OO gauge GWR Mogul and Prairie

[woodenhead]

21 minutes ago, David Stannard said:

 

It's probably so Miss Prism can't pick any more faults with the CAD which would result in more tweaking and delay production even more.

Not even the coal in the bunker which appears to have been replaced with sump oil.

[David Stannard]

3 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

Not even the coal in the bunker which appears to have been replaced with sump oil.

 

It could be a membrane for a bunker mounted subwoofer for the DCC sound fitted variant.

[tomparryharry]

2 minutes ago, David Stannard said:

 

Yes please!

 

There is a trade off situation here. If both the prairie & mogul models are good, then it's fairly certain that both models will sell, and sell well. A lot of modellers have cottoned on to the fact that it's a two-way street. Polite discussion, educated observations (hopefully backed up with facts), all goes to make this an enjoyable experience. 

 

So, where do we go from here? From my viewpoint, quite a long way, actually. I'd argue that Western modellers form a sizeable chunk of the railway modelling market, enough for producers to know that market share will be 'favourable. On that basis alone, we can ask. Not demand, but ask. 

 

But, beware! It appears that 2 posters have had warnings for, quite frankly, rank stupidity. If you take that situation exponentially, then any producer will go and do something else, without the headaches! 

 

Happy modelling & wishlisting,

Ian. 

[tomparryharry]

16 minutes ago, melmerby said:

Noooooooooooo.

I've just bought a kit.

 

Don't worry, I've got  one as well. There's absolutely nothing to suggest Dapol will be making this next, just the process whereby the modelling public can skew the thought process in our favour. 

 

Sitting here and typing this, I can think of at least 2... Sorry, 3 models that 'might' see the light of day, and nowhere near Western territory.  Add to that, aren't Dapol tooling up for an LSWR model, via the NRM?

 

Happy modelling,

Ian. 

[David Stannard]

21 minutes ago, tomparryharry said:

 

There is a trade off situation here. If both the prairie & mogul models are good, then it's fairly certain that both models will sell, and sell well. A lot of modellers have cottoned on to the fact that it's a two-way street. Polite discussion, educated observations (hopefully backed up with facts), all goes to make this an enjoyable experience. 

 

So, where do we go from here? From my viewpoint, quite a long way, actually. I'd argue that Western modellers form a sizeable chunk of the railway modelling market, enough for producers to know that market share will be 'favourable. On that basis alone, we can ask. Not demand, but ask. 

 

But, beware! It appears that 2 posters have had warnings for, quite frankly, rank stupidity. If you take that situation exponentially, then any producer will go and do something else, without the headaches! 

 

Happy modelling & wishlisting,

Ian. 

 

 I do have a reasonable amount of faith these days, I remember going back 20 years ago GWR loco models were limited to a range of 2 cylinder and 4 cylinder 4-6-0's, 61xx, 43xx, 57xx variants, Dean and Collet Goods and 14xx's, a number of these models were rather antiquated models that had basic revamps over the years, the Blue Ribband 2251 was probably the best model of that era. These days we do enjoy a far greater diversity than back then, I could still remember the days of dreaming of having an RTR Dukedog which would be one of the most unlikely models to be produced, I don't know what prompted Bachmann to produce them but they did, also who else thought they would never get their hands on a 1366 or 47xx but these days we have these models available.

Edited February 5, 2020 by David Stannard

[Denbridge]

7 minutes ago, David Stannard said:

 

 I do have a reasonable amount of faith these days, I remember going back 20 years ago GWR loco models were limited to a range of 2 cylinder and 4 cylinder 4-6-0's, 61xx, 43xx, 57xx variants, Dean and Collet Goods and 14xx's, a number of these models were rather antiquated models that had basic revamps over the years, the Blue Ribband 2251 probably the best model of that era. These days we do enjoy a far greater diversity than back then, I could still remember the days of dreaming of having an RTR Dukedog which would be one of the most unlikely models to be produced, I don't know what prompted Bachmann to produce them but they did, also who else thought they would never get their hands on a 1366 or 47xx but these days we have these models available.

I still find it somewhat puzzling that apart from a rather poor toy, many years ago, we haven't seen a rtr model of probably the most significant design of the 20th century. GJ Churchwards Saint is surely the biggest gap yet to be filled in UK steam outline models.

[melmerby]

17 minutes ago, Denbridge said:

I still find it somewhat puzzling that apart from a rather poor toy, many years ago, we haven't seen a rtr model of probably the most significant design of the 20th century. GJ Churchwards Saint is surely the biggest gap yet to be filled in UK steam outline models.

 

Hornby should be first on the starting block with that as they already do a Star, which wasn't much more than a 4 cylinder version of it

They could use much of that as a basis, to their latest standards.

 

 

[David Stannard]

35 minutes ago, Denbridge said:

I still find it somewhat puzzling that apart from a rather poor toy, many years ago, we haven't seen a rtr model of probably the most significant design of the 20th century. GJ Churchwards Saint is surely the biggest gap yet to be filled in UK steam outline models.

 

I'm still hanging out for someone to produce a new model of a Manor, I avoided getting one of the Branchline versions many years ago as I wasn't that keen on the rather sad looking crew seated in the cab, the model also had a number of other shortcomings despite being heralded as an amazing model in a number of model rail magazines back in the 90's.

 

[Harlequin]

There are still loads of Western loco classes they could have a go at successfully, especially with the pre-grouping trend that seems to be going on. (And let's face it Hornby aren't giving us anything new as far as we know.)

 

One of the biggest holes I see in the GWR RTR spectrum is coaches. If Dapol are getting into the habit of tooling up for many variations maybe they are the people to take on the challenge of the Toplights! ?

 

It's great to see these new CADs emerge because the Dapol Prairies were in doubt, as far as we knew, with the Hornby Prairie supposedly taking a large chunk of that market. But we still haven't seen the Hornby Prairie in the shops - and Hornby have announced an awful lot of other stuff to occupy their factories in the meantime...

 

Edited February 5, 2020 by Harlequin

[Denbridge]

11 minutes ago, David Stannard said:

 

I'm still hanging out for someone to produce a new model of a Manor, I avoided getting one of the Branchline versions many years ago as I wasn't that keen on the rather sad looking crew seated in the cab, the model also had a number of other shortcomings despite being heralded as an amazing model in a number of model rail magazines back in the 90's.

 

Whilst I agree that a newly tooled manor is long overdue, I firmly believe the Saint is the biggest missing piece. Not just in GW motive power, but in the story of locomotive development. Every successful locomotive design whether from Gresley, Stanier, Bulleid, Riddles, etc can trace its ancestry back to the ground breaking innovations developed by GJC.  The saints were also a long lasting class, more so than Manors,  Counties etc.

[Denbridge]

7 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

There are still loads of Western loco classes they could have a go at successfully, especially with the pre-grouping trend that seems to be going on. (And let's face it Hornby aren't giving us anything new as far as we know.)

 

One of the biggest holes I see in the GWR RTR spectrum is coaches. If Dapol are getting into the habit of tooling up for many variations maybe they are the people to take on the challenge of the Toplights! ?

 

It's great to see these new CADs emerge because the Dapol Prairies were in doubt, as far as we knew, with the Hornby Prairie supposedly taking a large chunk of that market. But we still haven't seen the Hornby Prairie in the shops - and they have announced an awful lot of other stuff to occupy their factories in the meantime...

 

Toplights would be awesome. But, as has been discussed to death elsewhere, they are such a minefield. To do them justice a manufacturer would have to be really brave and produce more than the bog standard range of 3, or if really brave 4 styles. Even then theyd face much criticism for producing the wrong ones.

[Miss Prism]

I don't suppose I'm the only one who thinks there is no coincidence between Hornby's factory closure and the sudden appearance of the much revamped Dapol Prairie CAD.

 

[Miss Prism]

3 hours ago, David Stannard said:

It's probably so Miss Prism can't pick any more faults with the CAD which would result in more tweaking and delay production even more.

 

Yes, it's all my fault. But here's the thing: when one manufacturer assures you they had to make a recess in the front rear of the cylinder to allow the pony to clear, and the other manufacture assures you no such recess was necessary, who yer gonna believe?

 

Or does it make you wonder if the cylinders are in the right place?
 

[David Stannard]

9 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

 

Yes, it's all my fault. But here's the thing: when one manufacturer assures you they had to make a recess in the front rear of the cylinder to allow the pony to clear, and the other manufacture assures you no such recess was necessary, who yer gonna believe?

 

Or does it make you wonder if the cylinders are in the right place?
 

 

 I'm quite happy that you may have caused a delay with your constant stream of observations, at least we know that Dapol is willing to take advice from members of the community that have a vast wealth of knowledge of the real thing and they are putting in their best efforts to ensure that they produce a model that is as accurate as can be.

[Denbridge]

31 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

I don't suppose I'm the only one who thinks there is no coincidence between Hornby's factory closure and the sudden appearance of the much revamped Dapol Prairie CAD.

 

Maybe not the only one. But much more likely is simply that Dapol have just recently reached that stage in the design process.

[David Stannard]

1 hour ago, Denbridge said:

Toplights would be awesome. But, as has been discussed to death elsewhere, they are such a minefield. To do them justice a manufacturer would have to be really brave and produce more than the bog standard range of 3, or if really brave 4 styles. Even then theyd face much criticism for producing the wrong ones.

 

I would be happy if they did a range of the 57' Toplights as they could be used on a fairly wide variety of trains compared to say the 70's.

[Denbridge]

1 minute ago, David Stannard said:

 

I would be happy if they did a range of the 57' Toplights as they could be used on a fairly wide variety of trains compared to say the 70's.

Of course. But the problem is, which ones and in which eras. Toplights are a minefield. Ask 10 modellers which ones they would like and you'll get 10 different answers:)

[County of Yorkshire]

38 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

I don't suppose I'm the only one who thinks there is no coincidence between Hornby's factory closure and the sudden appearance of the much revamped Dapol Prairie CAD.

 

 

Bingo.

 

Dapol may have had the same gut feeling that I've had, which is that the Hornby Prairies aren't going to be seen this side of Q3, perhaps later. I would also say that the proposed RRP of Dapol's effort is sufficiently lower than that of Hornby's to the point of almost certainly poaching pre-orders in favour of the former. 

 

Interesting developments, but I do still think on a fundamental level that duplication of prototypes is not a good thing, and it baffles me why Dapol didn't blink first and canned their Prairies for a Manor. They'd clean up!

 

CoY

[GWR8700]

3 hours ago, melmerby said:

Noooooooooooo.

I've just bought a kit.

I wasn't aware there were kits for large metros.  Who produces them?

[woodenhead]

On 26/12/2019 at 11:02, The Stationmaster said:

Swindon was doing that long before Doncaster got the message I think you'll find.  Thus engines of some classes could arrive with outside steam pipes and leave with inside steam pipes while  boiler changes on a 57XX pannier could back date it to, say, no longer  having a top feed although it had appeared new with one.  It was one of the big advantages of Churchward's standardisation programme which was taken to an even higher level by Collett and it reduced shopping times and took full advantage of the interchangeability of components (unlike the LNER which was far less standardised in terms of components, especially minor components).  The latter made a big difference at running sheds as well because GWR depots generally need a much smaller range of the interchangeable parts which were likely to need changing on engines in traffic.  

 

Was it not CEM overhauls at TMDs that finished off Swindon - bitten by it's own cleverness eventually.

[Denbridge]

5 minutes ago, GWR8700 said:

I wasn't aware there were kits for large metros.  Who produces them?

Roxey

[melmerby]

5 minutes ago, Denbridge said:

Roxey

My Bad.

My kit isn't a "large" it's a small (or is that medium?)

So many variations, like most GWR classes

[Denbridge]

9 minutes ago, melmerby said:

My Bad.

My kit isn't a "large" it's a small (or is that medium?)

So many variations, like most GWR classes

My bad as well. Just remembered the Roxey kit is for a medium Metro.

[tomparryharry]

Is it the Finecast kit?

 

I have one of the smaller variations over here. However, the Welsh allocated versions were usually the larger variety.

 

Cheers,

Ian.

[melmerby]

9 minutes ago, tomparryharry said:

Is it the Finecast kit?

 

I have one of the smaller variations over here. However, the Welsh allocated versions were usually the larger variety.

 

Cheers,

Ian.

Yes.

i bought it from a dealer at the last Warley show, considerably cheaper than SE Finecast's own price.