RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted August 31, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 31, 2019 On 11/06/2019 at 21:32, The Johnster said: Interesting to read that some posters reckoned an updated Bachmann Manor was on the cards a decade ago... I wasn't one of them, but I'm amazed that, given Bachmann's evident indifference, nobody else has jumped on it in all that time. Maybe a job for Hatton's.... John 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 1 hour ago, County of Yorkshire said: Apologies Miss, I left out ‘not’ Err, yes, that does make quite a difference! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted September 1, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 1, 2019 8 hours ago, County of Yorkshire said: Apologies Miss, I left out ‘not’ - see amended post above. Although you could say that my slip-up was somewhat Freudian in a way... Hornby have never struck me as a model manufacturer who makes a divergent tooling suite to produce similar - but quite different - locos, and so if we ever saw a 3150 it would a pleasant, but big, surprise in my view. Talking of Dapol and GWR stock, I am also struggling to understand their neglecting of the open goal which is shrinking their O Gauge Autocoach and B-Set down 4mm... Their K41/42 should be scaled up from N gauge too. CoY i would very much like to see Dap put the diagram N auto trailer through the 4mm shrink ray, but think that if they were to go for a 4mm B set then shrinking the 0 gauge bowenders is probably not going to be worth the bother as the 4mm world is swimming in Airfix/Hornby ones. A flat ended type is perhaps a better idea from Dap's point of view. Both would suit me perfectly; we can but hope! 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted September 1, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 1, 2019 15 hours ago, County of Yorkshire said: Hornby have never struck me as a model manufacturer who makes a divergent tooling suite to produce similar - but quite different - locos, and so if we ever saw a 3150 it would a pleasant, but big, surprise in my view. CoY 42XX? Several variations on a theme there including the rebuilds to 72XX 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Harlequin Posted September 1, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 1, 2019 (edited) Never mind the large Prairie, never mind other models they could pull from other scales, never mind Manors and Granges - the Mogul is Dapol's trump card. There are no current competitors (right?) and it should be a big improvement on previous RTR versions - especially with the clever electronic design and proposed tooling variations. The class lasted from 1911 to 1964 and appeared widely across the system performing all kinds of duties including express passenger work. (I'm sure you guys know all this but I'm just emphasizing the wide appeal of the model.) So it should give Dapol a guaranteed good seller. Let's hope and pray they are pushing ahead with this project as announced. If it's a success then they will have more scope to do other things on people's lists. (Maybe corner the market in 2-6-0s and go for the Aberdare - that was my top vote in last year's wishlist poll!). Edited September 1, 2019 by Harlequin 8 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pteremy Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 Or even produce the early and final versions of the mogul not covered by the version in production. 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Neal Ball Posted September 15, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 15, 2019 is there any definitive news on the Mogul or Priarie? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold john dew Posted September 15, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 15, 2019 Dapol website isnt very encouraging. Last Mogul update says “final CADs expected Q1 2019” Not holding my breath....hope we have more luck with the Hornby Prairie Regards John 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les1952 Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 Dapol open day is next Saturday. I would expect an update if there is one to be given to club members at that time, but certainly not before. Les Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted September 16, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 16, 2019 I'm half expecting the prairie to be dropped as quietly as they can get away with unless they can pull one out of the hat and beat Hornby to the release, but the Mogul will hopefully be well advanced; it fills a gap in large GW classes available and the mech can resuscitate many a dysfunctional Mainline Manor, so much so that it might be worth Dap's while to make it available separately. An alternative might be to go for the Churchward 3150, with no.4 boiler, not a large class but they had a long working life. If I were wishlisting I'd ask for a Collett 31xx, but that's a pretty unlikely as the drivers are smaller and an altered chassis block would be needed. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWR8700 Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 I hope the Prairie isn't completely dropped, would be nice to see an alternate version to the Hornby classes like the Churchward 3150 or something. I've noticed that Dapol tend to release different versions of a model in the second batch so we may see that yet with the Mogul. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 3 hours ago, GWR8700 said: I hope the Prairie isn't completely dropped, would be nice to see an alternate version to the Hornby classes like the Churchward 3150 or something. I've noticed that Dapol tend to release different versions of a model in the second batch so we may see that yet with the Mogul. It would be good to have one of the first twenty. I already have the Churchward with the longer cab and the Collett. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshall5 Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 Remember that the first 20 Moguls had shorter frames so a chassis re-work would be required. Ray. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 Unless it’s been planned from the start and the extra length forms part of the body or there is a similar workaround. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted September 16, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 16, 2019 4 hours ago, The Johnster said: I'm half expecting the prairie to be dropped as quietly as they can get away with unless they can pull one out of the hat and beat Hornby to the release, but the Mogul will hopefully be well advanced; it fills a gap in large GW classes available and the mech can resuscitate many a dysfunctional Mainline Manor, so much so that it might be worth Dap's while to make it available separately. An alternative might be to go for the Churchward 3150, with no.4 boiler, not a large class but they had a long working life. If I were wishlisting I'd ask for a Collett 31xx, but that's a pretty unlikely as the drivers are smaller and an altered chassis block would be needed. A cheap s/h Hornby grange can do that. Given all the separates Dapols Mogul from a manor, is a body and a pony truck that might be a better bet, though as Bachmann dont need anything, and Hornby only a body... that markets a bit of mexican standoff right now.., so fortune favours the brave, but a secretly produced ambush would be the way to announce it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tomparryharry Posted September 21, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 21, 2019 Good luck to Dapol. More than anyone, they will know what the opposition is. If they invest their money into either the mogul or prairie, and it's good, it'll sell; we all know that. That said, if Dapol decide not to move forward with either project, then the gap created by the non-appearance of either model will be filled by another manufacturer in time. I'm a cynical old so &so, and I'll maintain that if Dapol hadn't 'had a look' at either model, then both red & blue boxes would have rested on their laurels. After all, they're 'the only game in town'. So, what else can Dapol make? The world is their oyster, so to speak. Writing this, I can think of 2 Western locomotives which are wholly unique, and Dapol wouldn't need to set foot outside of the Principality. Going a little further, I can think of another handful, equally historic locomotives, each with their own USP. Summing up, I think we shouldn't berate Dapol too much. We, the readers on RM web have asked for improved RTR models, and fair play to Dapol, they have responded in a positive fashion. We still exist in an open door scenario whereby we can ask for pretty much anything we like, as long as we go about it in the right way. A great weekend in prospect folks, enjoy the weather! Ian 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted September 21, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 21, 2019 On 16/09/2019 at 20:52, adb968008 said: A cheap s/h Hornby grange can do that. Given all the separates Dapols Mogul from a manor, is a body and a pony truck that might be a better bet, though as Bachmann dont need anything, and Hornby only a body... that markets a bit of mexican standoff right now.., so fortune favours the brave, but a secretly produced ambush would be the way to announce it. The Grange chassis is a pretty tight fit in a Manor superstructure, and requires shortening at the rear; Manor frames are shorter and it shows where the rear splasher merges with the cab front. It can be done, but I suspect many owners of Mainline Manors will be looking for a easier 'drop in' sort of solution. The cheapest solution at present is probably a 'Bay sourced Airfix prairie chassis, but these are a bit hit and miss with regard to running quality and very crude by modern standards; you can see the clear plastic pick up holder and some of the gears, and there may well be an issue of the motor protruding into the cab. The Mainline Manor and 43xx were very good model for their day, but the tooling is inadequate for the modern market, having a widened firebox to accommodate the motor which would not be tolerated now; remember the kerfuffle over the Oxford Dean Goods? To be fair, Mainline did not have the advantage of modern cheap, small, and powerful motors that are much easier to hide in a steam loco profile. Bachmann are thus not in a position of not needing anything; they would have to start from scratch with completely new toolings. Similarly, Hornby would need a new tooling for the shorter chassis, though i agree they have many components that can used from the Grange. But the Chinese production model does not lend itself to that sort of sharing of compenents between projects. Each project stands alone in it's own right, so an order for, say, 5,000 Granges will result in components being produced by sub-contractor small and independent suppliers to a CAD specification, specific and minimal numbers being ordered and delivered to the assembly facility on a 'just in time' and 'just exactly enough' basis, 5k cab mouldings, 10k coupling rods, and so on. There are none left over for other projects or even spare parts! All of which is no more than the musings and ramblings of The Johnster's mortal remains, and credence should be given to it on that basis. I would love to see Dapol succeed with this project, but think that they'll have difficulty with the prairie given the imminent Hornby release. The 'Manor problem' has been discussed to death in previous threads; we all know a completely new model would go off the shelves like hot cakes, and no doubt the players are watching each other like hawks with binoculars. Fortune would indeed favour the brave, and Dapol have a potential advantage with production facilities 'in house'. We'll just have wait and see... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozzer models Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 On 15/09/2019 at 21:24, john dew said: Dapol website isnt very encouraging. Last Mogul update says “final CADs expected Q1 2019” Not holding my breath....hope we have more luck with the Hornby Prairie Regards John on Dapols web site https://digest.Dapol.co.uk/forum/main-forum/steam-aa/gwr-mogul-4300-class/7818-63xx-mogul-project-managers-blog 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les1952 Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 From Today's open day - as far as I can remember. On the 2-6-0 The slide from the presentation. I hope I'm not breaking copyright with this pic. Most of the delays on recent projects have been down to electronics- getting this board that sits inside the loco to actually work has taken time, and things are running about three months (someone might have a corrected number) delay to an awful lot of recent projects. Note (from me) that the N-Gauge Society Hunslet diesel has also been held up by electronics- in their case German - so holdups are not limited to Dapol and China. The first loco with this new board is the O-gauge 14xx which could well be here in time for Warley (I specifically asked Andy about this time frame). Andy demonstrated how easy it is to fit a decoder and sugar cube speaker to the board- no soldering, they clip or plug in and the board slides in and out on a track. The EP of the mogul was running but was a little too fast for my camera to cope with in the available light. The screen from the presentation. The Prairie is starting tooling. Note that they are intending to do the 3100, 5100 and 8100 prairies and these will be designed into the tooling. The comment was that it will be much more advanced technically than competing models and is thus very much worth doing. Others might have caught more detail than I did- my pen failed which is why I resorted to the phone camera and memory. Les 3 6 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold john dew Posted September 22, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 22, 2019 10 hours ago, mozzer models said: on Dapols web site https://digest.Dapol.co.uk/forum/main-forum/steam-aa/gwr-mogul-4300-class/7818-63xx-mogul-project-managers-blog Thank you....I looked for the forum and couldnt find it so googled Dapol 00 Mogul where it still says Q1 I am glad to be proved wrong .....your link and the post about the opening day are very encouraging. regards John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scots region Posted September 22, 2019 Share Posted September 22, 2019 YES! It lives! Perfect for someone just getting into Welsh Railways. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post RJennings Posted September 22, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted September 22, 2019 (edited) Two of my pics of the EP of the Mogul ... Edited September 22, 2019 by RJennings 12 8 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted September 22, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 22, 2019 If they intend to add the 8100 as well then I would suggest a 2nd chassis will need to be tooled. They had larger wheels compared to the other classes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted September 22, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 22, 2019 23 minutes ago, Hilux5972 said: If they intend to add the 8100 as well then I would suggest a 2nd chassis will need to be tooled. They had larger wheels compared to the other classes. Most of the Large Prairies had 5'8" wheels. IIRC the rebuilds with different wheels were 5'3" - 3100-3104, 6116 5'6" - 8101-8109 Other differences are a minefield of Tripcocks, cab shutters, bunker steps, cab window height, handrails, tank fillers ..... ad inf. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted September 22, 2019 Share Posted September 22, 2019 The 81XX had smaller driving and bogie wheels compared to the 51XX they were rebuilt from. It is less than 1mm in 4mm scale and the 51XX tyres wore down, over time to the same size. Would anyone really notice at normal viewing distances? Mike Wiltshire 1 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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