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OO gauge GWR Mogul and Prairie


Paul.Uni
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1 hour ago, Mallard60022 said:

Quick question please, to the obvious experts here. 6372 in 1960; did it have Steam Pipes?

Thank you,

Phil

I have been researching locos on the Taunton Barnstaple line in the early 1960s. 6372 was allocated to Taunton, and I have photos of it on the line in 1953, 1955, 1957, 1960, 1961, 1962 and 1963. It was withdrawn in December 1963. It had no external steam pipes and a brass safety valve cover. It seemed to have been lined green in the late 1950s but by 1962 the lining wasn't apparent.

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2 minutes ago, Douglas G said:

I have been researching locos on the Taunton Barnstaple line in the early 1960s. 6372 was allocated to Taunton, and I have photos of it on the line in 1953, 1955, 1957, 1960, 1961, 1962 and 1963. It was withdrawn in December 1963. It had no external steam pipes and a brass safety valve cover. It seemed to have been lined green in the late 1950s but by 1962 the lining wasn't apparent.

6372 was at Taunton from Nationalisation to the end.

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2 minutes ago, Douglas G said:

It seemed to have been lined green in the late 1950s but by 1962 the lining wasn't apparent.

Yes. 6372 was one of the first moguls to be repainted in lined green, for the Royal Tour of West Country in May 1956. At that time it had the original style double lining at the top of the tender. (There is a good colour photo of it in that condition on page 130 of Maidment, taken in July 1956.) On p159 of Maidment 6372 is described as being in unlined green in the summer of 1961. I am sceptical that the loco would have been repainted in unlined green, but there are photos of it with an unlined tender in 1962-63 - the clue is the larger version of the late crest which would not have fitted between lining. (See for example the colour photo on p7 of Gray, Steam on West Country Steam Lines.) So possibly by then the loco had simply been paired with an unlined tender. (By the early 1960s it can be very difficult to make out the presence of lining on grubby moguls so I find the size of the crest is the best clue.)

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37 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

 

Good grief. No wonder its startup is so jerky. That's plain bad design.

 

 

 

Typo for 38:1 I think.

 

Hi,

no not a typo but an error on my part none the less. I’ve just checked and it’s more like 35:1 for the Portescap unit.  So it’s slap bang in the traditional range of gear ratios.  Sorry for the error....

Frank

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5 minutes ago, Pteremy said:

Yes. 6372 was one of the first moguls to be repainted in lined green, for the Royal Tour of West Country in May 1956. At that time it had the original style double lining at the top of the tender. (There is a good colour photo of it in that condition on page 130 of Maidment, taken in July 1956.) On p159 of Maidment 6372 is described as being in unlined green in the summer of 1961. I am sceptical that the loco would have been repainted in unlined green, but there are photos of it with an unlined tender in 1962-63 - the clue is the larger version of the late crest which would not have fitted between lining. (See for example the colour photo on p7 of Gray, Steam on West Country Steam Lines.) So possibly by then the loco had simply been paired with an unlined tender. (By the early 1960s it can be very difficult to make out the presence of lining on grubby moguls so I find the size of the crest is the best clue.)

I must say looking at that photo on page 7 of Steam on West Country Steam Lines, I really can't see any evidence of lining on the loco itself, or the tender. But as you say, it was looking very grubby and it is hard to even tell it was green. Was it a plain green repaint, or did lining just wear off with time?

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Thanks all. The reason I was asking about 6372 is that it hauled the northbound Devonian (yup!!!!!) through Seaton Junction,  on diversion in December 1960. It was Midland Coaches as far as I can ascertain and not the Choc and Cream MK1s. That's why I was keen to find out about the  Pipes!  Thanks for the 2 photos Ms Prism....excellent and the info chaps, very much appreciated.

Phil

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7304 remained unlined green until withdrawal, and there is a good photo of it in ex works unlined green at Swindon in May 1961. So it is possible that 6372 was 'delined' at a similar time, to save money on the additional work of lining out.

 

For variety I intend to duck the issue by having 6372 in 1956 Royal Train livery, as that must have endured for a few years.   In addition, at that time it still had Churchward buffers. But in due course I think I may also model a dirty lined loco/unlined tender combination.

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There was a  73XX at Taunton. If that had Pipes I'll go for that renumbering; 7323 I think it was? That is, of course, unless the Pipes are easily removed and there are no holes to fill in etc?

Apologies for taking the thread off the technical stuff.

Phil

Edited by Mallard60022
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26 minutes ago, Mallard60022 said:

There was a  73XX at Taunton. If that had Pipes I'll go for that renumbering; 7323 I think it was? That is, of course, unless the Pipes are easily removed and there are no holes to fill in etc?

Apologies for taking the thread off the technical stuff.

Phil

That's one of the collett ones that you're talking about, the furthest you'll get with a churchward built 73xx is 7321.

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1 hour ago, Mallard60022 said:

There was a  73XX at Taunton. If that had Pipes I'll go for that renumbering; 7323 I think it was? That is, of course, unless the Pipes are easily removed and there are no holes to fill in etc?

Apologies for taking the thread off the technical stuff.

Phil

Taunton always had a few. I managed several rides out of Ilfracombe behind them in the 1950s and 60s although I don't have the numbers. The last one was a Collett with the side window cab.

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6 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

Quick question please, to the obvious experts here. 6372 in 1960; did it have Steam Pipes?

Thank you,

Phil


This is a great source for reference that not only gives information as to which members of the class had outside steam pipes fitted it also gives shed allocations and a host of other information.

 

http://www.brdatabase.info/locoqry.php?action=class&id=126002&type=S&page=mods

 

 

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14 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

There was a  73XX at Taunton. If that had Pipes I'll go for that renumbering; 7323 I think it was? That is, of course, unless the Pipes are easily removed and there are no holes to fill in etc?

Apologies for taking the thread off the technical stuff.

Phil

Which period are you interested in?

 

The steam pipes look to be a separate component so as such they should be removable. But they are not listed as a spare part, so it may require 'minor surgery'. Yes there would be small holes to fill. In addition because boilers could be swapped around by the late 20's early 30's some locos would have small patches covering the gaps where outside pipes had previously been. Depending on chosen prototype and period these might need to be modelled rather than just filling the holes.

 

The other thing to watch is the height of the wash out plugs - if that sort of thing matters to you! Dapol are doing both high and low versions so hopefully both will appear in the various livery variations in due course.

 

 

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19 hours ago, Chuffer Davies said:

With regards slow speed running I have been able to check the gearing on mine and it would appear to be an unusually low gear ratio at 16:1. 

 

That's quite bemusing and especially as the photos posted to date appear to suggest that the nowadays fairly common two stage gear train has been used. Another strange design aspect alongside the slidebars.

 

Izzy

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16 hours ago, 9402 Fredrick said:

That's one of the collett ones that you're talking about, the furthest you'll get with a churchward built 73xx is 7321.

Thanks; I will check the number.....it was 7304 at Taunton in late '59 (7323 was a Bristol engine).   11 and 16 were Exeter engines so they would be suitable.

Appreciate the reminder about the difference in Cab.

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12 hours ago, David Stannard said:


This is a great source for reference that not only gives information as to which members of the class had outside steam pipes fitted it also gives shed allocations and a host of other information.

 

http://www.brdatabase.info/locoqry.php?action=class&id=126002&type=S&page=mods

 

Wow! How did I not know about that? Thank you so much.

 

2 hours ago, Jenny Emily said:

Absolutely stunning model. 9FFFAEDC-CD98-430D-BE99-4CF5044F3037.jpeg.70ec4e4e3cd46beed559a00425a5b63a.jpeg7B559680-F9F5-4B63-8BDA-B29E5B10696B.jpeg.f5c445cffac92c263298b26be74d6883.jpeg

Thanks Jenny. That shows how daft I was not to check my facts and details before ordering about 18 months ago!!!!!!! I would have gone for this version and just changed the tender emblem and covered the loco in crud anyway.

P

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1 hour ago, Pteremy said:

Which period are you interested in?

 

The steam pipes look to be a separate component so as such they should be removable. But they are not listed as a spare part, so it may require 'minor surgery'. Yes there would be small holes to fill. In addition because boilers could be swapped around by the late 20's early 30's some locos would have small patches covering the gaps where outside pipes had previously been. Depending on chosen prototype and period these might need to be modelled rather than just filling the holes.

 

The other thing to watch is the height of the wash out plugs - if that sort of thing matters to you! Dapol are doing both high and low versions so hopefully both will appear in the various livery variations in due course.

Thanks Pt. I am not that fussed really, but because that train was so 'unusual' I would have liked to reproduce it as well as possible and to get the correct loco would have been a bonus. As or that is a detail too far in my world. Pipes removed won't be that much of a challenge (says he who only cuts up the occasional coach). I might just wait to see what other variations come out before attacking 7310. Much appreciate the great question; my layout is mine alone and represents things I never saw at that place. However I am familiar with the stock, and loco's from other experiences and Timetables from the period.

The pointy finger does not worry me if I post on here and 'someone' notices the smallest of errors of detail or period. Lets' face it there will be plenty of duff stuff all over the damn layout, if it ever gets finished.

ATB buddy.

Phil

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It certainly look like the slidebars were somewhat 're-engineered' when compared with those on display at Warley 2019 (photo courtesy of Harlequin, this thread, posted November 19, 2019):

 

IMG_20191124_091922.jpg.27fa12699eaa91ff3c18e4fc9f04bead.jpg

Edited by Coppercap
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2 hours ago, PeteN92 said:

Guess that answers if the Dapol collectors club one was produced it looks very nice and gives a further variant when trying to renumber locos.

Dapol sent this one to me for review. I enquired what would be happening to it as a club exclusive and was told that it will be being sold as a Dapol exclusive. I am presuming this means that they will turn up on their website at some point. 

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