ckp Posted April 8, 2018 Share Posted April 8, 2018 I attempted to convert to DCC, but as it wouldn't work and buzzed, I took off the chip and resoldered the wires to the brush holders. Problem is that although the tender will run in its own, as soon as the loco driving wheels are placed on the track nothing will move. Ther continuity tester buzzes when I connect opposite driving wheels. Any ideas what I might have done? Sorry if this is not in the correct section. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted April 8, 2018 Share Posted April 8, 2018 Could one side of the motor be live to the tender chassis and its pick ups? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckp Posted April 8, 2018 Author Share Posted April 8, 2018 Could one side of the motor be live to the tender chassis and its pick ups? Are there not supposed to be pick ups on the tender which connect to the motor? There are pick ups on the front and rear tender wheels. I am unclear about the whole thing! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John ks Posted April 9, 2018 Share Posted April 9, 2018 When you did the conversion did you isolate the brush connections from the chassis Is it a ringfield motor. A class 91 I converted had a screw that holds the motor together & is the electrical connection between the brush holder to the chassis To isolate the brushes from the chassis this screw had to have an insulating sleeved & an nylon washer used under the head Does this loco have a wired connection between the loco & tender or the removable type with a pin & contact fingers If it is the latter these can get bent & cause a short Did you connect the wires in the tender the correct way around If the loco or tender are connected with incorrect polarity then when the loco & tender are on the track then you get a short A quick test for this is to put the loco & tender on the track with a sheet of paper under the loco wheels, run the loco & note the direction of travel Next place the paper under the tender wheels & run the loco with the same controller setting & note the direction of travel If the direction of travel is different then there is a wiring problem. Crossed wires in the loco or tender If none of this helps then photos can be very helpful John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCB Posted April 9, 2018 Share Posted April 9, 2018 There are several tender drive Hornby 9fs, the earliest has pickups on all 8 flanged driving wheels and 6 traction tyres and the tender drawbar is secured to both engine and tender by screws and rivets, they are very strong locos and are dead easy to convert to DCC, but run backwards if the wires are crossed. The next breed have detachable tenders, pickup one side loco one side tender, 2 traction tyres, feeble definitely not worth bothering with trying to convert to DCC, then some have double contacts on drawbar and tender pickups on traction tyre wheels. I guess you have one of these and have simply reversed the contacts to the drawbar. Sell it and get a Loco Drive one like we did The very early Tender drives are great for pulling 60 wagon trains, the loco drive ones look great on a short Passenger a la S&D and the two traction tyre ones are.useless. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckp Posted April 9, 2018 Author Share Posted April 9, 2018 When you did the conversion did you isolate the brush connections from the chassis Is it a ringfield motor. A class 91 I converted had a screw that holds the motor together & is the electrical connection between the brush holder to the chassis To isolate the brushes from the chassis this screw had to have an insulating sleeved & an nylon washer used under the head Does this loco have a wired connection between the loco & tender or the removable type with a pin & contact fingers If it is the latter these can get bent & cause a short Did you connect the wires in the tender the correct way around If the loco or tender are connected with incorrect polarity then when the loco & tender are on the track then you get a short A quick test for this is to put the loco & tender on the track with a sheet of paper under the loco wheels, run the loco & note the direction of travel Next place the paper under the tender wheels & run the loco with the same controller setting & note the direction of travel If the direction of travel is different then there is a wiring problem. Crossed wires in the loco or tender If none of this helps then photos can be very helpful John Thanks for this. I will investigate. I have attached a photo. George Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCB Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 You have either reversed the connections to the drawbar or the drawbar connections are shorting. Easier/ Quicker/ Better to scrap it and get a loco drive one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaddeus Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 You have either reversed the connections to the drawbar or the drawbar connections are shorting. Easier/ Quicker/ Better to scrap it and get a loco drive one. except the locodrive 9Fs have a problem with disintegrating tender chassis. Had another mazac rotten one to fix this week. Its only Easier/ Quicker/ Better to scrap it if you can afford to do so and the item is actually of better quality as Hornby is finding out, not everyone wants or can afford the latest product supposedly better item from China. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCB Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 except the locodrive 9Fs have a problem with disintegrating tender chassis. Had another mazac rotten one to fix this week. Its only Easier/ Quicker/ Better to scrap it if you can afford to do so and the item is actually of better quality as Hornby is finding out, not everyone wants or can afford the latest product supposedly better item from China. I forgot the disintegrating chassis, one of our Loco drive ones, maybe Evening Star had the tender drive chassis block and it crumbed to small pieces, like 4mm X 4mm absolute rubbish. Luckily an old class 47 trailing bogie frame is a direct replacement and much lighter and hopefully rot proof as it is already 20 odd years old. Bad news is the later Tender drive uses the same heavy rot prone casting. Another reason to bin the Tender drive (Unless you put a tender drive tender behind the loco drive loco of course) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckp Posted April 20, 2018 Author Share Posted April 20, 2018 I have determined that the drawbar connection was shorting. I have insulated it and things now run ok. I now have to figure out how to hard wire the decoder. Presumably all the black wires to the correct decider wire and all the red ones to the correct decoder wire, then orange and grey from the decoder to where the red or black wires originally connected to the contacts on the motor, omitting the capacitor? Thanks everyone . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John ks Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 ckp Good to see a happy ending Your description on the decoder connections sounds correct to me NMRA standards for decoder wiring to track Red to right rail Black to left rail If it goes backwards when it should go forward then swap the Orange & Grey wires John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckp Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 ckp Good to see a happy ending Your description on the decoder connections sounds correct to me NMRA standards for decoder wiring to track Red to right rail Black to left rail If it goes backwards when it should go forward then swap the Orange & Grey wires John I test wired a decoder and it runs very well. Thanks for al your help. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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