 

 

I had to alter the Colour Balance of the same photo and bring out the Darker area's of the Photo for this Picture

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (315) Mod1.jpg

 

Closer view

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (315) Mod2.jpg

 

 

In this Photo, pointing out the (Blue) Cardan Shaft that comes down to Join onto the Final Drive Gearbox which is connected to the Axle.

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (315) Mod3.jpg

 

 

Regards

Jamie

Hi Jamie,

 

here are some shots of the final drive gear box (...631 & ...632) looking from the other side, as well as one of the hyfro-kinetic brake housing on the leading bogie under the cab (...629) …

 

Note the double arrowed bearing cap on the gearbox.

 

Regards

Richard.

post-26629-0-01362200-1528316719_thumb.jpg

post-26629-0-46208100-1528316738_thumb.jpg

post-26629-0-21586500-1528316763_thumb.jpg

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With Regards to the Centre Power Cab, I noticed on the inside and at the opposite end of the Cardan shaft (part in Blue) that connects the Transfer box to the Final Drive box etc,

It looked as if there was enough room to re-create the same on the other Bogie at the other end or the None Cardan shafted Bogie End (Excuse the Shafted, never thought I'd say that word in a good sentence way lol) which leads me to the question, was there ever originally or even a possibility to have had Dual Pantographs within the same Power Car, One at each End, Facing each other so to speak if raised up to the electrical wire / OHEL, hence removing the Second Power Car out of the Consist rake.

Hope that makes sense!

 

 

No, it doesn't actually.  :D

 

I'm not sure I even understand the question.........

 

Are you asking about a bogie that DOESN'T have cardan shafts and transfer boxes etc? There isn't one, both Power Car bogies have two motors, two HK brakes, two transfer boxes, two cardan shafts and two final drive gearboxes and two axles, making four of everything. 

 

They didn't need two pantographs, in fact it was important that only one was up anyway, that was the reason why the Power Cars were in the centre of the train. At high speed a leading pantograph tended to set up a standing wave in the very light overhead that BR used back then, and that would have meant any trailing pantograph would bounce off the wire a lot of the time, as much as 70% in some tests apparently. So the two Power Cars were marshalled together and the 25Kv jumpered from one to the other, powering all eight axles from one pantograph.

 

The jumper wire was installed on 49006 but it was stolen while it was at the ERM, so there are none left anywhere now. 

 

Nowadays they aren't so psychotic about jumpering 25Kv along the train, which is how the Pendelinos work. 

Edited by Mr_Tilt
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They didn't need two pantographs, in fact it was important that only one was up anyway, that was the reason why the Power Cars were in the centre of the train. At high speed a leading pantograph tended to set up a standing wave in the very light overhead that BR used back then, and that would have meant any trailing pantograph would bounce off the wire a lot of the time, as much as 70% in some tests apparently.

When running as 2x5 coach units the IETs have strict speed limits if anything other than the outer pans are raised-

Both outer 125mph,

One outer and one inner 100mph,

Both inner 80mph.

Edited by royaloak
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Ah Man! What are the chances hey of that day... of all days.

Sad you couldn't make it... perhaps another time hey...

 

Regards

Jamie

It blew up on the Friday, I couldnt believe it, I had the next week off and was going to get on with the mancave but alas instead of doing that I was up to my elbows in cylinder head.

 

I have been to the Crewe Heritage Centre before and even the other half and kids enjoyed it, some excellent interactive things for them to do, I am overdue another visit.

Edited by royaloak
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When running as 2x5 coach units the IETs have strict speed limits if anything other than the outer pans are raised-

Both outer 125mph,

One outer and one inner 100mph,

Both inner 80mph.

 

It's a different world now, the overhead is a lot stiffer and any standing waves generated are smaller in amplitude. Not only that, modern day pantographs are much more sophisticated than the stuff we had back then and can maintain contact much better.

 

The phenomenon is a lot better understood too of course.

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Hi Kit / Brian

 

On the CAB End Trailer Car, the little narrow connecting corridor you go through from the Main Seating area through a narrow door and on into the Cab, is there some kind of Generator on the left side, if so what was the generator used for, I saw the total running hours clock, sad to see so low in hours, I will sort through a publish them soon. I had the idea, while not on Pantograph or loss of power it would supply electric to all the essentials of the APT that needed power, as well as Internal Lighting for Each Coach etc.

 

I do find it interesting behind all the scenes of comfort as to what made the APT tick as it were...!

 

Regards

Jamie

Prety much spot on, again from the APT-P leaflet. post-25554-0-11133000-1528320486_thumb.jpg
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Hi  All

 

Not sure if this just may be me here, but I have never noticed the Steps on the Right side of the Bogie to gain access to the Door above of my Hornby Model and what's worse, I don't have one to hand to check, now I know someone will jump on this and tell me, I do have the other coaches to hand but those are not the correct bogies I need to compare!

 

If the Hornby Bogie doesn't have this feature, please DJM Dave make sure the Model will have... sorry to be a pain Dave lol

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (24).JPG

 

attachicon.gifAPT-P Crewe Heritage Centre (24) Mod1.jpg

 

Regards

Jamie

Hi Jamie.

It's not a step, well it is and it isn't, so to speak lol. it was covered with a piece of steel originally so filling the gap. This will be recovered again with some steel i've got so blanking it off like the other power car.

There was a picture on display showing the step uncovered, so it probably started off as one then covered over as it wasn't needed.

 

Brian

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