OO gauge GWR Mogul and Prairie

[lofty1966]

8 hours ago, Free At Last said:

Sam casts his eye over it...

 

Gets into a bit of a gushy lovefest to start, while completely slamming the Hornby version.

Has to rein back in when he realizes it doesn't run as well as he hoped.

I really can't take him seriously what with that most appalling "layout" on the carpet and then onto one of the crappiest decorated "scenery" sections I've ever seen!

 

Edited December 2, 2021 by lofty1966
Added text

[Hilux5972]

1 hour ago, lofty1966 said:

Gets into a bit of a gushy lovefest to start, while completely slamming the Hornby version.

Has to rein back in when he realizes it doesn't run as well as he hoped.

I really can't take him seriously what with that most appalling "layout" on the carpet and then onto one of the crappiest decorated "scenery" sections I've ever seen!

 

Now that’s not very fair criticising the scenic part of his setup. Everyone has different levels of skill in that department. Mine is woeful. Running on the carpet yes I agree with. But just remember skill level varies across the board. 

[St Enodoc]

1 hour ago, lofty1966 said:

I really can't take him seriously what with that most appalling "layout" on the carpet

 

26 minutes ago, Hilux5972 said:

Running on the carpet yes I agree with.

There's a counter-argument that says if it will run on the carpet it will run anywhere.

[kandc_au]

1 minute ago, St Enodoc said:

 

There's a counter-argument that says if it will run on the carpet it will run anywhere.

True!
BUT at the end of the day, when doing an opening like this, for any loco one would think that it would be shown, up on a baseboard with or without scenery,not on the carpet!
Khris

[Legend]

People get caught up on Sam running on a carpet . Key thing is this brand new model ran ok but stalled on the points . I’d have been inclined to send it back . He did say it doesn’t sit straight on the track and it maybe that there’s something about the pickups that’s causing the cut out on the points .  Key fact is , of course, that shouldn’t happen in a new loco . 

[Black 5 Bear]

To be fair to Sam, there are other posters on YouTube who've had exactly the same problem with the Prairie stalling on pointwork, so he's not on his own.

It's a lovely looking loco all the same and probably is a minor issue, which can be easily rectified.

Let's hope these issues are addressed and do not affect the forthcoming Manor.

 https://youtu.be/IHQrWHqDk5I

 

Edited December 2, 2021 by Black 5 Bear

[JST]

I have ordered a sound fitted version and will reserve judgement until I have it in my sticky paws. What I do know is that my sound fitted Mogul ran perfectly straight out of the box and still does. I will post a video when the Prairie arrives. 
I for one always watch Sam’s reviews. Yes, his layout on the carpet leaves a lot to be desired (he says that himself) but I find it to be a good indicator of how a loco will run. If it runs OK on Sam’s layout it will probably go OK on mine! Yes his style is a bit gushy but his obsession with mechanisms I find to be helpful as at least we get a look at what is inside!

[JST]

18 minutes ago, Black 5 Bear said:

To be fair to Sam, there are other posters on YouTube who've had exactly the same problem with the Prairie stalling on pointwork, so he's not on his own.

It's a lovely looking loco all the same and probably is a minor issue, which can be easily rectified.

Let's hope these issues are addressed and do not affect the forthcoming Manor.

 https://youtu.be/IHQrWHqDk5I

 

Looking at the review you have posted, it appears to be like Sam’s in as much the loco stalls on Insulfrog points. My points are all Electrofrog wired for DCC so I hope that will help……… we shall see…..

[Ian Hargrave]

25 minutes ago, Black 5 Bear said:

To be fair to Sam, there are other posters on YouTube who've had exactly the same problem with the Prairie stalling on pointwork, so he's not on his own.

Let's hope these issues are addressed and do not affect the Manor classhttps://youtu.be/IHQrWHqDk5I

 

This is happening too often in a variety of conditions for it to be anything other than either an assembly or,more likely a design fault with the pick up/keeper plate combination. My Rails/Dapol Terrier suffers an identical issue over pointwork. It gives me no pleasure to say so,because I’m a believer in Dapol who have produced an excellent performer in the B4 and have other interesting projects in development,but this surely must not happen. I don’t see any quick fix for this other than to return to the drawing board. The model Sam demonstrated and the one in your YouTube video should both be returned whence they came for replacement for one that can negotiate point work or a fix,if such exists.by return to Dapol

 

Sam is entirely another matter.I’m no fan of the Hornby version either.However,to express an opinion of it in such challenging language is courting big trouble and loses out in terms of a fair appraisal and objectivity. 
To illustrate my point,several years ago when Dapol regularly posted on this forum,they withdrew. This was due to some incendiary criticism on here of some of their products and was followed by them with a threat of legal action.

 

I am uncomfortable with Sam’s bullish OTT style and would prefer that it was toned down to avoid unpleasantness.

Some believe that the internet allows us open season to publish what we will. Quite simply….it does not.
 

 

 

[Miss Prism]

I'm glad I watched Sam's video. His 6167 has the correct short safety valve. Quite how Rails' pics show otherwise is a bit of a mystery.

 

[mattkimster]

I'm now seriously tempted by these, and am weighing up whether to go for the BRITISH RAILWAYS version, or late GWR version.

 

It might have been answered somewhere back in the thread, but I wondered if anyone knew how long they ran in these liveries? I'm guessing the GWR version may have still been around between 1948-1949, but I don't have any evidence to back that up. When would the the BRITISH RAILWAYS lettering been replaced by the early crest?

[boxbrownie]

5 hours ago, Hilux5972 said:

Now that’s not very fair criticising the scenic part of his setup. Everyone has different levels of skill in that department. Mine is woeful. Running on the carpet yes I agree with. But just remember skill level varies across the board. 

Maybe I shouldn’t say it, but I thought the use of clumps of cotton wool scattered around to represent mounds of cleared/melting snow was quite imaginative.

[kandc_au]

1 hour ago, Ian Hargrave said:

 

I am uncomfortable with Sam’s bullish OTT style and would prefer that it was toned down to avoid unpleasantness.

Some believe that the internet allows us open season to publish what we will. Quite simply….it does not.
 

 

 

Ian,

His actual review he has said it how he sees it, and shown the issues he has had with it straight out of the box.
You cannot say it is unpleasant....if you don't agree with him.

Anyone can post a review like his and it is only their opinion, and in this instance he has physically shown people why he has said what he has.

khris

 

[ikcdab]

7 hours ago, lofty1966 said:

most appalling "layout" on the carpet and then onto one of the crappiest decorated "scenery" sections I've ever seen

Crappiest and appalling based on whose standards? I presume all your modelling is of pendon standards. Just remember that we all have different aspirations and we should be able to cater for all. Your criticism is unwarranted. 

His review of the large prairie is balanced and informative. It has guided my buying decision.

Ian C

[Harlequin]

Sam always divides opinion. Let's not argue about him, his presentation style or his layout. Can we concentrate on the model?

 

[Miss Prism]

1 hour ago, mattkimster said:

It might have been answered somewhere back in the thread, but I wondered if anyone knew how long they ran in these liveries? I'm guessing the GWR version may have still been around between 1948-1949, but I don't have any evidence to back that up. When would the the BRITISH RAILWAYS lettering been replaced by the early crest?

 

Large Prairies were fairly high profile from a passenger's point of view, and high-ish mileage, so they tended to keep up with livery changes more than many other tank locos. The G W R in green lasted from 1945 to late 1947, but there would have been a fair few still in G W R wartime black at that time. Post-nationalisation, most would have got into unlined black at an early stage (until the green era started in 1956 of course). Although a few Prairies did get lined black, I'm not convinced 5190 got the Gill Sans lettering. The early crest started to appear in May 1949. Large Prairies could appear with large or small versions of the early crest. Livery-wise, it is a very mixed up period, and dated pics are perhaps more important than most other eras. (For something quirky, here is 6160 still in GWR Egyptian in 1955.)
 

[melmerby]

On 01/12/2021 at 06:14, St Enodoc said:

That typeface doesn't look quite right.

Should be the standard Gill Sans, which is supposedly this:

 

 

BRITISH RAILWAYS

Edited April 8, 2022 by melmerby

[Harlequin]

On 02/12/2021 at 12:03, melmerby said:

Should be the standard Gill Sans, which is supposedly this:

 

 

Indeed, with a bit of kerning and tweaking to get something like this:

 

 

The width of the B and the tail of the R are the most obvious differences with the Dapol lettering.

 

Important Edit: There are several photos of Large Prairies and other classes with the name rendered in a version of a Grotesque font, NOT Gill Sans. This is what Dapol have correctly reproduced.

 

Edited May 7, 2022 by Harlequin

[lofty1966]

1 hour ago, ikcdab said:

Crappiest and appalling based on whose standards? I presume all your modelling is of pendon standards. Just remember that we all have different aspirations and we should be able to cater for all. Your criticism is unwarranted. 

His review of the large prairie is balanced and informative. It has guided my buying decision.

Ian C

You can presume as much as you like Ol' Froot.

Balanced? Trash the Hornby version totally while all googly eyed over Dapol?

Informative? I get better info here with people far more knowledgeable on the prototype subject than someone who just buys "trains".

 

 

 

 

Edited December 2, 2021 by lofty1966
Added text

[Ian Hargrave]

1 hour ago, kandc_au said:

Ian,

His actual review he has said it how he sees it, and shown the issues he has had with it straight out of the box.
You cannot say it is unpleasant....if you don't agree with him.

Anyone can post a review like his and it is only their opinion, and in this instance he has physically shown people why he has said what he has.

khris

 

 
Sorry,opinions expressed in such a manner can and frequently are damaging and can be commercially hurtful.Yes his expressed opinion of the Hornby model takes no prisoners.He is using a review of a rival product in a competitive manner and loses no opportunity to have a pop at Hornby. Yes,agree with him in whatever you may. I find it both unpleasant and gratuitously unnecessary to use some of the strong terms that he does. So Khris,you and I disagree on the matter . Sorry again for that. 

[JST]

Things move on... interesting! 

 

 

[melmerby]

On 02/12/2021 at 12:09, Harlequin said:

 

Indeed, with a bit of kerning and tweaking to get something like this:

 

The width of the B and the tail of the R are the most obvious differences with the Dapol lettering.

 

Seems like the sample I posted had been changed by RMWeb to a default text

This is actually Gill Sans MT on black as a graphic image:

 

 

Looks the same as yours

 

 

Edited April 8, 2022 by melmerby

[bob1234]

Mine arrived today. I fitted a zimo mx618n18 and it runs beautifully. I only have a straight shelf display track at the moment so do t know if running over points would cause a stall. I did try each pair of driving wheels and they all have contact however does seem to go a little jerky suggesting that the wheel contacts may struggle to transfer enough current even though contact is being made. Especially as a Hornby peckett performed perfectly when only one set of wheels are powered. Over all though very glad I waited for the Dapol model rather than going for Hornby.

[Steamport Southport]

2 hours ago, Miss Prism said:

 

Large Prairies were fairly high profile from a passenger's point of view, and high-ish mileage, so they tended to keep up with livery changes more than many other tank locos. The G W R in green lasted from 1945 to late 1947, but there would have been a fair few still in G W R wartime black at that time. Post-nationalisation, most would have got into unlined black at an early stage (until the green era started in 1956 of course). Although a few Prairies did get lined black, I'm not convinced 5190 got the Gill Sans lettering. The early crest started to appear in May 1949. Large Prairies could appear with large or small versions of the early crest. Livery-wise, it is a very mixed up period, and dated pics are perhaps more important than most other eras. (For something quirky, here is 6160 still in GWR Egyptian in 1955.)
 

 

ISTR finding a photo of one still in original GREAT WESTERN livery in the late 1940s, possibly even early 1950s. At Chester I think.

 

Photo of 5190 in PP dated 1959 BR lined green with small later crest. Looks very clean so I'm guessing at a recent repaint.

 

 

Jason

[JST]

13 minutes ago, bob1234 said:

Mine arrived today. I fitted a zimo mx618n18 and it runs beautifully. I only have a straight shelf display track at the moment so do t know if running over points would cause a stall. I did try each pair of driving wheels and they all have contact however does seem to go a little jerky suggesting that the wheel contacts may struggle to transfer enough current even though contact is being made. Especially as a Hornby peckett performed perfectly when only one set of wheels are powered. Over all though very glad I waited for the Dapol model rather than going for Hornby.

 

I think Dapol use Zimo decoders in the factory sound fitted locos so I am hopeful!