Cobalt Turnout Motor Problems

[David Todd]

I didn't know that thanks.

 

In the meantime, I have just received a message from DCC Concepts offering to look into this for me. So many thanks to them for that.  Hopefully we can get it sorted.

 

- Don

Am sure your problem will be sorted.

[Torper]

I bought a box of six Cobalts in 2014.  One was faulty and was replaced.  Since then another has stated the clicking as demonstrated by the OP.  I haven't done anything about it as the motor concerned is in an awkward place.  It only clicks when switched over one way, and so when it switches over that way I turn off the power to it as soon as the switch is completed. That stops the clicking.  The problems did effectively put me off Cobalt motors, however - my Tortoises, though bulkier, have all worked flawlessly.

 

DT

[Anthony566]

I bought a box of six Cobalts in 2014. One was faulty and was replaced. Since then another has stated the clicking as demonstrated by the OP. I haven't done anything about it as the motor concerned is in an awkward place. It only clicks when switched over one way, and so when it switches over that way I turn off the power to it as soon as the switch is completed. That stops the clicking. The problems did effectively put me off Cobalt motors, however - my Tortoises, though bulkier, have all worked flawlessly.

 

DT

Drop an inline resistor to the feed for this point motor ( around 240 ohm ) and see if that stops the clicking. Edited February 4, 2018 by Anthony566

[David Todd]

I bought a box of six Cobalts in 2014.  One was faulty and was replaced.  Since then another has stated the clicking as demonstrated by the OP.  I haven't done anything about it as the motor concerned is in an awkward place.  It only clicks when switched over one way, and so when it switches over that way I turn off the power to it as soon as the switch is completed. That stops the clicking.  The problems did effectively put me off Cobalt motors, however - my Tortoises, though bulkier, have all worked flawlessly.

 

DT

 

DT,             A disclaimer. those are not my initials, I use dt, 

[TWG]

Drop an inline resistor to the feed for this point motor ( around 240 ohm ) and see if that stops the clicking.

 

This seems to me a sensible suggestion.  I have 2 early Cobalts on my layout, both of which clicked intermittently.  I lowered the voltage and they have never clicked since. 

[Anthony566]

DT, A disclaimer. those are not my initials, I use dt,

Lol

[richard.h]

I originally intended to use Cobalts a few years ago when starting to motorize my points, bought six, 2 worked 2 stuck and 2 clicked, so I tried Tortoise motors and never had a faulty one, they all worked perfectly straight out of the box every time and I've bought quite lot.

When I contacted the dealer about them I was told to get in touch with DCC in Australia 'they're very helpful'.

 

I understand that Cobalt have now sorted out the teething problems and that their point motors are now very reliable but i am perfectly happy with the choice I made and if anyone wants six Cobalts they are in a box under my layout

[ChrisG]

This is on the general topic of problems with Cobalts, though not specific to this post (I cannot find out how to start a new thread is the honest truth!). 

 

A friend of mine came over recently and brought a booklet of instructions for Cobalts, which contained the advice to the effect of needing to "plan your installation to allow for lubricating the mechanism every five years". I have looked at the online version of the instructions, which makes no mention of such a thing being necessary.  Furthermore, I find a post from Richard Johnson on another forum identifying the need to dismantle the motor to spray lubricant onto the mechanism. 

 

These raised all sorts of questions in my mind. How can they make bold claims for their motors lasting for 75 years' worth of operation; what happens to the "lifetime warranty" if you have dismantled and reassembled the motor?, and in any event, how does one dismantle and where does one lubricate. 

 

Following this discovery I began to look more kindly on my Fulgurex motors which are easy to get to to apply lubrication, and completely obvious where the lubrication should go.

 

This is quite serious isn't it? The weasel words about needing to lubricate every five years have not made their way into the persistent advertising of the motors' longevity....

 

Hmmm!   Any one else got any thoughts?

 

 

Chris

 

Alton,

Hants.

[Danemouth]

Never heard of having to lubricate them Chris. The 11 motors on Danemouth were all bought in 2010, they still work perfectly.

 

That's probably the Kiss of Death for at least one of them :yes:

 

Cheers,

 

Dave

[Richard Johnson]

***

 

On the subject of lubrication.

 

We simply choose to mention what seems to us to be common sense. Lubrication is less effective as it ages, that is all. 

 

Every loco you own needs it, your car needs it and so does your dremel, your electric shaver or your garden shears for that matter. Of course the same applies to almost anything else you own that moves parts internally against each other.

 

Perhaps a biig difference is that most things you buy get thrown away instead because thats what you expect to have to do - including high cost items like printers and other electromechanical things.

 

Of course, hobby items should never fail.... Or is it OK for locos and other electro-mechanical things in the hobby to need servicing over time or after long storage and use, but just not point motors?

 

----------------------

 

Lubricate or not, it does not matter to us. As long as you are the original puurchaser, the lifetime warranty is good.

 

They will not die because of it, even if you ignore a simple common sense recommendation. We also do not differentiate by usage levels... because we seriously doubt whether any user will actually live long enough wear them out from use.

 

To be quite clear, we simply think that librication every x years is just common sense.

 

-------------------------------------------------

 

The materials chosen do not actually need added lubrication to survive, but over time, no matter what we use as a lubricant at manufacture, the volatiles will evaporate, so whats there will be less effective. With any mechanical interface, lubrication has an impact in one way or another for a smooth or quiet life, so we simply suggest it as a sensible thing to do.

 

In the same sense, leaving things unused for long periods always has an impact that needs a little effort to fix... Locos stored for years will rarely work without a service (some will freeze solid in fact), track will definitely need a clean, etc - if in fact it hasn't shrunk or perhaps become brittle while in storage..... and it applies outside the hobby world too. A car left for years without service will become a basket case.

 

Cobalt is way less affected than that, but lets be fair here... Why should point motors be any different?

 

BTW - As a tip with ANY electrical product, but in this case turnout motors. Switches are a good example of things that may appear to fail with long hibernation. Tracks are hard gold plated and contacts are gold plated too, but the PCB that the contacts run on is wave soldered so there is a thin film on it that can oxidise. Expect to cycle the switches a few times to restore 100% reliability if not used for a long time.

 

Kind regards

 

Richard Johnson

[Mallard60022]

Richard. It should be easy enough to remove underboard Cobalts until you get as immoblle as myself. Could it be a plan for the future that an accessible lubrication point (excuse pun) be introduced to your very capable machines?

Just a thought.

Sincerely

Phil R

[WIMorrison]

Richard. It should be easy enough to remove underboard Cobalts until you get as immoblle as myself. Could it be a plan for the future that an accessible lubrication point (excuse pun) be introduced to your very capable machines?

Just a thought.

Sincerely

Phil R

I agree about a lubrication point, even for those who are still nimble enough as it isn’t easy to remove and replace a motor with the adhesive pads sticking so well to baseboard plus, getting the very much shorter operating rod lined up again is difficult after you have trimmed it to fit.

Edited July 26, 2018 by WIMorrison

[ChrisG]

Richard, thank you for your informative reply which answers a lot of my questions. If periodic lubrication is recommended, presumably you have a set of instructions which you can share with us?

 

Chris Gardner

Alton

Hants

Edited July 25, 2018 by ChrisG

[Mallard60022]

Richard, thank you for your informative reply which answers a lot of my questions. If periodic lubrication is recommended, presumably you have a set of instructions which you can share with us?

 

Chris Gardner

Alton

Hants

Might be on the Web Site Chris, but I can't remember just this minute.

Phil

[ChrisG]

Might be on the Web Site Chris, but I can't remember just this minute.

Phil

 

It isn't anywhere obvious. Furthermore when I compared the manual which is on the website with the one which is currently supplied with the motors, they are different. The section entitled "Service Requirements" is on the printed one but NOT the online one. And just now having unscrewed one of my motors, it showed no sign of wanting to be dismantled and the wiring unit straddles the two halves which look like they could be prised apart, so right now I'm worried about prizing them open because I can't be sure of what effect this might have on the internal wiring. So at the moment the only instructions appear to be in the printed manual and read "please plan to open up each Cobalt IP Digital [the section is however headed "Cobalt Analog turnout motor", but I presume is the same for both] every 5 years in order to apply a light coat of good quality oil to the bearings, gears and motor. This maintenance is easy to do and will keep you Cobalt IP Digital running forever!". The screws come out easily enough but the next stage is not clear at all....

 

 

Chris

[Bucoops]

Can I just confirm - any Digital IP motors aren't the original version of which some had issues? Thanks

[newbryford]

Can I just confirm - any Digital IP motors aren't the original version of which some had issues? Thanks

 

Correct.

The Digital IP range has quite different internals to the original Digital motors.

[Bucoops]

Correct.

The Digital IP range has quite different internals to the original Digital motors.

 

Great thank you I've been given some (so I'm aware the lifetime warranty doesn't transfer) so wanted to be sure before thinking about fitting them in hard to reach places

[newbryford]

It isn't anywhere obvious. Furthermore when I compared the manual which is on the website with the one which is currently supplied with the motors, they are different. The section entitled "Service Requirements" is on the printed one but NOT the online one. And just now having unscrewed one of my motors, it showed no sign of wanting to be dismantled and the wiring unit straddles the two halves which look like they could be prised apart, so right now I'm worried about prizing them open because I can't be sure of what effect this might have on the internal wiring. So at the moment the only instructions appear to be in the printed manual and read "please plan to open up each Cobalt IP Digital [the section is however headed "Cobalt Analog turnout motor", but I presume is the same for both] every 5 years in order to apply a light coat of good quality oil to the bearings, gears and motor. This maintenance is easy to do and will keep you Cobalt IP Digital running forever!". The screws come out easily enough but the next stage is not clear at all....

 

 

Chris

 

I've had a couple apart. It helps to run a sharp blade across the sticker by the terminals to split the case. Some of them take a gentle force to open them up.

There is no internal wiring to be afraid of - it is all contained on the circuit board with motor. There are a few gears in there, but they can only be assembled correctly in one combination, otherwise the two case halves will not mate properly. The only one to watch out for is the final short drive gear to the main arm. It has a slightly different number of teeth at one end - 8 and 9 I think. I check the orientation of it by running it against the main drive arm between my fingers.

 

Cheers,

Mick

[newbryford]

Great thank you I've been given some (so I'm aware the lifetime warranty doesn't transfer) so wanted to be sure before thinking about fitting them in hard to reach places

 

I know it's an obvious statement, but I would check them before installation, just to make sure they're OK

[St Enodoc]

Correct.

The Digital IP range has quite different internals to the original Digital motors.

As of course does the iP Analogue model. The abbreviation iP is the key.

[newbryford]

As of course does the iP Analogue model. The abbreviation iP is the key.

 

I've heard two versions...............

 

One is "intelligent power". I'll let others try and guess the alternate

Edited July 26, 2018 by newbryford

[Dungrange]

I've heard two versions...............

 

One is "intelligent power". I'll let others try and guess the alternate

 

I'll guess that has to be 'idiot proof' as I understand that's what drove the latest developments.

[St Enodoc]

I'll guess that has to be 'idiot proof' as I understand that's what drove the latest developments.

That could apply in my case.

[Bucoops]

I'll guess that has to be 'idiot proof' as I understand that's what drove the latest developments.

 

What's the phrase? Idiot Proof? Oh yeah?  - Hold my beer