Strand and its trains

[Guy Rixon]

Yesterday, I bought some back-numbers of the London Railway Record and in one was a one-page article on operating Whitecross depot, with a track plan. The article is by Mr. Andrew Emmerson, quoting an earlier article, in the MRC, by Mr. Ernest Carter. I summarise the method of working below as some of the details are illuminating (at least to me). There's another RMWeb thread that mentions this depot but I can't find it and I don't think that thread had all the information.

 

Whitecross Street deport was the Midland's city goods-depot. It was connected to the City Widened Lines, between Aldersgate Street and Moorgate Street stations. It was badly damaged in the Blitz and did not operate after WW2.

The track plan is drawn with South at the top and the running lines shown are the City Widened Lines; the Inner Circle proper is just off the bottom edge of the map.

 

Trains enter the depot from the west and the connection is facing for arriving trains. There is no need to set back, as at Smithfield.

 

Arrivals run directly into the line marked A on the map, which is connected to the run-round line E beyond the map's left-hand edge. The locomotive runs past the depot, over the wagon turntables on line A, and leaves the train straddling the turntable access to the depot. The engine then runs round, on line E and waits at the west end of the layout.

 

The inbound wagons are shunted by capstan onto the wagon turntables. I.e., they could have done some of the shunting with the locomotive but they preferred to use capstans.

 

Outbound wagons are assembled on the dead-end line B. Presumably the brake van is put to the end of the siding first. This siding is very short for a marshalling road and the train can't stretch beyond the points marked F if it's to get out, since the headshunt is too short to allow it to be set back into road A. Measuring on the OS map (via the Library of Scotland site), I make the clear space no more than 450 feet. Allowing 50 feet for engine and brake, that's 22 wagons at the most, and somewhat less if any "modern", longer wagons are in the train. Therefore, the train length is apparently limited by the depot layout, not by the ability of the engines to manage the gradients on the Widened Lines. (I'm fairly certain that the load limit was 30 or 35 wagons for MR trains not calling at Whitecross Street.)

 

All the wagons are loaded and unloaded on the floor above the basement. According to the article, the outbound wagons are brought down and moved to the departure line while the inbound ones are being moved upstairs. That's some serious rush, and probably is the reason why all the shunting is by capstan with the locomotive idle.

 

This combination of a train-limiting depot, with a facing connection and wagon turntables strong enough for locomotive to run over erases some of my assumed restrictions for designing Strand's goods depots. Clearly another planning epicycle is due.

[Nearholmer]

That is a brilliant find.

 

I certainly highlighted this depot in another thread (no, I can't remember which!), and pointed to some photo resources, and made a stab at the track-arrangement based on what I could surmise, but what I guessed was nothing like as complicated as this!

 

Its no wonder that this place was taken out of use as early as the LMS could find alternative places to handle the traffic.

 

Does what you have cite the date/edition of the article by Carter? I've got a lead on old editions of MRC and MRN, so might be able to obtain it.

 

Kevin

Edited December 9, 2018 by Nearholmer

[Guy Rixon]

Mr. Carter was writing in 1936 and his piece was in a booklet on layout design published by the MRC rather than the magazine itself: Designing and operating a layout (No. 1 - Goods Traffic).

[Guy Rixon]

Does anybody know what a "snatch head" is for? It sounds like something to shout across a playground at one's enemy. I first thought that snatch heads might be the unpowered pulleys that work with the powered capstans, but some of them seem to be in the 4 foot, 

[Compound2632]

The upstairs lines are clearly visible on the OS 5 ft / mile map, along with the run-round formed by the connection of lines A and E at the eastern end. I can see how the grd of line at the western side, with the traverser, is set up to feed wagons from the arriving train to the wagon hoist but I feel sure that the easternmost line, which seems to go inside the warehouse, must have been for loading / unloading, with the lines parallel to it feeding more wagons in via the traverser. 

 

Fortunately the headshunts at either end, where the 0-6-0T might linger, are open!

[Nearholmer]

Yes, and there's a very good pair of photos of the interior of the upstairs in the NRM collection, showing the hoists and traverser(s).

 

It would make a cracking 'cutaway' model. Is that the sort of thing that you're intending, Guy? 

Edited December 9, 2018 by Nearholmer

[Compound2632]

Yes, and there's a very good pair of photos of the interior of the upstairs in the NRM collection, showing the hoists and traverser(s).

 

 

One here.

[Nearholmer]

And, my stab (a wild one, in the dark, that missed its mark by quite a distance!) at the downstairs track layout is here http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/125446-locomotives-on-wagon-turntables/?hl=%2Bwhitecross+%2Bstreet&do=findComment&comment=2824120

 

And, here is a snatch block. https://www.sailboats.co.uk/allen-40mm-dynamic-ball-bearing-snatch-block?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI-a-aqtiT3wIVR7DtCh3bfw8IEAYYASABEgJGFPD_BwE

 

They can also be sort-of loose, attached to short tethers, to allow them to rise up under load, to give the rope a better angle.

 

I can't see why such a block couldn't be in the four-foot ....... sort of fits with the health-and-safety-nightmare nature of such places ...... something else to trip over, and to cause whizzing wire ropes to occur at unexpected angles in unexpected places!

Edited December 9, 2018 by Nearholmer

[Guy Rixon]

So a snatch head is indeed a pulley for redirecting capstan power, but not the upstanding kind of bobbin used in other yards. Thanks for that.

 

I don't know about a cut-away depot. On one hand it would be an excellent subject to model, but on the other, it exposes the fact that wagons aren't actually getting unloaded and returned empty. I had though to have the warehouse interior as part of the fiddle yard, so that the wagon loads could be removed and replaced and replaced with folded sheets. More thought needed.

[Guy Rixon]

I finished the D1335 wagon. These photos show it before and after weathering of the exterior, which was done with a black oil-wash. Weathering has darkened the perceived shade of grey from something too light for my taste and and brought it in line with the wagons I'd painted previously using enamels. I must remember to paint one shade lighter than target on future builds.  

[Guy Rixon]

“...she took her hand and raised her brush. For a moment it stayed trembling in a painful but exciting ecstacy in the air. Where to begin?--that was the question at what point to make the first mark? One line placed on the canvas committed her to innumerable risks, to frequent and irrevocable decisions. All that in idea seemed simple became in practice immediately complex; as the waves shape themselves symmetrically from the cliff top, but to the swimmer among them are divided by steep gulfs, and foaming crests. Still the risk must run; the mark made.” 

― Virginia Woolf, To the Lighthouse

 

Quite.

[Regularity]

I misread the eighth word in there, and was horrified as to what might follow. Thankfully I back-tracked and read it properly.

 

For my O lovel Eng. Lit. one of the short stories was called “Winter Cruise”, by Somerset Maugham. As is the wont of school teachers everywhere, even in the fifth year/year 11 we would be asked to read out parts of the work. I couldn’t understand why everyone was laughing about something I misread and said out loud.

In reference to a piece of Wagner, the ship’s captain was singing alernative words (in German) to “Siegfried’s martial strain”.

Except I said - genuinely thinking it must refer to wedding march or similar - “Siegfried’s marital strain”.

 

Even Mrs. Symmonds the class teacher was crying with laughter.

 

(I mention this to show that ‘smut’ is not always intentional.)

[Ravenser]

Mr. Carter was writing in 1936 and his piece was in a booklet on layout design published by the MRC rather than the magazine itself: Designing and operating a layout (No. 1 - Goods Traffic).

 

At that point EF Carter was  the MRC - founder , proprietor , editor, principal writer, distributor  and on occasion, binder

[Guy Rixon]

Christmas and January have not been the productivity-fest I'd planned, but I can now present a new map of the Bedford-Street deviation of the CCEJR.

(Apologies for the scrotty drawing.)

 

This fixes the alignment relative to the streets, and I have a track schematic for the running lines and connections that seems to work, so it's just about done.

The railway has morphed into a tight S-curve. This seems to be the only plausible way to fit it into London while crossing the Strand at viaduct level and going underground thereafter (as agreed by the Board members on this thread). The tighter arm of the S is very slightly above 10 chains, removing the need for continuous check-rail (which I absolutely do not want). The speed limit through the curves would be around 25 mph, which is fine, because nothing runs through Stand without stopping except for un-braked goods and mineral trains.  Taking the railway across to the other side of Bedford Street would ease the curves, but that requires stopping up Henrietta Street and digging up the churchyard, which was Not Approved.

 

The railway is level from the river bridge to the bridge over the Strand. North of there, it descends at 1 in 47 and is underground from a point opposite Henrietta Street; the line is in cutting between Bedford Street and the goods depot up to that point, and the northern half of that depot is elevated slightly to clear the covered way. 

 

North of King Street, the railway runs under North Bedford Street, which is fictional and therefore not on the historic street-map. It doesn't run under Garrick St. as that road points in the wrong direction.

 

The layout covers the stretch from the bottom of Villers St. to just north of Bedford Street depot. The two goods depots are in front of the two fiddle yards, and Buckingham St. depot, the southern and older one, is on two levels with wagon hoists. On the map, the cross-hatched track indicates the street-level connections into this area, including the short tramway down the end of Buckingham Street. This tramway used to extend further south to a barge dock on the riverside, but all the wharves here were swept away when the Embankment was built. Details in this area are still uncertain, and are likely to be prototyped by my building a cameo layout.

 

There's another street tramway, not marked on the map, that runs from Bedford St. depot into the Market square. But it's been out of use since the Battle of Henrietta Street...and that is a story for another day.

[Edwardian]

I like this.  It's an elegant 'S' curve and seems to require minimum disruption to the road thoroughfares.

 

The only major architectural loss I have noticed so far is the large Florentine Renaissance revival building in red brick and terracotta, forming the corner of Bedford Street and Chandos Place.  Will Chandos Place be blocked off?

[Guy Rixon]

3 hours ago, Edwardian said:

I like this.  It's an elegant 'S' curve and seems to require minimum disruption to the road thoroughfares.

 

The only major architectural loss I have noticed so far is the large Florentine Renaissance revival building in red brick and terracotta, forming the corner of Bedford Street and Chandos Place.  Will Chandos Place be blocked off?

The big, fancy building south of Chandos place (currently containing TFI Friday's) was the Civil Service Supply Association department-store. The surviving building is from the rebuilding of the site c. 1920 and out of period. The original, which was smaller, was medium-naff Victorian gothic and is no loss. The building opposite across Chandos place (currently Cafe Nero) was a coachworks up to at least 1995. The  existing building is later, possibly post-WW2 rebuilding.

 

Yes, Chandos Place must be closed to wheeled traffic. It may be possible to provide a foot bridge.

 

Further up Bedford street, the goods depot has displaced the Post Office (built c.1880 IIRC), which I shall move a couple of door down and place on the very end of the layout.  The PO chose the site because they could add a complex of out buildings (sorting halls?) in the block behind, which was redeveloped then. In the alternate history they can still do that, but their service yard has to be fitted in around the goods depot, and will have to be further north.

 

At the south end, the railway has splatted some worthwhile houses. Samuel Pepys used to live there, but possibly in York place rather than Buckingham street, York place being significantly up the money-density gradient. 

[Guy Rixon]

The latest wagon, and the last Cambrian Railways vehicle I can justify this far from Wales. I build them because I love the livery, and because I have transfers to use up. This illustrates the use of a Posca paint-pen to blacken the ironwork instead of a brush. It works well on the external ironwork, less well on the internal knees - the angle of the nib is important, and I couldn't get it perpendicular to the work - and badly on the single bolt-heads.

[Edwardian]

Very realistic painting.  I am particularly taken with the colour of the interior.

 

It is a pity that Posca pens do not come in 0.3 and 0.5mm for lining, but I have ordered some to trial.  Sounds like wagon strapping is another good use of them,

 

From where do you obtain the Cambrian transfers, I have a Cambrian Kits Cambrian Rys wagon to letter? 

[Penlan]

15 hours ago, Edwardian said:

From where do you obtain the Cambrian transfers, I have a Cambrian Kits Cambrian Rys wagon to letter? 

Try http://wrrc.org.uk/online_sales/transfers.php

[Guy Rixon]

I finished some Mousa kits for D4 wagons, which had been slouching around the stock shelf mocking me. These are printed bodies from Bill's own printer and date from the period last year when the printer was giving grief (it's fixed now, apparently). They were not top-quality prints, having one good side and one that looked a bit melted about the corner plates, with some deep grooves in both side and both ends. At first I thought I could fix up the defects (no, I couldn't). Then I thought of displaying them good side to audience only. Finally, I gave them permanently-fixed sheets, which hides the problems.

 

What I should have done is sent them back to Mousa for replacement, but by the time I'd realised this I'd had them for a year and tried to fill the printing grooves, so I didn't feel good about returning. Anyway, let this stand as a warning to inspect printed parts when received.

 

There are some other problems in these specific kits. The brake parts come as a set that include variants never fitted to D4, but only one of each type. This makes it harder to fit brakes on both sides, and this was one diagram where the second set of brakes was added quite early, as the wagons were overhauled. The buffer height is about 0.5mm too low. It's not really feasible to pack the axleguards to the right height because the springs and axleboxes, which are printed with the body, don't allow enough clearance. If I were to build more of these kits, I think I might replace the axleboxes and springs with the no.2 boxes from Coastline Models and do the wagons as the 10-ton variant (D9 IIRC). But I have enough LNWR high-sided opens for now. 

 

The sheets are based on the information on the LNWR-wagon-sheets thread of this forum. I've accepted the consensus that the earlier sheets, with the serifed lettering, had a white cross. I've speculated that the later, longer sheets, with the sans-serif lettering, had the hypothetical red saltaire and this is why no cross shows up in the period photos (because red does not photograph on early emulsions). Sheet 654, on the left, would be brand new at the period of Strand, which makes it doubly embarrassing that some clod has put a hole in it already. Worse, these wagons went through rain on their way to London (there are modelled puddles in the hollows of the sheets) and the load under sheet 654 is an electrical generator. Some rather sharp letters of complaint are in post...

[Compound2632]

For D4/D9, there's also the Ratio route. Have you got enough tie ropes? There should be 16 altogether:

 

 

This is one I haven't actually used as I realised it's only suitable for May 1920 - February 1921. Note the ties on the long side have in this instance been attached to the eyelets in the triangular tabs on the first seam (not, in fact, modelled) rather than the eyelets along the edge.

[Guy Rixon]

Having cleared away some projects, I now have space to begin building my siphon kit. Not that I'm shipping milk to Strand, mind you, I want this for the strawberry traffic.

This is a K's kit for an O1 (6-wheeled) siphon that I won on eBay a couple of months ago. For a late-'70s kit it's actually quite good (c.f. the earlier, all-whitemetal version of this kit which was not worth building), being about right in all major dimensions and having the moulded detail, where present, in the right places.

 

Where it goes a bit wrong is the roof and ends. The roof is much too thick, as it's not really feasible to mould it to a scale 1" thick. The designer of the tooling has compensated for this by reducing the height of the ends, but has forgotten to adjust the width of the roof. It comes out jug-eared, sticking out by about a millimetre too far at each side and looks silly.

 

Clearly, I shall have to make a new roof, probably of brass, and I shall have to alter the ends to bring them back to the right height. Therefore, I'm proposing to alter the model to diagram O2, the earliest, 6-wheeled siphon which had a single-arc roof. This is, in fact, a more appropriate subject as four of the O2 vans were fitted specifically for carrying fruit. Of these, one was a different height and two were allocated to strawberry traffic from Cheshire, which seems a little out of catchment for London. I want my siphon to carry express strawberries from the Channel Islands (via Weymouth), so that leaves me with exactly one vehicle, no. 623  of lot 268, to model.

 

The cast stepboards will have to go, because they are too soft to stay in shape, and also the cast axleguards (because suspension). I may try to salvage the springs and axleboxes.

 

Most of the moulded detail can stay, but I'll re-do the door handles and the lamp irons.

 

I confess to an absolute fetish for brown vehicles, so this is going to be fun.

 

 

[Guy Rixon]

Some progress on the siphon. First, pre-assembly modifications to the mouldings.

 

Then assembly, and some more plastic work on the body:

As one can see, it's not going to be super-fine, but it will serve and the plastic work has been pleasing to do.

 

Next, I want to build the chassis and roof before I detail and paint the body. I'm trying to work out the details of the shelving.

[drduncan]

Guy,

With date of 1909 you could remove the infill planks on the lower side in the outer ‘x’ and have pre 04 livery (G.W.R) as repaint stock the new livery would have taken time.

drduncan

[Guy Rixon]

Yes, I considered modifying for the old livery. In the end, I went with the course of least hackery. Also, I have transfers for the later livery.