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bennyboy

White/Blue Refurbished DMU livery

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Interesting never realised this livery began in 1974

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Swindon was still turning out some units in all over blue in 1980. The early class 117 white/blue units didn't have the headcode panel plated, domino panel remaining, and also didn't receive marker/tail lights either. Not sure when they became gangwayed, but some seemed to have been semi-refurbished.

 

I recall seeing the asbestos removal shed which was alongside the GWML. So was it only units that went through there that were then painted into refurbished colours, be that white/blue or later blue/grey?

 

Dave

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Hello Bennyboy, I think they stopped painting this livery to DMU sets around 1980'ish as BR had problems in keeping the paint work clean.

 

BR then went onto painting DMU's into the Blue Grey, this included painting some all blue none refurbished sets into Blue Grey livery.

 

Hope this helps

 

Craig.

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I remember a plain blue livery with a thick white strip running wth these around Manchester, I think they were 104’s.

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I remember a plain blue livery with a thick white strip running wth these around Manchester, I think they were 104’s.

Yes, the white stripe indicated they were intended for the Manchester to Blackpool route, although this one strayed off its diagram and went to Clayton West,https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/3869678327/in/photolist-6Pb63U-RBTbCa-9isvXN-9gRn8c-6TX7xR-6Nq4bX-6NqC8D-7BNVa6-7BNVsn-6U2W8G-6U32ab which subsequently closed and is now the Kirkleees light railway. 

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Yes, the white stripe indicated they were intended for the Manchester to Blackpool route, although this one strayed off its diagram and went to Clayton West,https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/3869678327/in/photolist-6Pb63U-RBTbCa-9isvXN-9gRn8c-6TX7xR-6Nq4bX-6NqC8D-7BNVa6-7BNVsn-6U2W8G-6U32ab which subsequently closed and is now the Kirkleees light railway.

 

That would explain why I remember them so well, it was usually Blackpool I was heading, 6 car one of these, as a kid, head by the window all the way, unless it was cold.. then i’d be at the front seat watching the drivers view. Edited by adb968008
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Now, I know this is going slightly off topic, but I am convinced that in the late 60s, probably about 1967/8 there was a class 114 painted blue/grey for a short time. I remember thinking that BR must have decided to paint the DMUs identical to the Mk1s I saw. 

 

I lived by the line between Sleaford and Boston, and so saw 114s every day. I have no photo because I rarely took photos of units in those days and if I thought that was the livery due to be around for years I would have concentrated my efforts on the green ones; if only I could have afforded the film. 

 

I have never seen a photo of one in those days, and was half resigned to consigning my memory to the bin until one day someone posted an image of a pay train leaflet issued by BR when the Lincolnshire lines were rationalised. 

 

This is the leaflet.

 

 post-4474-0-31996900-1517754608_thumb.jpg

 

 

Now, I know it is just a stylised publicity drawing, but would they have used a two-tone unit if there were none, and they were either all blue or all green?

 

I can't prove anything and have no idea of the number; plus it must have been repainted all over blue pretty quickly, as I only saw it a few times - but maybe it is true?

Edited by jonny777
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Now, I know this is going slightly off topic, but I am convinced that in the late 60s, probably about 1967/8 there was a class 114 painted blue/grey for a short time. I remember thinking that BR must have decided to paint the DMUs identical to the Mk1s I saw. 

 

I lived by the line between Sleaford and Boston, and so saw 114s every day. I have no photo because I rarely took photos of units in those days and if I thought that was the livery due to be around for years I would have concentrated my efforts on the green ones; if only I could have afforded the film. 

 

I have never seen a photo of one in those days, and was half resigned to consigning my memory to the bin until one day someone posted an image of a pay train leaflet issued by BR when the Lincolnshire lines were rationalised. 

 

This is the leaflet.

 

 attachicon.gif1929386_1037156289678919_7723330357288885879_n.jpg

 

 

Now, I know it is just a stylised publicity drawing, but would they have used a two-tone unit if there were none, and they were either all blue or all green?

 

I can't prove anything and have no idea of the number; plus it must have been repainted all over blue pretty quickly, as I only saw it a few times - but maybe it is true?

 

These photos on the railcar website show blue/grey and refurbshed liveries http://www.railcar.co.uk/type/class-114/images

 

HTH

 

Moxy

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Those photos are from the later periods. 

 

This was in the 1960s. 

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Now, I know this is going slightly off topic,

Quite a lot off topic, really, as it has little to do with the OP and is likely to spawn a long discussion. Perhaps better raised as its own thread in the Transition Diesel Liveries forum?
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Swindon was still turning out some units in all over blue in 1980. The early class 117 white/blue units didn't have the headcode panel plated, domino panel remaining, and also didn't receive marker/tail lights either. Not sure when they became gangwayed, but some seemed to have been semi-refurbished.

 

I recall seeing the asbestos removal shed which was alongside the GWML. So was it only units that went through there that were then painted into refurbished colours, be that white/blue or later blue/grey?

 

Dave

A Blue Class 116 appeared at Tyseley in 1987 that was previously a Stratford set and the works dates show that this was painted at Doncaster Works in June 1984. Seemingly no one told the Works that the fashion for Class 116s by then was Blue/Grey. The other theory is that as it was receiving a "C4" overhaul - bogies etc but not body - but it needed a coat of paint for some reason, over and above the normal specification, that a coat of blue was easier than marking out for Blue/Grey.

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Hello Bennyboy, I think they stopped painting this livery to DMU sets around 1980'ish as BR had problems in keeping the paint work clean.

 

BR then went onto painting DMU's into the Blue Grey, this included painting some all blue none refurbished sets into Blue Grey livery.

 

Hope this helps

 

Craig.

By my reckoning it was around mid 1979 when the last "blue stripe" livery was applied. I have records of vehicles painted Blue/Grey later in 1979. 

Selected classes were worthy of Blue/Grey on unrefurbished vehicles, typically sister vehicles of vehicles that had been refurbished (Classes 101, 102, 107, 108, possibly some 110s,115, 116, 118, 122). Some classes had all vehicles refurbished, so there were no unrefurbished vehicles when Blue/Grey was applied. 

Oddities were some of the Class 127 centre trailers that gained Blue/Grey in late 1982 and ran into St Pancras for a few months before transfer to Tyseley (these were unrefurbished - later repaints into B/G had also been refurbished).

Other oddities were odd vehicles of classes 104 and 105 that were not worthy of Blue/Grey but that received it anyway. ScotRail were responsible for some of these, presumably to make the vehicles match the rest of their fleet. Also, a complete 104 triple set appeared in Blue/Grey in Spring 1982 on the Buxton line. The power cars of this later became the West Highland "Mexican Bean" power twin. The prototype 104 "half engined" set also received B/G for use around Manchester. Some 104 centre cars also benefitted from B/G, I suspect they were planned to run between B/G Class 108 cars on the Buxton line, but some plain blue trailers also ran there.

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IIRC the all over blue livery was applied from 1966, initially with small yellow warning panels and white roof domes, to all dmus except Swindon Intercity (class 123) and Transpennine.  Full yellow ends, with only a very few early examples retaining white roof domes, followed in 1967, and blue and grey appeared in the early 70s.  The 'white with blue stripe' livery, 1974 onwards, denoted a set that had been internally refurbished; new seats, trim, and flourescent lighting.  I do not recall any Swindon or Gloucester Cross Country set, or Inter City/Trans Pennine set in this livery, but it was very common on South Wales 116s.  I cannot recall any 116 in South Wales in any rail blue livery without gangways, but am happy to be corrected by those of greater erudition on this point; conductor guard operation in the area dates to 1966.  

 

I would suggest that all South Wales 116s were in blue/grey livery by the early 80s.

Edited by The Johnster
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IIRC, Cross-Country and Inter-City designated units never wore white with Rail Blue stripe.  Cross-Country units went all blue from 1966, and subsequently into Blue and Grey, during the early seventies.  Inter-City units may have transitioned from green to blue and grey directly. 

 

There is plenty about all of these shenanigans, here...

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/forum/138-transition-diesel-liveries/

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It’s worth mentioning that Railtec now do decals for refurbished DMUs or ‘white ladies’ as we used to call them.

 

Most interesting for me is that they also do a pack for the prototype refurbished Met Cam unit too with the thinner blue stripe on one side.

 

Cheers

 

David

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IIRC, Cross-Country and Inter-City designated units never wore white with Rail Blue stripe.  Cross-Country units went all blue from 1966, and subsequently into Blue and Grey, during the early seventies.  Inter-City units may have transitioned from green to blue and grey directly. 

 

There is plenty about all of these shenanigans, here...

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/forum/138-transition-diesel-liveries/

 

Agree that the Inter City and Cross Country types were always deemed to be worthy of Blue/Grey from late 1960s or thereabouts. Even when some Class 120s  had the refurbishment treatment, they retained B/G on account of their superior status.

Scotland had to be different -  their small fleet of Class 120s that usually ran between Aberdeen and Inverness retained plain blue until they went through the refurbishment scheme (first unit outshopped June 1977) around 1977/78/79. Then they gained Blue/Grey.

The Class 126 Inter-City units and their sisters in the SC79xxx series were also odd in that the Edinburgh-Glasgow 79xxx sets gained B/G as this was a high profile Inter City service, but the SC51xxx series that ran from Ayr retained plain blue until late 1970s when B/G appeared.

A further oddity has recently emerged on the Railcar Association website where the first Class 107 set to be refurbished in 1978 came out in Blue/Grey, even though in England the works was still applying Blue Stripe livery to equivalent classes. (i.e. Non Cross Country or IC types that were to be kept a long time).

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Class 110 Calder Valley units were latecomers to the refurbishment programme, but then they were late-build units so that figures. Only three sets gained the Blue Stripe livery, and when the Hornby model came out in the early 1980s, the box contained a set of decals to change the vehicle numbers - top marks to Hornby as they had correctly chosen the authentic nine vehicles that wore this livery!

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1979/80/81 I remember 101s in both white with blue stripe and all over blue, 118s in blue, 119, 120 blue grey, Cardiff 116 Blue Grey, then 101s all started to repaint into blue grey.

 

Only 117s I saw locally were blue grey, or choc cream, as in the blue only or white blue era they will still in London.

 

All the West Country high density DMUs in mid to late 70s were AFAIR all over blue

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Only 117s I saw locally were blue grey, or choc cream, as in the blue only or white blue era they will still in London.

Set L403 wore white/blue livery, but wasn't fully refurbished as it retained a domino headcode and no marker/tail lights.

 

Dave

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Set L403 wore white/blue livery, but wasn't fully refurbished as it retained a domino headcode and no marker/tail lights.

 

Dave

I believe many 117s had this configuration, but subsequently the WR decided to abandon the domino headcodes and go for 2x marker lamps as standard.

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1979/80/81 I remember 101s in both white with blue stripe and all over blue, 118s in blue, 119, 120 blue grey, Cardiff 116 Blue Grey, then 101s all started to repaint into blue grey.

 

Only 117s I saw locally were blue grey, or choc cream, as in the blue only or white blue era they will still in London.

 

All the West Country high density DMUs in mid to late 70s were AFAIR all over blue

A few years before, when five Class 101 sets were transferred from Scotland to WR, they caused a bit of a problem. Until that time, the WR DMU fleet was entirely long frame sets (apart from a few oddball Park Royal sets displaced from the LM) and conformed to the WR way of thinking - Inter City sets for eponymous services, Cross Country sets for longer distance services (in theory) and high density Suburban sets for local services. IC sets were 4 car (with some reduced to 3 car) while everything else was mostly three car but with odd single cars, single cars + DTS or Suburban power twins. 

Until that time, the WR did not have any Low Density DMUs as used on other regions, apart from the four Park Royal twins. When these 101 triples arrived, sets 800 - 804, they were not Suburban sets, so by default they became honorary Cross Country sets. So - these 101s gained the "badge of honour" of Cross Country sets, Blue/Grey livery! As they arrived when headcodes were still used, these were the only 101s to run for BR with 2 digit headcodes and in B/G livery. 

 

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/662/31520607880_d8abc6893a.jpg

 

As a consequence, these five 101 triples went from plain blue - to B/G - then refurbished into Blue Stripe - then back to B/G.

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A few years before, when five Class 101 sets were transferred from Scotland to WR, they caused a bit of a problem. Until that time, the WR DMU fleet was entirely long frame sets (apart from a few oddball Park Royal sets displaced from the LM) and conformed to the WR way of thinking - Inter City sets for eponymous services, Cross Country sets for longer distance services (in theory) and high density Suburban sets for local services. IC sets were 4 car (with some reduced to 3 car) while everything else was mostly three car but with odd single cars, single cars + DTS or Suburban power twins. 

Until that time, the WR did not have any Low Density DMUs as used on other regions, apart from the four Park Royal twins. When these 101 triples arrived, sets 800 - 804, they were not Suburban sets, so by default they became honorary Cross Country sets. So - these 101s gained the "badge of honour" of Cross Country sets, Blue/Grey livery! As they arrived when headcodes were still used, these were the only 101s to run for BR with 2 digit headcodes and in B/G livery. 

 

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/662/31520607880_d8abc6893a.jpg

 

As a consequence, these five 101 triples went from plain blue - to B/G - then refurbished into Blue Stripe - then back to B/G.

 

 

Fits in with what I remember

 

By 1980 or so all 101s were at Bristol

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