John_Hughes Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 I've sent a few items off to Shapeways for printing in different materials and generally been quite satisfied by the results. However, the reproduction of rivet detail in 4mm scale seems to be very hit-and-miss - I imagine it would come out fine in a larger scale. It's not particularly a problem because I can reinstate the rivets with decals, but it is a tad annoying to have spent time putting the rivets on the master only to find that they don't come out reliably. Is there any particular material that would be better than others at getting the detail to show? Or is there some other trick I need to know? Thanks in advance for your help! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGR Hooper! Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 I've sent a few items off to Shapeways for printing in different materials and generally been quite satisfied by the results. However, the reproduction of rivet detail in 4mm scale seems to be very hit-and-miss - I imagine it would come out fine in a larger scale. It's not particularly a problem because I can reinstate the rivets with decals, but it is a tad annoying to have spent time putting the rivets on the master only to find that they don't come out reliably. Is there any particular material that would be better than others at getting the detail to show? Or is there some other trick I need to know? Thanks in advance for your help! Rivets come out well in B-HDA. Beyond that I think only FUD/FXD is fine. Wouldn't recommend adding rivets for the other materials. Since all 3D prints do require some post-printing sanding my best advice would be to stick to decal rivets. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rue_d_etropal Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 (edited) How many rivets can you actually see on the real prototype, at same relative distance to that you view models normally? I have found that even with WSF, the impression of a rivet still seems to be there, and paint picks it up, Making the rivets slightly bigger(oh dear, then they are not to scale!) helps. Some people tyr to make their rivets with a rounded head, I find a flat top is fine, especially as the 3D printing will round them off slightly. Alo makin them slight longer than scale helps. 3D printing was decibed to me as an aid to scratchbuilding(not a fully fledged model building service), and treating it as such results in happier modelling. It does the hard part, so you can do the fun part finishing off, and then you feel you have actually created something, not just assembled it. Edited February 22, 2018 by rue_d_etropal 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sem34090 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 My G6 has no rivets, because many people will want to sand it down anyway! It's now uploaded; not for sale yet as I need to fix the cab rear wall: https://www.shapeways.com/product/ZAD9PVNAC/lswr-adams-g6-4mm-original-condition?optionId=64872831&li=user-profile Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold chris p bacon Posted February 22, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 22, 2018 3D printing was decibed to me as an aid to scratchbuilding(not a fully fledged model building service), and treating it as such results in happier modelling. It does the hard part, so you can do the fun part finishing off, and then you feel you have actually created something, not just assembled it. If done in the right material it's near enough a finished item, FUD/FXD is the preferred as it will retain rivet detail (which does show). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quarryscapes Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Rivets in FUD/FXD will cause stripes below them. Rivets are a pain in the behind if the model needs any sanding. BHDA would offer the best riveted finish, but is hit and miss on how much sanding it will require, and you can easily end up with supports between rivets that are impossible to remove! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hughes Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 Thanks to all for your help - my most recent attempt was in FUD, and it came out very well except for the rivets. I'm guessing that making the same part in 7mm wouldn't have the same issues, but anyway I can do the necessary with decals. Thanks again! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Rixon Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 In 4mm scale, printing in FUD, I find that fasteners almost always come out OK, except that one really can't tell a hex nut from a square nut from a rivet in the print. Surface detail in FUD is more reliable on surfaces facing up in the print than on vertical surfaces, and this seems to be some kind of bug in the rasterisation of the models. If the model can be broken down into large parts with their cosmetic surfaces facing up then it should print more cleanly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 If the model can be broken down into large parts with their cosmetic surfaces facing up then it should print more cleanly. It's because the resolution in the Z is higher than in the X & Y Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Rixon Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 It's because the resolution in the Z is higher than in the X & Y True, and important, but Shapeways have some other problems to overcome. They have issues with vertical surfaces when when the details are way above the limit of resolution. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hughes Posted February 24, 2018 Author Share Posted February 24, 2018 Thanks for the additional help. So far I've only been sending fairly small components rather than a larger unit, so there's nothing to break down into smaller bits. However, I hadn't thought about the orientation of the part in the printer at all. Perhaps I should try someone else instead of Shapeways; any ideas? Thanks again! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 These problems are inherent in the 3D Systems machine that Shapeways use. One alternative is to use the StrataSys machines ie, Shapeways acrylic plastics, but these aren't as smooth as FUD. Another is to redesign the models into component parts so that the rivets are always on the upper surfaces. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rue_d_etropal Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 I wonder if this also explains an oddity I have had for several years. Sometimes detail on one side of a print is thinner, sometimes missing. This is with WSF, but thinking it might be when design is at edge of machine, possibly SW are trying to use too much of the space, and some should be left free, or filled with something that does not matter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted February 25, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 25, 2018 (edited) ... Another is to redesign the models into component parts so that the rivets are always on the upper surfaces. I agree with you Bill, Mike Trice has just done this with his 6 wheelers, keeping the detail sides uppermost for best quality. The rivets/bolts look pretty good. https://www.shapeways.com/product/XM3CMGDVW/gnr-dia-303-full-brake-6-wheel-carriage-basic-ki?optionId=64889823 Edited February 25, 2018 by JCL Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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