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RAILS ANNOUNCE CALEY 812 CLASS 0-6-0s


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Had a trip behind 828 in September 2019 from Aviemore to Broomhill and return. These look to be stunning models and really one is spoiled for choice. A deposit is about to be winging its way to Rails emporium for 828 as I remember her on a sunny day in carefree times. 

 

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28 minutes ago, truffy said:

So she's a different shade of blue in preservation compared to when first in service?

 

Makes me wonder what the preservation is trying to replicate. 

Posted way back when it was announced,
original & 1915 repaint! ;) So both are genuine. 

 

On 23/02/2018 at 12:27, JonathonAG said:

Not quite. The Blue No. 828 currently wears is of the same specification that she was first outshopped in.

 

The lighter shade of blue, as will be seen on No. 419 later this year, was introduced around 1915 if I recall correctly.

 

Edited by PaulRhB
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48 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

Posted way back when it was announced,
original & 1915 repaint! ;) So both are genuine. 

So, if I have this correct, the 'as built' version is after the 1915 repaint, while the preserved version is the same colour as originally in service.

Therefore, given the engineering changes between 'as built' and later versions, there's no version that has the colour/build of 812 when first in service, any time prior to 1915?

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Just now, truffy said:

So, if I have this correct, the 'as built' version is after the 1915 repaint, while the preserved version is the same colour as originally in service.

Therefore, given the engineering changes between 'as built' and later versions, there's no version that has the colour/build of 812 when first in service, any time prior to 1915?

No but it doesn’t claim to be, it’s as built in the revised livery. No doubt original livery, as built, might be in a second batch once they’ve hooked a few to buy the preserved version and then owning the original original tempts them to buy a third! It’s pretty common releasing other desirable liveries in later batches with all manufacturers to keep the excitement going. 

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49 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

No but it doesn’t claim to be, it’s as built in the revised livery. 

I clearly misunderstood 'as built' to mean 'as first in service'.  :(

 

Oh well, I've just saved myself 200 Great British drinking tokens.

 

I doubt that there'll be a second run, but if there is one to include first in service, I'm in.

Edited by truffy
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14 minutes ago, truffy said:

misunderstood 'as built' to mean 'as first in service'.  :(

It’s one of those descriptive bits of blather that can be taken either way rather than on what they meant, a ‘Morecambeisim’, all the right bits but not necessarily in the right order! ;) 

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I was also a bit confused on the livery.  I hope they do a pre 1915 example at some point.  Can't imagine them not doing that really.

Looks fantastic, tempted to get a later example too if funds allow.

Edited by GWR8700
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They look really good as Bachmann pre grouping Locomotives always do.  Just wondered about the firebox on the as built example.  Presumably on the final model the blue will stretch down to the frames as it does on the preserved example?

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Please bear in mind these are decoration samples for the commissioner and manufacturer to inspect and identify any issues.

 

Quote

the formal advice we had from the Trust (and the late lamented and published Jim MacIntosh in particular, who was the renowned authority on the class and liveries - which, as usual, is a very complex subject!

 

 

Quote

one of your correspondents is claiming that the lighter livery represents 1915 onwards and this seems to be perpetuated in subsequent comments. This is incorrect. The lighter shade was standard by 1904/1906 at which time the locomotive specification and detail was still  “as built". The preserved loco was restored into the livery it carried from1899 up to then. Thus we chose to give customers the choice of 2 totally accurate Caledonian liveries.

 

 

Quote

This was the advice from the Chairman of the Trust

I know you intend issuing a model of the loco as preserved. As the loco is preserved in the dark blue BS105 Oxford blue I presume you intend that that model should be in that darker shade.

 

It's somewhat dispiriting for those involved to read misunderstandings/criticism rather than them being able to respond if it was posed as a question.

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1 hour ago, AY Mod said:

It's somewhat dispiriting for those involved to read misunderstandings/criticism rather than them being able to respond if it was posed as a question.

 

23 hours ago, truffy said:

So she's a different shade of blue in preservation compared to when first in service?

 

22 hours ago, truffy said:

So, if I have this correct, the 'as built' version is after the 1915 repaint, while the preserved version is the same colour as originally in service.

Therefore, given the engineering changes between 'as built' and later versions, there's no version that has the colour/build of 812 when first in service, any time prior to 1915?

 

I did use question marks. :angel:

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Damn. Was really hoping to avoid spending money on these.

 

With a ‘Lyn’, ‘W1’ and a bunch of Genesis coaches in my near future, I may have to give this one a pass for the time being. But you never know - Christmas is coming up

Edited by Edge
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Yep looking good .  I’m down for the later blue as preserved example .  The LMS one looks tempting too but just a bit expensive at the moment, so one will suffice . 

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Forgive me for nitpicking eeeever so slightly (OI! Put down that axe) but the Westinghouse on the Calley versions look ever so slightly chunkier than the LMS version, could be the light, could be how its meant to be. Don't shoot the messenger, unless he's trying to shoot you, in what case its acceptable.  

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I can't stop looking at the decorated samples, what a beauty!

 

I had been down for the preserved version but I now I've seen these samples I prefer the 'as built version' it, it's just stunning. Rails kindly agreed to let me switch to that version, looking forward to it.

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18 minutes ago, drt7uk said:

I can't stop looking at the decorated samples, what a beauty!

 

I had been down for the preserved version but I now I've seen these samples I prefer the 'as built version' it, it's just stunning. Rails kindly agreed to let me switch to that version, looking forward to it.


it’s a pity they are both numbered 828 , otherwise there may have been a few buying both . I’d be tempted but I’ve never spent that amount of money all at once on my hobby before 

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19 hours ago, AY Mod said:

It's somewhat dispiriting for those involved to read misunderstandings/criticism rather than them being able to respond if it was posed as a question.

Andy, it’s somewhat disingenuous for anyone to imply that they can only respond to questions, as appears to be the argument being made here. There is nothing to stop anyone with better information stepping in to clarify or correct inaccurate statements made as fact. Quite the opposite, they would be welcome. 

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24 minutes ago, truffy said:

it’s somewhat disingenuous for anyone to imply that they can only respond to questions

 

It was my take that it would have been better phrased as a question (which could be responded to) for clarification whether that be Rails or others.

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21 hours ago, MonsalDan said:

They look really good as Bachmann pre grouping Locomotives always do.  Just wondered about the firebox on the as built example.  Presumably on the final model the blue will stretch down to the frames as it does on the preserved example?

 

According to this colorised postcard (which is far from being definitive proof, I grant you), it would seem the base of the firebox was in fact black in the CR days. Going by what we've seen in this thread, it sounds like Rails have been talking to the right people in terms of getting this model right so I'd be inclined to trust them on this, but I must say I find it does look better with the blue going all the way down.

 

Think I might just have to place a pre-order for the "as-built but in 1915" version...

 

Edit: Well, that's me 200 quid lighter.

 

Alan

 

812.jpg.2dafa7626d94906ad4c71c461b1fe85d.jpg

 

 

 

Edited by jivebunny
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I predict this will do for the Caley what the 'C' class did for the SE&CR . Who could not be impressed with that beautiful blue (whatever version) livery . I can see 0-4-4T appearing after this . And who knows may yet get a 4-4-0.  Getting excited 

Edited by Legend
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On 17/10/2020 at 15:27, truffy said:

So she's a different shade of blue in preservation compared to when first in service?

 

Makes me wonder what the preservation is trying to replicate. 

It was a question but followed by a rhetorical question / statement about preservation that kinda masked the first question, ;) ,that’s why I pointed back to the original posts because it clarified both were early liveries, ok the dates are ten years out to Rails info but both were valid for the loco in as built condition.
This is one of the issues with the era systems as we are led into thinking they are rigid when they can cover multiple variations of livery and mechanical that aren’t helped by various sources making minor errors on dating ;)

For most of us the attractive livery will be the decider, how many are actually modelling a precise period between 1890-1914 Caledonian where the livery change date actually matters? :) 

 

Edited by PaulRhB
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19 minutes ago, Legend said:

Who could not be impressed with that beautiful blue (whatever version) livery .

Well, since you asked, I, for one. The darker livery is definitely gorgeous. But, and I realise that this is a matter of personal taste, the lighter one is a disappointment. It's what 828 wore for the majority of its time on the CR (1904/1906-1923, as opposed to 1899-1904/1906), so there's that at least.

 

1 minute ago, PaulRhB said:

how many are actually modelling a precise period between 1890-1914 Caledonian where the livery change date actually matters? :) 

Oh, I agree with that entirely! From my own perspective, I have no interest in preservation models, but more in as-built. Just in this case, I was expecting the darker blue. It makes sense for Rails to provide the version with greater time in use for those that really do model the CR, it's just not for me.

Edited by truffy
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1 hour ago, Legend said:

I predict this will do for the Caley what the 'C' class did for the SE&CR . Who could not be impressed with that beautiful blue (whatever version) livery . I can see 0-4-4T appearing after this . And who knows may yet get a 4-4-0.  Getting excited 

 

If a Caley 439 was announced (and 419 specifically) then that would make a lot of people happy. Including me!

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