Retooled class 47 in 7mm scale

[47606odin]

the statement in reply to my comment on there is that it has moved on from the example shown there on the facebook group. i for one like the shape of the rest of it

 

[MGR Hooper!]

Here's a sample of the re-tooled O gauge Class 47 from Heljan...

 

 

 

 

[Miss Prism]

The radius (in side-elevation) between the cab front rake and the window 'shelf' looks too sharp to me.
 

 

[MGR Hooper!]

9 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

The radius (in side-elevation) between the cab front rake and the window 'shelf' looks too sharp to me.
 

 

 

And too broad also...

 

But I've given up on trying to tell Heljan anything. I raised this very point with Heljan when they shared CAD images and got a very blunt reply from someone obviously fed up of talking to potential clients and said they were aware of the issue and that amendments were being made. Clearly they've not been made yet.

Edited December 19, 2019 by MGR Hooper!

[mdvle]

It is a shame that it appears Heljan haven't changed and appear to be content to continue to put out models with glaring issues.  Doesn't make one hopeful for the OO version announced over the summer, perhaps this will encourage someone else to enter the OO Class 47 new tooled market?

[Hal Nail]

Im happy to sort the nose and overall it looks like a vast improvement over the old one. I'm hoping that the latter still have some residual value as can't see much use for it once replaced. 

Edited December 19, 2019 by Hal Nail

[MGR Hooper!]

1 hour ago, Hal Nail said:

Im happy to sort the nose and overall it looks like a vast improvement over the old one. I'm hoping that the latter still have some residual value as can't see much use for it once replaced. 

 

Most people will happily sort out that issue, if it was priced more along the lines of what Dapol has to offer in the same scale.

 

Heljan's pricing is far ahead and their models don't really reflect that yet.

 

I was eagerly looking forward to this, not quite happy now. Like others, I was interested in this as I thought the OO gauge one would be a nice addition. But I think I'll stay with the ViTrains Class 47s for now.

[Hal Nail]

1 hour ago, MGR Hooper! said:

 

Most people will happily sort out that issue, if it was priced more along the lines of what Dapol has to offer in the same scale.

 

Heljan's pricing is far ahead and their models don't really reflect that

I've said elsewhere the 121 pricing will be interesting with them both releasing one around the same time next year.

[47606odin]

Here’s a better view. ledge is too flat and too low in comparison to the side windows 

 

[43179]

21 minutes ago, 47606odin said:

Here’s a better view. ledge is too flat and too low in comparison to the side windows 

 

21 minutes ago, 47606odin said:

Here’s a better view. ledge is too flat and too low in comparison to the side windows 

 

 

Oh dear  that's going to cause all sorts of other compounded errors    I'd also be concerned about the proportions of the headcode box,  the tops of the windscreens are straight on the model , rather than having a gentle curve to follow the rainstrip, and the tail lights don't really look that well observed. It may be the lighting , but the head on shot makes the whole cab look rather narrow.  In the cropped image of the model from Miss prisms post above the negative rake of the lower cab front appears really extreme.  Ok, so this is a RTR class 47 on O gauge, where there is at present no other available , but In 2019/2020 , for a £600ish model , of such an iconic loco , is this really good enough? 

Regards

Jon 

Edited December 20, 2019 by 43179
cant spell

[47606odin]

53 minutes ago, 43179 said:

Oh dear  that's going to cause all sorts of other compounded errors    I'd also be concerned about the proportions of the headcode box,  the tops of the windscreens are straight on the model , rather than having a gentle curve to follow the rainstrip, and the tail lights don't really look that well observed. It may be the lighting , but the head on shot makes the whole cab look rather narrow.  In the cropped image of the model from Miss prisms post above the negative rake of the lower cab front appears really extreme.  Ok, so this is a RTR class 47 on O gauge, where there is at present no other available , but In 2019/2020 , for a £600ish model , of such an iconic loco , is this really good enough? 

Regards

Jon 

I think a light infill on the ledge at the rear to create a bit of a slope and rounding off the front of the ledge would make it a lot closer. Doable myself as I only in envisage only getting one at the moment, and being sector livery, also hides some of it with black paint

[Daddyman]

Is it also too flat across the windscreen? There's something somewhere not right. That might be why it has a monobrow instead of two separate eyebrows. 

 

As others have said, doesn't bode well for the 00 version. But then I had very low hopes anyway with Heljan, and would have put money on them getting it wrong - as they are with the class 25/3. 

[Hal Nail]

I think the top of the windows is actually a straight line but due to the complex curves immediately above, often appears otherwise. My photo here is not conclusive but I did note down they are straight when I climbed all over one and measured up some years ago. (The cab windows are 39 inches across).

 

As for the monobrow strip over the cab windows, Crewe locos were built like that. Brush built had separate eyebrows. As built the tail lights were orientated differently though and this is modelled Brush style.

 

It does look narrow but I'm wary of judging proportions from one or two photos - we will probably have a better idea after the Bristol show or similar.

 

 

Edited December 20, 2019 by Hal Nail

[forest2807]

7 hours ago, 47606odin said:

Here’s a better view. ledge is too flat and too low in comparison to the side windows 

 

I’m not so sure. The black paint surrounding the cabside windows perhaps creates an illusion. To my eyes, the distance between the bottom of the cabside window frame relative to the top of the cab front ‘shelf’ looks ok. Only by actually measuring it will we get a definitive answer though.

[tinsley-toton]

In reality, the 'ledge' does appear to be somewhat lower than the bottom of the cab windows, more in line with the top edge of the blue paint.

Photo cropped from Flickr

[brushman47544]

For me the cab door windows are square when they should be more rectangular and the roof grills curve too much at the bottom where they meet the bodyside http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_zoom_v3.php?img=0948000103000

Edited December 26, 2019 by brushman47544

[Hal Nail]

Being a bit picky but I think the marker lights are on the large side as well given those shown are the smaller ones from the no. 2 end.

[thedman]

Also remember that the tail lights are different (hinge horizontal or vertical) dependant if they were Brush or Crewe built.

[deltic17]

Also the windscreen wipers are still wrong (this was a problem with their original version) and they have carried that error into the new model!! In the original version they had different versions of the wipers at each end I recall which was also wrong! Looking at pictures from the 1980's of all 47's on Flickr and they all have (not sure how to describe this) a straight THIN wiper and not an angled!! one as in the photo above.

 

This is simple to correct so hopefully Heljan will be listening? - hopefully someone can point it out to them.

Edited December 27, 2019 by deltic17

[uk_pm]

Sadly, I agree with all the comments on here about the various areas of the model in need of further work.  But I think it is a shame that nobody has yet commented on those aspects of the model which show real improvement and imagination; the bogies and under frame in particular (not to mention the Heljan mechanism which is always best-in-class in my experience).  I am certainly looking forward to the release of this loco, whenever it comes.  

 

PM

[deltic17]

3 hours ago, uk_pm said:

Sadly, I agree with all the comments on here about the various areas of the model in need of further work.  But I think it is a shame that nobody has yet commented on those aspects of the model which show real improvement and imagination; the bogies and under frame in particular (not to mention the Heljan mechanism which is always best-in-class in my experience).  I am certainly looking forward to the release of this loco, whenever it comes.  

 

PM

Yes I agree - credit where due - it looks a lot better

I think we just focus on the areas for improvement re comments to try and help get an even better model

[Rugd1022]

Comparison with 47 105 on the Glos & Warks…. would like to see a painted bodyshell which may or may not help....

 

 

 

[tractor_37260]

On 20/12/2019 at 01:09, 43179 said:

Oh dear  that's going to cause all sorts of other compounded errors    I'd also be concerned about the proportions of the headcode box,  the tops of the windscreens are straight on the model , rather than having a gentle curve to follow the rainstrip, and the tail lights don't really look that well observed. It may be the lighting , but the head on shot makes the whole cab look rather narrow.  In the cropped image of the model from Miss prisms post above the negative rake of the lower cab front appears really extreme.  Ok, so this is a RTR class 47 on O gauge, where there is at present no other available , but In 2019/2020 , for a £600ish model , of such an iconic loco , is this really good enough? 

Regards

Jon 

 

Would agree 're the head on image, the real cab is wider at the cab doors /cab side windows , looking square onto the front-end the cab side window framing is visable...

Dosn't bode well for the new 00 version..... "a slim jim instead of a tubby duff" ?

Edited December 31, 2019 by tractor_37260
add photo

[Hal Nail]

14 hours ago, tractor_37260 said:

 

Would agree 're the head on image, the real cab is wider at the cab doors /cab side windows , looking square onto the front-end the cab side window framing is visable...

Dosn't bode well for the new 00 version..... "a slim jim instead of a tubby duff" ?

I'm about to re-start an attempt to widen the old one and this photo is about as good a head-on as I've seen!

 

I'm pretty sure the one head-on shot we've seen of the new model is distorted by the camera position - the 3/4 view suggests there is a taper and the mock-up cab on their Facebook page is tapered. I'm waiting to see it in the flesh before drawing too many conclusions.

Edited January 1, 2020 by Hal Nail

[MGR Hooper!]

12 hours ago, tractor_37260 said:

 

Would agree 're the head on image, the real cab is wider at the cab doors /cab side windows , looking square onto the front-end the cab side window framing is visable...

Dosn't bode well for the new 00 version..... "a slim jim instead of a tubby duff" ?

 

Sorry, I'd have to disagree, the camera used to take a head on shot of the model is far too close to the model. Therefore whilst they're both head on shots, the angle and distance is different and cannot be used as a comparison.