GWR to operate Hex

[black and decker boy]

News announced that the operation of Heathrow Express is to transfer to GWR later this year.

 

http://www.firstgroupplc.com/news-and-media/latest-news/2018/28-03-18a.aspx

 

 

 

Comment elsewhere is that the class 332s will retire and be replaced by a batch of the GWR 387s fitted with ETCS. Also commented that GWR will be taking a fleet of class 769 bi-modes for Thames valley branches (to release turbos to the West).

[bgman]

News announced that the operation of Heathrow Express is to transfer to GWR later this year.

 

http://www.firstgroupplc.com/news-and-media/latest-news/2018/28-03-18a.aspx

 

 

 

Comment elsewhere is that the class 332s will retire and be replaced by a batch of the GWR 387s fitted with ETCS. Also commented that GWR will be taking a fleet of class 769 bi-modes for Thames valley branches (to release turbos to the West).

 

Oh! I certainly hope so !!!

[009 micro modeller]

Presumably this is because GWR will now have an EMU fleet whereas before it was all diesel with electrification only for Heathrow Express. I understand as well that the electrification for this was not connected to the rest of the electrified network but presumably it soon will be.

[royaloak]

 

Oh! I certainly hope so !!!

Dont get too excited, the Turbos are Bristol bound to release the last of the 150/2s and some 158s to Exeter, the good news is they have been carrying timing and platform clearance trials with a SWR 159 the last couple of nights to see how much they need to slow the service down if they put the 158s on the Barneys

[royaloak]

Presumably this is because GWR will now have an EMU fleet whereas before it was all diesel with electrification only for Heathrow Express. I understand as well that the electrification for this was not connected to the rest of the electrified network but presumably it soon will be.

They got enough 387s to run to Oxford but after the farce that was the cancellation of the electrification they have now got too many so some of the existing fleet will be converted to use on the HEX.

 

What do you mean by the highlighted bit?

Edited March 28, 2018 by royaloak

[bgman]

They got enough 387s to run to Oxford but after the farce that was the cancellation of the electrification they have now got too many so some of the existing fleet will be converted to use on the HEX.

 

What do you mean by the highlighted bit?

 

Just fancy a change me old mate !

[Zomboid]

The incline from Acton to the WLL (or is it the NLL? Doesn't change anything) is not wired. As there's nowhere else (other than Reading for the DC) that the GWML meets an electrified route it is not possible to run a pure electric train under its own power from the GWML to anywhere else other than via the Crossrail tunnels.

[royaloak]

Just fancy a change me old mate !

Should be 158s reasonably soon, December this year keeps getting bandied about.

[81C]

 ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz   

[ba14eagle]

There is still chat about 387' being used on stopping services to Swindon

[royaloak]

 ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz 

Thank you for such a valuable contribution! 

[009 micro modeller]

The incline from Acton to the WLL (or is it the NLL? Doesn't change anything) is not wired. As there's nowhere else (other than Reading for the DC) that the GWML meets an electrified route it is not possible to run a pure electric train under its own power from the GWML to anywhere else other than via the Crossrail tunnels.

Sorry, that's what I meant - there is/was no electrified connection to other parts of the electrified network from the Heathrow Express electrification. Is this staying the same after the GW electrification is done?

[The Stationmaster]

Seems a logical way of using the surplus 387s although I do wonder in some respects about these so called 769 things as they won't be any use for Greenford (4 cars won't fit the platform at Greenford) or Marlow (4 cars can't reverse at Bourne End - not even a 387 would fit there hence the Marlow branch never figuring on the electrification list) and older trains definitely won't go down with Henley branch commuter groups (who have already 'warned' GWR on that score).  BUT they would make tremendous sense for the Reading - Gatwicks which seems to be a very logical working for them particularly if they will still be able to work on both types of electrification.  Again (Paddington/Reading) Didcot - Oxford - beyond, and Reading - Newbury - Bedwyn seem logical deployments and 4 car trains would be a major benefit on the increasingly busy Reading - Basingstoke line especially with new development and station south of Reading.

 

So what seems likely is a smaller 16X fleet at Reading than has been the case thus far thereby releasing more, over time, to head west.   Presumably 387 maintenance will be based at Reading (with some outstabling at West Ealing?) thereby allowing closure of the HEX depot at Old Oak.  All we need now is the entire GWR 387 fleet to be uprated to the Heathrow Express standard.

 

And quite where the line capacity for extra Crossrail trains between Paddington and Heathrow is going to come from I seriously wonder - sounds like someone with a Hornby set thinks he knows about line capacity matters on the grown-ups railway ( or maybe they're only going to call intermediately at ealing Broadway and Hayes?

 

There is still chat about 387' being used on stopping services to Swindon

 

 

But stopping where, Grove/Wantage Parkway?  All they will do running between Didcot and Swindon is duplicate existing services albeit adding to capacity in the process.  I do however think they would make quite good trains to use over longer distances but they would need various interior upgrades to really fit them for such operation.

[Christopher125]

Comment elsewhere is that the class 332s will retire and be replaced by a batch of the GWR 387s fitted with ETCS. Also commented that GWR will be taking a fleet of class 769 bi-modes for Thames valley branches (to release turbos to the West).

 

19 769s apparently - they'll take over from most of the Turbos in the Thames Valley, including North Downs services to Gatwick which should prove a good test of their 'tri-mode' ability using the 3rd rail. 

Edited March 28, 2018 by Christopher125

[black and decker boy]

Of course what isn’t mentioned is that the 769 programme is seriously delayed with a trial unit still not seen outside of the Brush Workshops and moving under its own power.

 

The Norrhern sets should have entered service in a little over 4 weeks time.

 

You’d have to hope GWR have done due diligence before agreeing the order

[Zomboid]

older trains definitely won't go down with Henley branch commuter groups (who have already 'warned' GWR on that score). [/i]

Even if they were refurbished to a higher internal standard than the turbos? Not saying it will happen, but there's no practical reason why they couldn't be an improvement, regardless of the age of the bodyshell.

 

Greenford should really be switched to TfL and use their diesel units which will become available when GOB goes electric. It makes much more sense on the tube/ overground network map than the GWR one, particularly post Crossrail when no other GWR trains will call at West Ealing.

[royaloak]

Sorry, that's what I meant - there is/was no electrified connection to other parts of the electrified network from the Heathrow Express electrification. Is this staying the same after the GW electrification is done?

thanks for clarifying, I read it that the HEX electrification wasnt connected to the GWR electrification. 

[Zomboid]

Who knows what might get built one day, but no sign of anything on that slope right now...

[black and decker boy]

Even if they were refurbished to a higher internal standard than the turbos? Not saying it will happen, but there's no practical reason why they couldn't be an improvement, regardless of the age of the bodyshell.

 

Greenford should really be switched to TfL and use their diesel units which will become available when GOB goes electric. It makes much more sense on the tube/ overground network map than the GWR one, particularly post Crossrail when no other GWR trains will call at West Ealing.

Ex GOBlin 172s already snapped up by West Midlands. Greenford would also sit well with Chiltern if you do a Wycombe or Gerard’s X to Padd servicecwith better frequency Edited March 28, 2018 by black and decker boy

[St. Simon]

News announced that the operation of Heathrow Express is to transfer to GWR later this year.

 

http://www.firstgroupplc.com/news-and-media/latest-news/2018/28-03-18a.aspx

 

 

 

Comment elsewhere is that the class 332s will retire and be replaced by a batch of the GWR 387s fitted with ETCS. Also commented that GWR will be taking a fleet of class 769 bi-modes for Thames valley branches (to release turbos to the West).

I'll be very surprised if the decision isn't taken to fit ETCS to the whole 387 fleet, as if it isn't they may have problems when trying to substitute stock if an ETCS unit fails. Also, ETCS based ASDO (the system I design) is to be standardised across Western, with the exception of the Turbos, I believe.

 

I'll have to go back to my APCO design at Didcot to make it suitable for Class 769's if that rumour is true.

 

There is still chat about 387' being used on stopping services to Swindon

GWR will NOT be running passenger services to Swindon using 387's, only ECS moves twice a day between Didcot Parkway and a new stabling point at Cocklebury Sidings.

 

Simon

Edited March 29, 2018 by St. Simon

[St. Simon]

if you do a Wycombe or Gerard’s X to Padd servicecwith better frequency

Not to Paddington, although a half hourly service to Old Oak Common I believe is on the cards in the future.

 

Simon

[Oakydoke]

Is this a clever move by Heathrow Airport Ltd. ?

HAL had a licence to run HEX until 2023 and had indicated that they wished to continue running the service beyond that date.

However, with the prospect of Crossrail taking a big chunk of their HEX passenger traffic and a desire in some quarters (e.g. NR) to reallocate the HEX mainline paths to allow much needed, additional long distance services, the odds were looking increasingly stacked against them being able to continue beyond 2023.

Add to that the expense of building and relocating maintenance to the proposed new Langley depot.

 

By getting GWR onboard, HAL are no longer on their own against NR and the incumbent TOC (currently GWR), with regards to retaining the service and the valuable main line paths.

There is also no need to build the new Langley depot, which must be saving quite a bit of money too.

In addition, HEX is guaranteed another 5 years operation beyond 2023.

 

Some clever footwork has gone on here, methinks.

Edited March 29, 2018 by Oakydoke

[St. Simon]

Hi,

 

Just had a look at the press release, and it states that a new dedicated fleet is to be used, I would imagine that'll be Aventra's rather than Class 387s as the Electrostars aren't being built anymore and GWR only just have enough, plus the Aventras are already fitted with ETCS.

 

Simon

[Castle]

Hi All,

 

When I read the title I thought that GWR had started to use a version of the computer from Discworld!

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hex_(Discworld)

 

Now that WOULD be an interesting way to run a rail service...

 

All the best,

 

Castle

[Oakydoke]

Hi,

 

Just had a look at the press release, and it states that a new dedicated fleet is to be used, I would imagine that'll be Aventra's rather than Class 387s as the Electrostars aren't being built anymore......

The press release isn't very clear on this and is slightly contradictory.

A dedicated new fleet....but converted......from?

 

GWR will manage the introduction of a new, dedicated fleet of trains for the Heathrow Express service, which will be specially converted by December 2019 to provide first class carriages, high speed Wi-Fi, additional luggage racks and on-board entertainment.

New trains aren't converted. They're built as required.