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dpgibbons

New crowdfunded project from Lococraft - LMS diesels 10000/10001

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That's good a crowd funding project that doesn't even introduce who they are !!! If I was running that I would like my prospective customers at the very least know who I am running this project, especially when you are asking people to handover £600.

 

Come on gents at least do the prospective punter a service of knowing who you are ...... not just having to ring a mobile number first.

 

Good luck with the venture anyway

 

Craig.

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Looks interesting, but why so shy?

Who are you? What have you done before?

John K

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A 'Whois' search on the website address gives:

Domain name:

lococraft.co.uk

Registrant:
Jeff Lynch

Registrant type:
Unknown

Registrant's address:
12 Old Station Road
Syston
Leicestershire
LE7 1NT
United Kingdom

 

Does that help?

 

Dave

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https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/11294907/filing-history

 

A company registeted 5th April 2018 . Share capital £100.

 

The link in the OP includes a further link to their Facebook page which just shows the same information.

 

A search of Facebook does not come up with a Lococraftuk page but again comes up with the same crowdfunding advertisement posted by someone who said they had "been asked to share it"

Edited by Colin_McLeod

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I'm sure Mr Lynch would be welcome on here and in person at model rail events in the Midlands to promote his venture. The personal touch always helps, 'people buy people'. Lots of such events coming up, every one a sales opportunity.

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I agree that the Lococraft team need to establish their credentials and to actively market themselves and their project. They also need to provide confidence that monies will be recoverable if things do not go as planned. Credit cards provide some comfort in that regard so it would be a good idea to add them to the payment options, with a surcharge to cover fees if necessary.

Edited by dpgibbons

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I agree that the Lococraft team need to establish their credentials and to actively market themselves and their project. They also need to provide confidence that monies will be recoverable if things do not go as planned. Credit cards provide some comfort in that regard so it would be a good idea to add them to the payment options, with a surcharge to cover fees if necessary.

 

 

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but you can't get your money back if a crowd funded project fails. The idea behind 'crowd funding' is that people put money up to see if a project can work. If it does then they get the product, if it doesn't then they get nothing.

 

Also you cannot now surcharge for the use of credit cards, it's classed as a regular payment option.

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I could think of a more popular choice of prototype

 

Paul R

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Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but you can't get your money back if a crowd funded project fails. The idea behind 'crowd funding' is that people put money up to see if a project can work. If it does then they get the product, if it doesn't then they get nothing.

 

 

 

Payment details copied from the website indicates that there will be a refund of the first instalment if the initial target isn't met and all money refunded if the project fails.  If the models are built and then you fail to make the second and third instalment then your initial investment would be lost.

 

 

Should the crowdfunding target not be met, all monies paid into the crowdfunding project will be refunded, minus the postage.

It must be understood that should payments be made to crowdfund this project, and further payments are not met, then all monies are non refundable, as failure to make the allotted payments by the due date could jeopardise the continuation of the project. This decision is final and no exceptions will be made. Should there be any unfortunate event where the manufacturer fails to supply the models, then ALL monies will be refunded forthwith.

This is NOT a credit agreement.

 

 

I agree that the Lococraft team need to establish their credentials and to actively market themselves and their project.

 

Interesting to see that Steve from Little Loco Co is one of those who has given advice . . . . .

 

Grateful thanks should go to Steve Leathers, Andy Hoseason and Simon Bendall for their invaluable support and advice.

 

 

There are also plans for the prototype Deltic.

 

.

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Not that I'm casting aspersions, but, could this have anything to do with the demise of JLTRT? The moulds exist etc.

 

Mike.

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Not that I'm casting aspersions, but, could this have anything to do with the demise of JLTRT? The moulds exist etc.

 

Mike.

 

As far as I am aware there is no link or use of prior work with any aspect of JLTRT.

 

Also, as far as I can establish, the named party has no record of previous design or production of any products. It appears that this is a new start-up, preliminary conversations have been had with a factory in China and the intention was to use design work that has already been carried out. The web page shows a CAD image which I have reasonable grounds to believe is from an earlier project rather than anything recently originated.

 

Lococraft_CAD_AY_copy_from_Lococraft_website.jpg

 

I also understand that there are discussions between the producer of the previous project and the factory over usage.

 

I believe the name party has also referred to the crowdfunding aspect with the phrase ‘if anything goes wrong, I don’t lose out’. From the T&Cs quoted above it is evident that the weight of risk is borne by any crowd-funder, aside from the share capital noted above I haven't any evidence that there is any capital investment on the part of the company owner.

 

I have just written an in-depth piece for the mag on crowdfunding and this announcement fits in with the sort of situation where I suggest the investor shows due caution (and acceptance of the potential loss if they enter into anything).

 

I found this statement concerning:

 

 

 

We will only accept payments by Bankers draft, Building society cheque, Electronic bank transfer (Bacs) or postal orders (unsigned).

We will not accept credit or debit cards. 

 

This does not appear to include any payment method where the 'buyer' is likely to have any recourse for refund or recompense from the payment facilitator for any non-performance.

 

When questioned about protection the following statement was made.

 

 

there will be a full business liability policy taken out to cover any unexpected events should they arise concerning the manufacture of 10000/10001 in O gauge, and any other products that we are introducing to the market.

 

The web page does not make any reference to that and, if available, I would imagine the premium for such a policy for a start-up would be substantial on a project of this size.

 

The web page does include this statement:

 

 

 

Should there be any unfortunate event where the manufacturer fails to supply the models, then ALL monies will be refunded forthwith.

 

If investors' money had been spent on tooling but the factory failed to produce the models for whatever reason this onus would undoubtedly fall on the business owner and given the previous notes about capital this would represent a heavy burden on the business owner. As a limited company the liability could be avoided by dissolution in such circumstances.

 

This story is probably the most which the phrase caveat emptor can be applied to from any I have ever seen.

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Grateful thanks should go to Steve Leathers, Andy Hoseason and Simon Bendall for their invaluable support and advice.

 

I wonder if they are all aware that they are named as effectively "endorsing" the project, based on any advice that they may have knowingly or unknowingly given?

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Interesting to see that Steve from Little Loco Co is one of those who has given advice . . . . .

 

Grateful thanks should go to Steve Leathers, Andy Hoseason and Simon Bendall for their invaluable support and advice.

.

That advice could have come from a brief conversation at an exhibition along the lines of 'How did you do x?"  It's meaningless other than to draw in an air of professionalism by giving thanks to someone respected in the industry and thus linking them in some way to the proposed product.

 

In some ways the new model of the Chinese factories engaging directly with the buyers is perhaps allowing in people who may not be best placed to be offering products for sale.  It's one thing having an establish business engage and commission models but now someone faceless hiding behind a limited company, taking only cash sums appears to be able to do so.  He might be completely above board, but if the name isn't recognised which it appears it isn't then how do we know how well he will manage the CAD/EP/Production process with the Chinese factory who at the end of the day will take the money and build whatever the client wants.

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FIA trains did an LMS 10000/1 project in brass in the Far East, I wonder if this is the design work being called upon?

 

I don't believe there is any connection there.

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I wonder if they are all aware that they are named as effectively "endorsing" the project, based on any advice that they may have knowingly or unknowingly given?

 

 

Copied below from the Gauge O Guild Forum from Steve at Little Loco Co - for the avoidance of any doubt, I have no connection with Lococraft or Little Loco Co. . . . . 

 

 

I and a few others acted in an advisory capacity.

 

Seems like a very decent chap who is going 'off piste' when it comes to prototypes to model. I think more interesting models will follow on the success of this one.

 

 

.

 

 

 
 

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A 'Whois' search on the website address gives:

Domain name:

lococraft.co.uk

 

Registrant:

Jeff Lynch

 

Registrant type:

Unknown

 

Registrant's address:

12 Old Station Road

Syston

Leicestershire

LE7 1NT

United Kingdom

 

Does that help?

 

Dave

 One asks the obvious question, is he related to Laurie?

 

 Alan

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 One asks the obvious question, is he related to Laurie?

 

 

I have no reason to believe there is any connection.

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Should the crowdfunding target not be met, all monies paid into the crowdfunding project will be refunded, minus the postage

 

Why?  If the project does not get off the ground, why retain the postage? 

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Should the crowdfunding target not be met, all monies paid into the crowdfunding project will be refunded, minus the postage

 

Why?  If the project does not get off the ground, why retain the postage? 

Because this chap wants to place all the risk on the customers whilst protecting himself from any cost.   Man wants the Twins and a prototype Deltic, but man wants someone else to pay for them.

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Hmmmm ....... interesting, in that another, established and well-known, supplier has recently announced this loco in r-t-r 0, but coarse-scale, and I would guess it will hit a similar price point.

 

I wonder if there is something going on that involves attempting to spread set-up costs across two markets that remain steadfastly distinct.

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I wonder if there is something going on that involves attempting to spread set-up costs across two markets that remain steadfastly distinct.

 

I don't believe there's any connection there either.

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I don't believe there is any connection there.

 

 

I have no reason to believe there is any connection.

 

 

I don't believe there's any connection there either.

 

You must have a big hat to keep all this information under Andy!!

 

Mike.

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