50 Years since the end of BR Steam!

[jamie92208]

Really ?? In the last couple of years of steam the attraction of the 20 Caprotti Standard 5's was the lone reason why I went to Patricroft shed so often, fortunate in being one of the last sheds open, it gained a reputation for it's handling of the class, with the last conventional valve-geared versions ending up there as well. Although a little slower in acceleration, the Caprotti's proved to be more economical runners as long as not too much was asked of them.

I've seen it reported elsewhere that the shedmaster at Patricroft liked his Standard 5's so much that he was very reluctant to obey orders and actually withdraw them.

 

 

Jamie

[Enterprisingwestern]

To anyone modelling the last months of steam (there's a whole thread elsewhere on this), your notes are very informative but confirm that it would be very easy to have far too much variety of locos.  It would seem that by May-June '68, probably 90% of the remaining steam locos were Black 5s and 8s, in fact I was surprised to see so many Standard 5s in your lists.

 

The fly in the ointment is that I didn't record which locos were in steam/serviceable, although I do have memories of which ones were, such as 44777, which made such a tumultuous effort of going onto Patricroft shed that cinders from the chimney burnt a hole in my BriNylon shirt, remember them?, and my mother was none too impressed on my return home! Despite, as I've stated before, having no overriding affinity for steam, unlike many others, it was moments like this which made a lasting impression on me.

 

Mike.

[bike2steam]

Huh, talking of which, bumped into an old friend at Patricroft, seen many times at Willesden while shedded at Nuneaton. Sorry I only had a crude 'box-brownie' at the time.

 

[Enterprisingwestern]

Huh, talking of which, bumped into an old friend at Patricroft, seen many times at Willesden while shedded at Nuneaton. Sorry I only had a crude 'box-brownie' at the time.

 

Image (3).jpg

 

Fantastic.

 

That's the one.

Don't apologise, that was a box brownie more than I had!

 

 

Mike.

Edited August 5, 2018 by Enterprisingwestern

[APOLLO]

Carnforth last day - 4 August 68, some newly named locos !!

 

 

 

A lot more last week photos on my Flikr site below.

 

As others have said, days I'll remember all my life..

 

Brit15

 

[luckymucklebackit]

BBC Radio Lancashire have posted this on their Facebook Page, https://www.facebook.com/BBCLancashire/videos/10156456407606069/

 

Jim

[Trev52A]

BBC Radio Lancashire have posted this on their Facebook Page, https://www.facebook.com/BBCLancashire/videos/10156456407606069/

 

Jim

 

That was great, Jim!

Thanks for posting it with the link. I'm not on facebook but it played fine.

 

Cheers

Trevor

[APOLLO]

"There's summat about British people and steam engines - it's their contribution to civilisation"

 

Very true statement (from above facebook link)

 

Here is a young Apollo 50 years and two days ago, standing in the cab, mates brother in the firemans seat (mate took the photo) Carnforth shed.

 

 

Edited to add - Just noticed (after 50 years !!) the head code on the Clayton is 1T60 - this was used on test trains for new / shopped locos from Crewe to Carlisle - lots of discussion re these trains on the "why was this rarely modeled" thread.

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/52572-why-is-this-so-rarely-modelled/page-17

 

So what train was this Clayton on ?

 

Brit15

Edited August 5, 2018 by APOLLO

[luckymucklebackit]

75009 was one of the last locomotives I saw being towed to Campbells Scrapyard in Airdrie, I later compiled a database of all locomotives scrapped in the Coatbridge/Airdrie area and have these notes: 75009, 75019, 75020 and 75048 last recorded at Carnforth 21/09/1968, noted on Carnforth-Leeds line 17/10/68 hauled by D206, broken up by Campbells Airdrie November 1968.  For a small yard Campbells had a voracious appetite for steam locomotives, consuming some 215 locomotives between November 1961 and November 1968,  Apparently their record was 42264 which arrived at the yard from storage at Polmadie on 16th September at 10:00am and was cut up by 4:15pm!!

 

Jim

[Phil Bullock]

75019/48 were plainly good uns....in traffic until the end, and 75009 was a preservation candidate at one stage IIRC but had a minor firebox issue

 

75027 didn't appear in traffic in the photos here unless I have missed her....but not withdrawn until August 68. Was she quietly set aside for preservation in advance of withdrawal?

 

Phil

[Chris Turnbull]

75019/48 were plainly good uns....in traffic until the end, and 75009 was a preservation candidate at one stage IIRC but had a minor firebox issue

 

75027 didn't appear in traffic in the photos here unless I have missed her....but not withdrawn until August 68. Was she quietly set aside for preservation in advance of withdrawal?

 

Phil

 

You've missed her, Phil. 

 

Here is 75027 at the back of Rose Grove shed on 10th July.

 

 

And here she is a short time later with steam being raised (although you wouldn't know it) having been dragged out of the siding.  I have no details of what duty she was on but I do remember the fire had just been lit which was why I took the photo.  These have appeared in earlier posts but I don't know which.

 

 

Chris Turnbull

[Trev52A]

75019/48 were plainly good uns....in traffic until the end, and 75009 was a preservation candidate at one stage IIRC but had a minor firebox issue

 

75027 didn't appear in traffic in the photos here unless I have missed her....but not withdrawn until August 68. Was she quietly set aside for preservation in advance of withdrawal?

 

Phil

 

You raise an interesting point, Phil.

 

According to my notes, I only saw this loco in action on one occasion in the two weeks I was in the area in July/August, and even then it was only a light engine move out of Carnforth shed and away to the south (if I remember correctly). Its green livery was clean enough to see the lining, certainly on the tender..

 

Seen from the footbridge across the main lines, 75027 heads south from Carnforth shed on 19th July 1968

 

Perhaps your post might tempt out other photos?

 

Cheers

Trevor

[Trev52A]

You've missed her, Phil. 

 

Here is 75027 at the back of Rose Grove shed on 10th July.

 

680710 Rose Grove 75027 8.9.jpg

 

And here she is a short time later with steam being raised (although you wouldn't know it) having been dragged out of the siding.  I have no details of what duty she was on but I do remember the fire had just been lit which was why I took the photo.  These have appeared in earlier posts but I don't know which.

 

680710 Rose Grove 75027 8.10.jpg

 

Chris Turnbull

 

The front numberplate appears to be reinstated by 19th July, Chris - unless it's a very good replica!

It also seems to have some sort of inscription on the smokebox door?

 

75027 leaving Carnforth shed for the south on 19th July 1968

 

Trevor

[Trev52A]

Going back to my view of 75027 (above) - the figure '5' on the smokebox looks slightly 'off', so it must be a home-made plate, but very convincing.

It also appears to have lost its electrification flashes at the front (below the steps). I had to lighten the original to clarify but they seem to have gone!

Regarding the inscription on the smokebox - lightening the picture shows the word 'please...' (I think!) Perhaps the start of  'Please save me for the Bluebell Railway' and then he ran out of space?  (Well, that's where it ended up, of course!)

 

Cheers

Trevor

[Phil Bullock]

Smashing photos gentlemen - many thanks.  In Chris's photo at the back of Rose Grove she looks like she hasn't moved for a while....looks like she might have had a bit of a clean at Carnforth though....

 

Anything of her working a train I wonder? Or was she just trundled around to keep her fit?

 

Always liked the proportions of the Standard 4mt 4-6-0s - looked spot on to my eye

 

Phil

Edited August 7, 2018 by Phil Bullock

[Old Gringo]

Well, now the dust has settled, I've finally found time to put in a late report of my events concerning August 4th, 1968 and 2018.  Apologies in advance for the 'quality' of the snaps!

 

You've all probably heard the saying, "Cheshire born and Cheshire bred, strong inth' arm and thick inth' 'ed".  Well it still seems to apply to yours truly, as towards the end of last week, I spent three consecutive days at Kidderminster, assisting with shifting lots of stuff and culminating with stewarding duties on the Severn Valley Railway's 1T57 special.  This train ran on the hot and sticky Saturday evening behind Ivatt, Class 4MT 2-6-0, No. 43106, (which had arrived on the Valley on August 2nd, 1968).

 

It seems to me that the eighteen entries I've made onto this topic have all been leading up to this one;

 

The Finale - August 4th 1968.

 

A dictionary definition of the word Finale is "the final scene in a show and the last and often most spectacular item in a public performance". I like to think that the last seven months of following the demise of the steam locomotive right to the End [1] was leading up to this August Finale, when six specials were time-tabled to run on Sunday, August 4th, Sixty-eight.

 

The six trains were listed as follows [2]:

1L50 R.C.T.S. Special, hauled by 48476 + 73069, 70013 'Oliver Cromwell', 45407 + 73069.

1T80 G.C. Enterprises (for the 'Bahamas' Society) hauled by 45156 ('Ayrshire Yeomanry').

1T85 'British Rail' Official Trip, hauled by 45305 throughout.

1Z74 L.C.G.B Special, hauled by 70013 + 44781, 48773 + 44781, 45390 + 45025.

1Z78 S.L.S. Special Number One, hauled by 44871 + 44894 throughout.

1Z79 S.L.S. Special Number Two, hauled by 44874 + 45017 throughout.

 

On the way home quite late on Friday night (2nd August 1968), we chose to skip Saturday's events and instead to follow some of these special excursions planned for the Sunday (4th August), which was classed as the last day of working steam locomotives on the British mainland railway network [3].  I believe that Frank worked out the schedule and also borrowed his Dad's motor for the day.

 

The Race to watch the last gasps!

 

After picking up Peter and myself from Stockport (Edgeley) station, we began our last 'chase'  . . . .

 

 

. . . first beside the lineside at Droylsden, Station Junction where we spotted 1Z78, S.L.S. Number One at 11:45am.  Then a trek northwards and a bit of fell running  . . .

 

 

. . . gave us time to catch 1Z78 again near Todmorden passing at 14:15, before de-camping quickly,

 

 

to the top of 'Copy Pit' to catch 1Z79, S.L.S. Number Two at 15:00. [4]  Forty-five minutes later, we caught 1Z79 again at Darwen, before moving on to Daisy Hill station,

 

 

. . . to catch 1T85, with 45305 on the Official 'British Rail' special at 16:50.  And from Daisy Hill we moved on to Astley, to catch 1Z79 for a third time at 18:10.  Unlike today when, with G.P.S., satellite and mobile 'phone communications, we would have known which trains were running late and where we might have been able to make better connections, after six hours chasing and six hits, we thought it best to head back to Stockport station, where several trains were due to terminate their steam haulage.  We netted 1Z79 for a fourth time at Stockport around 19:30 and I called it day after 1T80, the G.C. Enterprises ('Bahamas') special arrived at 21:15.

 

Not a bad Finale and only a week to go before the final End Game with 1T57 'The Fifteen Guinea Special'.  Almost the average man's weekly wages, for a trip behind the last serviceable main-line steam locomotives, with some cooked grub and salad butties, a glass of wine and a commemorative scroll that you could write your own name on afterwards!  How I wish I could have afforded it, but . . . .

 

'Yesterday has gone' [5] and so have over 18,000 of our earth days since Sixty-eight, so, no time for regrets.  Three days ago at Kidderminster, I met quite a few of the people from the day of the Finale in 1968.  This also included several of the MNA squad, who were engaged again in the cleaning of a Black Five (45110), as they did all those years ago before the day of the specials.  I spoke briefly to Ian Krause and passed on Trevor's best wishes.  In return Ian asked me to pass on greetings and thanks for all the pictures Trevor produced for the 'North East Focus' event of 1998 held in the NRM.

 

However my highlight for August 4th 2018 happened after rubbish clearing and box-shifting duties on the 1T57 train on Saturday night; I managed to catch five minutes with my head out of the window of the coach right behind the tender of 43106.  And riding down the Severn Valley at 22:30, under a clear sky on a warm night behind a steam engine - you just can't beat it, can you?  How very lucky we've all been over those last fifty years.

 

Maybe some more steamy tales in a few days.

All the very best,

John.

 

Notes:

[1] The word End can be used as a noun, a verb or an adjective; the definition as a verb meaning 'to destroy' is telling, but the noun brings a lump to the throat, 'the point at which something stops happening, or ceases to exist'.

[2] the plus sign between locomotives indicates that the train was double-headed.

[3] IIRC, there were still a few steam locomotives operating in Northern Ireland, besides the previously mentioned three narrow-gauge engines on the Vale of Rheidol branch-line.

[4] Somewhere here (like Trevor the day before) I must have dropped my trusty Kodak 127 camera, as all subsequent negatives have a creeping tree-like infusion from the bottom right corner.  However, I've since seen lots of far better photographs to help remember the day by!

[5] The debut record by the group Cupid's Inspiration, which was released 19th June 1968 and reached number 4 around late July/early August and the demise of the steam engine in regular service.

[The Border Reiver]

Further to the story of 75027...

 

When steam banking of Shap ceased in April 1967 most of the Tebay locos were taken to Carlisle Upperby shed for storage. Although closed to steam in December 1966 it was still used to store withdrawn and other locos. Here is a photo I took around September 1967 of it on the shed where it could be found for the latter half of 1967 along with 75019. They were two of the lucky ones as most of the stored locos went for scrap.

 

[Antony Jenkinson]

You raise an interesting point, Phil.

 

According to my notes, I only saw this loco in action on one occasion in the two weeks I was in the area in July/August, and even then it was only a light engine move out of Carnforth shed and away to the south (if I remember correctly). Its green livery was clean enough to see the lining, certainly on the tender..

 

(2116a) 75027 Carmforth19-7-68 (T Ermel).jpg

Seen from the footbridge across the main lines, 75027 heads south from Carnforth shed on 19th July 1968

 

Perhaps your post might tempt out other photos?

 

Cheers

Trevor

On Sunday 28th July 1968 75027, along with class mate 75019, worked the Carnforth to Skipton via Wennington section of The Severn Valley Railway and The Manchester Rail Travel Society special train from Birmingham to commemorate the end of BR standard gauge steam locomotive working.

 

Earlier in the year 75027 had been the regular Grayrigg bank engine waiting at Oxenholme to assist trains if required. It was at Oxenholme for this duty on the 4th May 1968, the last day a banker was rostored to be provided (from Carnforth shed).

The bank engine had been observed at Oxenholme on 19 days in the period from 1st to the 26th April - 75027 was on the duty on each of the 19 occasions. 75019 performed the work on 27th April, Stanier Class 5 4-6-0 44709 was the banker on 29th and 30th April and 75027 was back on the turn on 1st and 2nd May and on the last turn on the 4th (I have no record of which engine worked the turn on the 3rd May). (Information from the notes of Kendal based observer / enthusiast Ewan Preston).

 

The engine was probably photographed by Chris at Rose Grove whilst rostored for work on the Grassington branch, the locomotive working was a Rose Grove turn but in summer 1968 the engine used was one of Carnforth’s BR Standard Class 4MT 4-6-0s. 75027 was recorded on this working in May and June 1968.

 

I cannot see any reports of the loco at work after the rail tour mentioned above (there are photographs on Flickr dated 2nd August appearing to show it being shunted into the sidings near to Carnforth shed close to where other locomotives set aside for preservation were stored. There is another photo dated the 3rd August on Flickr showing the engine with it's chimney covered with sacking.

 

The loco was transferred from Skipton to Carnforth in January 1967 along with classmates 75019 and 75039. The 3 locos were reallocated to Tebay in April 1967. (Banking on Shap with steam locomotives didn't end in April 1967 – that was when the ex LMSR 2-6-4 tank engines were replaced by BR Standard class 4 4-6-0s which performed the duties until the end of December 1967 when (most) steam working ended over Shap). Whilst 75039 did work from Tebay and was withdrawn in September 1967, 75019 and 75027 appeared to have been stored at Upperby during summer 1967 (I've found photos of them stored  in June and August (75027) and September (75019) and a reference re. 75027 that it was 'held in reserve for banking duties but never was never called to do any (information from Bill Jamieson on the 'RailScot' website).

 

Thank you to everyone who has shared their memories and their photographs of the last standard gauge steam locos at work in summer 1968. I've really enjoyed these 50th anniversary memories -Thank you Tony Jenkinson (Morecambe)

[Phil Bullock]

Wonderful gen re 75027 Tony - many thanks for sharing

 

Phil

[jamie92208]

Wonderful gen re 75027 Tony - many thanks for sharing

 

Phil

I believe that there are some photos of a BR Standard at work on the Grassington Branch in one of Donald Binns' books. I'll try and find my copy and post details.

 

Jamie

[david.hill64]

I believe that there are some photos of a BR Standard at work on the Grassington Branch in one of Donald Binns' books. I'll try and find my copy and post details.

 

Jamie

Don't forget also DaveF's excellent thread which contains many photos of standards on the Grassington branch. You can even play 'guess the colour'!

[Trev52A]

@ Old Gringo

 

What a mad day 4th August must have been, John, and you've captured it very well!

 

Just a pity I can't remember much about it, myself! (see my earlier post for that day)

 

Well, we've still got the accounts of the 'Fifteen Guinea Special' to look forward to in three days time. Hopefully someone who was on it can share his thoughts, as well as those who watched it go by.

 

Cheers

Trevor

[Phil Bullock]

Don't forget also DaveF's excellent thread which contains many photos of standards on the Grassington branch. You can even play 'guess the colour'!

 

Absolutley!

 

Have done a search on Dave F's thread which hasnt come up with any 75027 photos on Grassington branch ... but did find this link to Carnforth on 2nd August

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/96859208@N07/12595078733/in/photostream/

 

Phil

[Old Gringo]

Well that was a tour de force John. What an evocative piece of prose. We ought to send this thread to a creative writing class as an example of superb work. Mind you it helps that the subject is so emotive and most of us were at that age when the wider world was opening up to us.

 

I may have mentioned it before but a book that I have read and re read several times is "Steam Railways in ret by O S Nock. In particular the last chapter when he describes two runs over Shap on the footplate of Stanier Pacifics. He abandons his usually precise semi technical writing and describes his feelings and the sheer emotional impact of being on the footplate of such magnificent machines as he went over Shap, knowing that it would probably be his last such journey.

 

 

The only other book that's very good is "The Mohawk that Refused to Abdicate and other tales of Steam" by David P Morgan with photos by Phillip Hastings. In this they document several safari's round the US and Canada in the 50's to see the last working steam.

 

 

Note. A Mohawk was a Ney York Central class of 4-8-2's.

 

 

Jamie

 

Thanks are due to Jamie for reminding me about these books.  With all the excitement of August 4th and the Finale, I nearly forgot to draft a more pertinent reply!

 

I too enjoy the last chapter of Oswald Nock's, 'Steam Railways in Retrospect', with the 1964 run of 'Duchess of Rutland'.  An engine which coincidentally nearly took my head off on 10th August 1964, whilst on a similar duty, when we were travelling back from Carlisle on a special day out spotting trip.  I had my head out and this huge front end came racing towards me, but you had to get the number, didn't you?

 

'The Mohawk that Refused to Abdicate" is a magic book: Brilliant writing from David Morgan, (who was at the time of publishing (1975) the Editor of 'Trains' magazine for Kalmbach, Milwaukee) 304 pages, plus hundreds of Philip Hastings photographs, with surely the most shiny metallic red and silver dust-jacket ever produced [1].  You don't have to be a steam-nut, like me, Paul, or Jamie to enjoy Morgan's lyrical style of writing and Hastings' superb photographs, just an enthusiast of the railways.

 

Here's part of the text that produced the title of the book (from page 180 onwards and dated September 1955) and I hope it's not breaking copyright rules too much to quote it almost in full.

 

"Then . .  well, right in the middle of all this to be exact, tension - intangible, unseen, quite real - began to build in the tower [2].  The dispatcher had temporarily lost track of Extra 3005 East and was attempting to pin down its location . . . . . .  The conversation, gave no direct hint of what was to come.  As a result neither Hastings nor I noticed a faint smudge of smoke building on the horizon to the west.  A distant whistling was adjudged to be yet another first class schedule, and we were scanning the timecard to identify it when another, nearer blast propelled us to trackside at the double".

 

"Why it's the extra! Can't be - he might just have - it is and he's rolling!"

"Rolling is mild language for what he was doing [3].  Extra 3005 East, now no less than 98 cars between tender and caboose, was bearing down on Shelby with all the implications of destiny of the Book of Revelations, gaining momentum with each revolution of those four pairs of 69 inch driving wheels, making the legal mile a minute with ease and perhaps a notch or two better.  The elephant-eared aristocrat of Alco [4] rammed across the diamond crossing with smoke going high, the Baker gear up in near center, and the crew enjoying the breeze".

"Out of her dusty wake came her train - rattling, rocking, rolling and riding [5] towards Cleveland at such a pace that, as Hastings recalls it, 'one felt called upon to wonder at what moment the whole shebang would take either to the air, or the adjacent countryside'. . . . . . . . . . "

"Wonderful!  Too often steam departs from us in the form of a fan trip that suffers a breakdown -  or in a line of dead power nursed to the junkers by a Geep [6] -  or as a local freight locomotive, wheezing out of town without ceremony or drama.  How much better to wind it up like the 3005, taking a quiet Ohio town apart, pinning its ears back and performing like Alco said her 4410 cylinder horsepower should perform."

 

This text overlays part of the sky of a double-page spread (p182/183) which has a photograph taken level with the rail head of the giant 4-8-2, #3005 powering across the diamond crossing, smoke going high in the sky and cars disappearing into a cloud of dust in the horizon.  Magnificent, now that's something I'd really like to have seen! Then there's the chapter beginning page 276, "The 2-10-0s that thought they could - and did!"  September 14, 1956.  All too much to read before lunch!

 

I cannot recommend this book enough and another associated favourite, containing Four Decades of Railroad Writing by David Morgan is, 'Confessions of a Train-Watcher', again published by Kalmbach, in 1997, edited by George Drury and which was compiled after Morgan's death.

 

You can never have too many books, no matter what the shelves tell you!

Happy reading.

All the very best,

John.

 

[1] Another couple of hours have just been spent enjoying this book!  What contrasts were available to the train-watchers in the States during the 1940s and early Fifties: from the Union Pacific's 'Big-Boys' to late Victorian 4-4-0s (Aka, the classic 'American').  Maybe my favourite photograph though is the double page spread (82/83), where an old 2-6-0 is in silhouette crossing a long truss girder bridge over a wide still river, set against a bleak industrial landscape. The magic of black & white photography at its best.

[2] tower = U.S. equivalent of signal cabin.  At Shelby, Ohio, the tower controlled the flat crossing of the New York Central's double-track main by the Baltimore & Ohio's Willard branch.

[3] No. 3005s Engineer, John Hitchko, who retired in 1970 after 47 years service on N.Y.C.

[4] 3005 was an L-3a New York Central 4-8-2, (a wheel arrangement dubbed 'Mohawks' on the N.Y.C.) equipped 'with elephant ears (AKA smoke deflectors) and built by Alco at Shenectady, New York in late 1940.

[5] Not in any way like the chorus of Morningtown Ride by the Seekers released in November 1966!

[6] A Geep is a type of American diesel locomotive.

[Antony Jenkinson]

Phil,

Hello!

Have a look at Dick Manton's Flickr site (Gricer1946), he has 5 good pictures of 75027 - 1 at Oxenholme on the bank engine duty and 4 on the Grassington train when the engine was in good external 'nick'. I've found a nice picture taken by L A Nixon in the October 1968 issue of the RCTS' 'Railway Observer' of the engine on the Grassington duty with the loco in the same condition as the 4 pictures mentioned above, it is dated 21st June 1968. I've also found a photo on the web (by Colin Garratt?) dated 17th June 1968 of the engine on Arnside viaduct with a long freight train heading towards Carnforth but I can't find anything about it working after the railtour on the 28th July 1968.

Regards Tony Jenkinson (from Morecambe)