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Charging for Diary enties in BRM


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It never ceases to amaze me how 'barbed' some people can be whilst using a facility provided by the group. You have a choice (with us) of paying for a listing in the magazine where it's less crowded or to have a free listing on World of Railways and/or RMweb, show organisers can also create exhibition topics here and engage with the readership (which can be as expansive as they wish it to be). I know that engagement is useful for several shows (including David as the OP I presume as he's been doing it for several years).

 

I see people moan when all magazines do the same things and moaning when they don't and as Steve says the pages are used for more content; are a lot of people grumbling at the other magazines that they don't also provide free online opportunities to promote their shows? No? Oh.

 

Mike has explained what UVs are (and what they're not); no, of course they're not going to read every show calendar entry - the same as the fact that not all magazine readers will read every exhibition listing.

 

RMweb provides an opportunity for organisers to submit far more information about their event than any magazine (or other well-used sites for exhibitions) yet some show organisers don't bother to use it.

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I'd rather thought that it's the publicist's job to advertise 'the show'.

 

He should hopefully choose the correct medium, to engage/encourage the chosen demograph.

 

It is a hard job, publicity. A bit like cycling along a cobbled street, with a cucumber up your bum.

 

Ian.

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I've done some research how people find out about our small show and to be frank RM Web does not score. The magazines and local publicity do.

 

And which show is that one?

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And which show is that one?

 

As you ask:

 

The 54th Rochdale MRG Model Railway Exhibition

Sat 7th April – Sun 8th April 2018

The Coach House, Lodge Street, Littleborough, Lancashire OL15 9AE

OPENING TIMES: SAT 10am-4.30pm, SUN 10am-4.30pm

ADMISSION: Adults £3.00; Accompanied Under 16s FREE

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Smaller clubs can receive more exposure that can be offered by ALL FOUR main magazines combined by listing their show on RMweb and World of Railways...both of which are free to all!

 

Hi Steve

 

I recently asked the question at our clubroom how many members use or look at RMWEB on a regular basis.

 

I think it was either 3 or 4 out of a Membership of nearly 80 Members.

 

I’m sorry but I think it is a bad move, as much as BRM and Warner’s wish us all to use the Internet it ain’t going to happen anytime soon.

 

We are all told to use or lose your local Model Shop and quite righty so.

 

Is that so different in BRM not supporting Model Railway clubs in the published magazine

 

Eltel

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As you ask:
 
The 54th Rochdale MRG Model Railway Exhibition
Sat 7th April – Sun 8th April 2018
The Coach House, Lodge Street, Littleborough, Lancashire OL15 9AE
OPENING TIMES: SAT 10am-4.30pm, SUN 10am-4.30pm
ADMISSION: Adults £3.00; Accompanied Under 16s FREE

 

Thank you for joining the dots...

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Merely as an observation, and as an irregular purchaser of model magazines (a Rail Express sub covers both sides of my interest adequately, unless something specific catches my eye in one of the others, when I'll get an electronic copy), the exhibition listings are wasted pages as far as I'm concerned.

 

I may not be typical, but I only visit a few shows, have my local favourites and visit them if the line-up, as listed on the show's website or on here, appeals. I completely accept that I might be missing out on a lot, by not studying the exhibition diary pages, but I'm happy with what I do.

 

Ultimately, should a show pay to advertise, or should I pay for pages I don't read?

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Seems to me this decision is what my mother would have called "penny-wise and pound foolish". The charge will bring in little income; if people are put off buying the magazine as a result it will bring even less—it may even cost money.

 

Personally I rely on the exhibition diary in Railway Modeller—it is far more comprehensive than any other. Partly for that reason, it is the only magazine to which I have a subscription. I think BRM has been in decline for some time—certainly since Ben Jones left, every month seems to have less and less content of interest. Based on content other than diary entries and the like, I would place Model Rail above all the others (even RM). BRM, for me, comes last.

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I think this is all a bit of a red herring.  OK so quite a lot of club members do not look on the internet.  I have been a club member in the past and accept that but if there was anything I thought of interest to them that I had seen I would mention it to them.  Club members do talk to each other you know.

 

Most of the exhibitions are very long standing and usually at the sme time and venue year in and year out.  I think if you were to ask these members who do not use the internet when shows were they could tell you off the top of their head.  OK they may not know where all of them are but the ones they are interested in they will.

 

I would also hazard a guess if you asked the question of those members who buys a magazine I bet quite a lot don't, instead they rely on them being passed on or get to look at them.  Mention has been made of people not affording to have the internet but I suspect many will not pay a fiver for a mag either.

 

No sorry I just don't see it.  If people want to go to shows then they will have an interest in them and will find out some way or another.  I doubt many actually rely on a couple of pages of show details in a monthly magazine. 

 

I just get the impression at times that as a breed generally we do not like change.  Whether a change makes sense for those doing it for their own reasons being they commercial or otherwise, if it doesn't align with our own little world we moan.  BRM seem to be trying to move the hobby and the magazine/forum forward with new stuff all the time.  Yet whatever they try somethin new some are never satisfied.  The 3D Pendon stuff is a prime example which was obviosuly a marmite thing.  Some even moaned that the front page on the forum was giving them a migraine.  Don't look at it then! 

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I think BRM has been in decline for some time

 

It's frustrating to read such opinions dressed up as assertions when our solid data shows sales are improving; you simply cannot extrapolate your own personal choice to be a trend, certainly without any evidence.

 

To say I'm annoyed with some people treating Warners like a coconut shy is an understatement; even within this topic people who have been plain nasty towards BRM, Warners, me, RMweb and its membership elsewhere on the 'net and having made public displays of flouncing off from here with grand displays of vitriol to then come back with the (rumbled) intention of anonymity to lob grenades or promote their own interests gets right up my vest. Without such jibes the forum is a much more pleasant place and of far more use to the majority.

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What seems strange to me is that the events page has been reduced in BRM for several months. Looking at the October 2017 BRM (published in September in the lead to to a busy exhibition time) there are just 9 exhibitions listed

 

The fact that those objecting to the change haven't noticed that the change took place ages ago, and BRM hasn't been deluged with topics about exhibitions being a flop, would indicate to me that the change was a good call

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What seems strange to me is that the events page has been reduced in BRM for several months. Looking at the October 2017 BRM (published in September in the lead to to a busy exhibition time) there are just 9 exhibitions listed

 

The fact that those objecting to the change haven't noticed that the change took place ages ago, and BRM hasn't been deluged with topics about exhibitions being a flop, would indicate to me that the change was a good call

 

 

A flop from whose point of view??

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RMweb provides an opportunity for organisers to submit far more information about their event than any magazine (or other well-used sites for exhibitions) yet some show organisers don't bother to use it.

Yes, there are shows that don't promote on free-to-view forums. It's a great shame. Missed opportunities and all that.

 

G

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Rather than charge for diary entries, why not just drop the feature altogether?

It will give you more space for other things.

It will give you less grief.

As has been said, on paper RM wins hands down.

Just promote the RMweb exhibition calendar instead ( on the index page maybe).

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Hi Steve

 

I recently asked the question at our clubroom how many members use or look at RMWEB on a regular basis.

 

I think it was either 3 or 4 out of a Membership of nearly 80 Members.

 

I’m sorry but I think it is a bad move, as much as BRM and Warner’s wish us all to use the Internet it ain’t going to happen anytime soon.

 

We are all told to use or lose your local Model Shop and quite righty so.

 

Is that so different in BRM not supporting Model Railway clubs in the published magazine

 

Eltel

 

If we are playing the "extrapolate from your mates opinions" game then how about this.

 

My club has 90 members. Less than 20 of those go to any other show than our own event. Take out those going to specialist events - GOG Telford and Scaleforum - and you are down to single figures. I could actually give a list of people I'd expect to see at an exhibition.

 

On that basis, only 10% or readers have ANY interest in the diary dates, yet 100% of them are paying for those pages that could otherwise be filled up with modelling content. 

 

This is from an active club with 5 layouts under construction. I don't understand it myself as I love going to shows, but that it does appear I'm not typical in this.

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From a personal point of view, I'd much rather have more articles (which I can refer back to and use later) than a list of dates I never read, are soon out of date, and would take me seconds to look up on the internet anyway.

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It seems to me that railway modellers tend to fall in to the high age profile so are most likely not to have or use the internet. I was quite surprised just how many members of the NGS were not internet connected, don't want it or can't afford it.

 

I'm not so sure that those older people are likely to be multiple magazine purchasers - I can't see any reason or connection there  - as they are more likely to be pensioners, more 'careful' with their money and have less disposable income. It's an age thing.

 

G

 

Bloomin' heck - I recently entered my eighth decade and I have two model railway magazines on subscription and regularly buy a third one in WHS or a model railway shop (I stopped buying the other two to save shelf space as well as a bit of money) and I buy three prototype magazines monthly and have had another irregular one by regular order ever since it started and until it recently finished publication.     And I can assure you - as some who know me will no doubt testify - that I am 'careful' with my money.

 

Don't paste labels on anybody on an age basis - I've no worries about all the PC 'ageism' nonsense but it pays not to judge a book by the age of its cover

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It surprises me how few exhibitions start threads, which is free, fail to link those threads to their own websites Facebook pages etc, fail to update the pages as the show nears, “bump” the threads to the top of new content etc etc

 

Sadly, it’s easier to comment to negatively, particularly with the benefit of anonymity than to say “found that useful.” Personally, I think the age of time based adverts in magazines has passed. I do agree with a comment above, I think from andyram, that magazines could do more on exhibitions and explaining the benefits of them. But then, as discussed elsewhere, the editor has a challenging job in trying to keep content fresh and not repetitive.

 

One thread on here, that had some good exhibition content, was 2manyspam’s Treneglos thread where Chris linked the descriptions of the build and the challenges of exhibitions to how the design of that layout evolved. Might make an interesting article to give a perspective on exhibiting. (Of course such article may already have been done and i’ve just not seen it!)

 

David

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Bloomin' heck - I recently entered my eighth decade and I have two model railway magazines on subscription and regularly buy a third one in WHS or a model railway shop (I stopped buying the other two to save shelf space as well as a bit of money) and I buy three prototype magazines monthly and have had another irregular one by regular order ever since it started and until it recently finished publication.     And I can assure you - as some who know me will no doubt testify - that I am 'careful' with my money.

 

Don't paste labels on anybody on an age basis - I've no worries about all the PC 'ageism' nonsense but it pays not to judge a book by the age of its cover

 

I don't think there are any 'labels pasted'. It's fairly well accepted that the railway modelling fraternity has a high proportion of older folk, without doubt older people are more likely to be pensioners and there is no reason why they should have a greater propensity to be multiple magazine purchasers (than anyone else). Plus it's a fact the there is a higher than average percentage for the population as a whole of NGS members who are not internet connected. Obviously there are some that will buck the trend (vive la difference) and but unfortunately some are more likely to be grumpy about perceived ageism.   :no: 

 

G.

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