Would this soldering Iron be OK for 7 mm etched loco and coach kits

[hayfield]

I need a soldering iron to build 7 mm loco and coach kits, given that I will buy a medium chisel tip to go with it will this iron be suitable please. Nothing proffessional just for the odd kit now and then

 

I do not want to spend a fortune on the other hand not wanting to buy an unbranded cheap far eastern item. My thought process is that Draper is a well know UK suppler, spare tips are available and a non digital 50w item from local shops would cost about the same

 

Thanks

[RBAGE]

I have an Antex 50W solder station which I use for 4mm scale work.

 

The same iron is fine for all but the heaviest work in 7mm. For the heavy work I have difficulty in getting the solder to flow.

 

I bought a relatively inexpensive Antex HP80 (80W) iron and now have no problems with any job. Currently on Ebay at less than £15.

 

I use the 80W iron for frames etc. and the 50W iron for almost everything else.

 

Bob

[brossard]

My soldering station is a 50W Weller.  I did struggle with a Dragon GWR water tank kit ( http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/123628-gwr-drinking-water-tank-wagon-dia-dd1/)because the brass was quite thick and there were large areas to heat up.  I got it done.  I used a stand alone Weller iron (I need a new bit for my soldering station) to build a Conoisseur brass brake van (  http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/129311-connoisseur-north-british-20-ton-brake-van/) and that worked just fine.

 

I did buy a mini torch in anticipation of building a part built Slaters 1F but haven't used it yet.

 

Next time I'm in the store, I think I'll enquire about higher power irons, something like 80W.

 

Of course you could use this:  http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/weller-professional-260-200w-soldering-gun-kit-0586368p.html#srp (I actually have one but I think a little unwieldy for kit building)

 

John

[ROSSPOP]

Hi Hayfield

 

Don`t bother with Draper

 

I can recommend Antex products.... used them for years.

 

For 7mm coaches and locos you will need HP 40w and HP 80w and occasionally a little gas blow torch

 

 

and a selection of fluxes and solders

 

 

plus a tip cleaner

 

Cheers

 

John

[brossard]

Well JF I wouldn't entirely rule it out for those jobs requiring heat akin to the core of the sun.

 

John

[hayfield]

Thanks one and all for the suggestions, most helpfull

 

I also had other uses for the temperature controlled iron for 4 mm modelling, looks like it may be worth looking into one of the larger watt stand alone irons

[Marly51]

Hi Hayfield

 

Don`t bother with Draper

 

I can recommend Antex products.... used them for years.

 

For 7mm coaches and locos you will need HP 40w and HP 80w and occasionally a little gas blow torch

 

DSC02704.JPG

 

and a selection of fluxes and solders

 

DSC02703.JPG

 

plus a tip cleaner

 

Cheers

 

John

I agree with you about Draper. Bought their soldering station and, as a beginner, found I was struggling plus the cable is so stiff it kept getting in the way. Borrowed my husband’s Antex and now using it all the time.

 

Marlyn

[Dick Turpin]

Regarding temperature controlled irons, I made myself a short extension lead though a dimmer switch, so I can turn down any iron I choose to plug into it. Simple and effective.

[brossard]

The station I have gives a digital readout of tip temp. in real time.  Not essential but can be useful.

 

John

[Ian Smeeton]

I find that these two cover all my needs.

 

 

The only hard bit is getting into tight corners.

On the other hand, my wrist strength has improved mightily.

 

Regards

 

Ian

 

 

[trustytrev]

Hello,

       I oomed and ard  for quite a while but eventually bought one of these on ebay. It has a Hakko soldering iron with silicone heatproof cable and also a heater blower.I also bought some Hakko tips on ebay and a brass wool tip cleaner. It all comes from China nowadays anyway.

It is one of the best buys I made and can tackle just about anything.

 

 

 

 

 

[Quarryscapes]

My 16mm NG Hunslet was built with a 75W temperature controlled iron, it was mostly sheets of 0.5mm brass, sometimes doubled up to 1mm. It was a very slow process because the Iron was not powerful enough. I'd contend that a 7mm kit would be a similar prospect.

 

I'm looking at getting one of these for next time https://www.motorsport-tools.com/beta-tools-1827-k-gas-soldering-iron-7-accessor.html beacuse I get a discount and Beta stuff is generally top drawer stuff (not necessarily the best, but certainly excellent).

[doilum]

Resistance soldering unit.

Enough said.

[Izzy]

Hi Hayfield,

 

Like others I have also found you need a decent sized iron with plenty of heat reserve for most general 7mm work. Even 'thin' etched kits in 7mm turn out to be pretty good heat sinks with anything much under 50watts and a decent sized tip, and I believe that it is the tip size combined with the heat that is important. I would suggest you take a look at the Weller 75watt irons, mine is now 25+years old and still good. It's not small, takes a while to get up to heat, but has 10mm dia tips - I have a straight wedge and an angled one - which allow enough heat to produce flowing joints. With 7mm I think once you get past this size for basic body assembly you have to think along the lines of screwing/gluing bits and bobs on - or sub-assemblies etc. Well, that's what I have usually done. The most a smaller iron is good for (25-40watt), is making up the smaller parts like pipework and so forth.

 

Good luck with your choice!

 

Izzy

[ian@stenochs]

I find that these two cover all my needs.

 

2017_0607Workshop0001.JPG

 

The only hard bit is getting into tight corners.

On the other hand, my wrist strength has improved mightily.

 

Regards

 

Ian

I built my first loco kit, Jamieson 0-4-4t, using an iron just like those. I worked in the kitchen and the iron was heated in the Rayburn stove. Nowadays I have an ersa soldering station.

 

The mistake most soldering beginners make is not having a big enough heat. For successful soldering the iron has to heat the joint to soldering temperature quickly so for 7mm brass kits go for something rated 40 watts or more.

 

Ian

Edited February 21, 2018 by ian@stenochs

[hayfield]

I built my first loco kit, Jamieson 0-4-4t, using an iron just like those. I worked in the kitchen and the iron was heated in the Rayburn stove. Nowadays I have an ersa soldering station.

 

The mistake most soldering beginners make is not having a big enough heat. For successful soldering the iron has to heat the joint to soldering temperature quickly so for 7mm brass kits go for something rated 40 watts or more.

 

Ian

 

I do a lot of soldering in 4mm scale, both in brass and whitemetal, and use an Antex 25w iron. I have built 7 mm whitemetal narrow gauge kits plus finishing off a Roxey Beattie well tank all with said Antex (with a large tipped bit

 

I am now going to rebuild a badly built Slaters Flatiron, and need to both beef up my wattage but have other uses for a temperature controlled iron mostly for far smaller jobs

 

I have followed up the Antex 80 watt irons and to my surprise see they are half the price of the 25 watt irons ? The quandary is the Draper (or similar) will do what I require for other jobs, do I then settle for two separate items by buying an 80 watt for the etched kit  or go for something a bit bigger in the temperature controlled type

 

The fact is that at the moment I have this Slaters kit to rebuild, as for a coach I am torn between an etched Roxey bogie coach or a plastic Slaters Maunsell Bogie coach

 

So very undecided

[ianLMS]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but I am a beginner in the loco kit world and have tried to solder a few items of brass using my 40w Antex iron (maily 4mm loco steps etc). I am experienced at soldering PCB's, wiring etc, just not brass to brass or whitemetal.  I used Carr's and Gaugemaster Brass Flux, and normal 60/40 solder but struggle with getting good joints. I clean the brass with a firbreglass pencil before working on it. 

 

I intend to progress onto white metal kits/brass kits and am wondering what type of iron/soldering station/solder/flux I should be looking out for. I dont have a big budget (around £50-60). or do I just need to practice more?

 

 

Thank you

Ian

[hayfield]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but I am a beginner in the loco kit world and have tried to solder a few items of brass using my 40w Antex iron (maily 4mm loco steps etc). I am experienced at soldering PCB's, wiring etc, just not brass to brass or whitemetal.  I used Carr's and Gaugemaster Brass Flux, and normal 60/40 solder but struggle with getting good joints. I clean the brass with a firbreglass pencil before working on it. 

 

I intend to progress onto white metal kits/brass kits and am wondering what type of iron/soldering station/solder/flux I should be looking out for. I dont have a big budget (around £50-60). or do I just need to practice more?

 

 

Thank you

Ian

 

Ian

 

Everyone has their own favorite method, I use Carrs flux, others will be as good but for brass, nicklesilver and whitemetal I use Carrs red flux, for steel I use Carrs green

 

Whitemetal I use 70  degree solder, the rest normal solder with lead in it as I feel it flows better.

 

The iron should be fine, might be a bit much for whitemetal. Make sure all is clean including the tip  and use plenty of flux

[brossard]

More practice probably Ian.  I've been using DCC Concepts Sapphire 145 solder and a non acid flux (specifically Tix, but I have a jar of Gaugemaster flux on my shelf).  Your iron should be adequate but maybe the tip is worn (especially if you've been using acid flux).  It should be a silvery colour when you wipe it before starting your work.  If its black or oxidized, its no good.  Sometimes you need more strength so if you have an electronics supply store nearby, look for a roll of 60/40 non cored solder.  This is equivalent to 188 solder.

 

A soldering station is a nice to have but they are pricey.  A good stand alone iron will do the job.

 

Soldering WM to brass is straightforward.  Tin the brass with 145 solder first.  Then using 70 WM solder and flux simply solder the piece (which you will have cleaned first). Don't hang about though.  The joint should take immediately.  If it doesn't, remove the iron from the work, clean up and try again.  This is something I would recommend practicing with scrap.  I use my regular iron but at first I was very tentative.  With practice your confidence will grow and you will be able to gauge what you can get away with.

 

John

Edited March 21, 2018 by brossard

[ROSSPOP]

hi Ian

 

For 4mm soldering your 40w Antex should be fine... but make sure the tip has been regularly tinned /cleaned to maintain good heat.

 

 

Try putting the 60/40 solder to one side and get some Carrs 188 sheet metal solder ( I gave up on these 60/40 solders years ago...could`nt always get a good flow.

 

 

Use Carrs Green flux.

 

 

Pack in the use of your fibre brush for pre-solder cleaning... go to Morrison`s and get some Viakal and use before and after soldering.

 

 

Not enough heat..... poor pre-cleaning.... weak flux.... and suspect solder... will result in this.......

 

 

 

Keep it all clean and simple, use the right stuff and you will easily get this......

 

 

 

Cheers 

 

John

[brossard]

Can't compete with John T but I have built a few etched kits in 4mm and 7mm.  I would add that you do need to spend some time after making the joint, cleaning it up.  I use scrapers, files and yes, a fiber brush.  I remelt stubborn blobs to spread the solder before scraping and filing that down.  I've seen too many examples of work where this was not done - not nice.

 

John

[ianLMS]

Thank you John - I am off to the York show at Easter and will pick up the various grades of solder (145, 70WM etc), . My tip is nice and shiny and I have spares of those as well. I clean it everytime I use it and its lasting well.

[ianLMS]

hi Ian

 

For 4mm soldering your 40w Antex should be fine... but make sure the tip has been regularly tinned /cleaned to maintain good heat.

 

 

Try putting the 60/40 solder to one side and get some Carrs 188 sheet metal solder ( I gave up on these 60/40 solders years ago...could`nt always get a good flow.

 

 

Use Carrs Green flux.

 

 

Not enough heat..... poor pre-cleaning.... weak flux.... and suspect solder... will result in this.......

 

s-l1600 (12).jpg

 

 

 

 

Cheers 

 

John

That pic me chuckle and if I manage to produce anything that ended up like that, I will take up golf instead! The second pick is a work of art!!!

Edited March 21, 2018 by ianLMS

[JeffP]

Was that first photo one of Emmett's creations?

[doilum]

Since no one else has mentioned it.

Have you considered an RSU. You still need a cheap iron to tin your work, but with a little practice cleaning up is a thing of the past. Not cheap at 200 quid, but divide that by the next twenty years......