TomScrut Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 2 hours ago, Johnfromoz said: Wow, the pile of returned Hattons 66s must rival the Christmas tree in Times Square. They said to me on Friday that any returns get taken up with the factory so at least it would seem that they might not be bearing the brunt of it in terms of wastages Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted July 30, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 30, 2020 58 minutes ago, TomScrut said: They said to me on Friday that any returns get taken up with the factory so at least it would seem that they might not be bearing the brunt of it in terms of wastages What does that mean though? Taken up with the factory may just mean that Hattons simply tell them "another X bad ones today" and the factory just shrugs its shoulders. I really hope the factory gets a financial hit for its poor performance, but given discussion on fault returns that have been had on other threads, it seems that it is not always the case. Roy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted July 30, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 30, 2020 6 hours ago, Hilux5972 said: Unless people have forgotten, most dcc controllers can run a loco on dc anyway. 1 hour of running in isn’t going to cause any damage to the loco in the long term. Define "most" please. I would never go near doing it again on my Lenz system (address 0). Tried it once - a loud buzz from the motor, cr@p running, and a hot motor in a couple of minutes. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cairnsroadworks Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, DRS Crewe On A Mission said: Hi Tom, Thank you to yourself and everyone else who has replied to my comment regarding the latest batch of 66s. I really appreciate all of the information and advice. It's such a shame that what externally on photos on the Hattons website for example, appears to be a fantastic newly tooled Class 66 is for the second batch running let down by quality control issues. Hattons seem to have really grasped some of the things that customers wanted on the new 66 including: a more powerful motor to haul more wagons, excellent livery application, further detailing to the chassis and more lighting functions. It's just really unfortunate that the entire model is let down by niggles such as: detailing from the chassis falling/snapping off, some of the lights not working, wonky/misaligned nameplates on the bodysides, excess glue, chipped paintwork on the cab rails, axle boxes falling off and axle boxes been misaligned when fitted causing the bogies/models to derail. I have to say it's disappointing because this model, especially been the Class 66 had real potential and it seems that as customers we have gained in some areas but then it seems to have come at a cost of receiving models with quality control issues, across both batches so far. I'm glad that you, your friend and some others have found some good ones and are happy with them but personally I am going to wait and see if Bachmann produce some of the liveries that Hattons have. Bachmann have already announced an Orange 419 (originally was planned to be 413), so if I want a new 66 in the G&W Orange I will opt for the Bachmann 66. I also hope that Bachmann produce a Pink ONE 587 because if they do I will likely buy that one as well. Which other two 66s did you receive on Monday and are they fine or do they have any QC issues? Thank you in advance. Kind Regards, Danny. I would pick you up on your assessment of livery application Danny. There was the Colas issue and the fact that no one from Hattons has acknowledged that 66623 is totally wrong, plus questionable yellow on the front of at least 66780. But I’m probably too picky. It will be interesting what news the Bachmann announcement next week brings. As mentioned before many rumours of an upgrade for their 66. I have no wish for the Hattons project to fail; the model looks and sounds great when it works. I would have hoped that they would have issued something about 66623 and offered replacement bodies in the correct colour; Dapol did with their 68s when they got the printing wrong. Edited July 30, 2020 by cairnsroadworks I hadn’t finished. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 46 minutes ago, cairnsroadworks said: Dapol did with their 68s when they got the printing wrong. And Hornby with Bow Fell and it would seem with the latest NMT. 1 hour ago, Roy Langridge said: What does that mean though? Maybe so, good point. Not exactly a recipe for continued working partnership though if they don't do anything. 1 hour ago, newbryford said: Define "most" please. Yeah I wouldn't say any of them I am aware of do DC properly. I'd expect that a DCC controller has a DAC in it so I'd expect they could make it output a faux DC voltage by setting it to a high frequency, which is what I'd think they must do. But I'd think they would be able to improve on this possibly by having a physical switch on the controller to switch a filter/capacitor into the mix to smooth things out. I may be completely wrong here I am a mechanical engineer not an electrical engineer! But it would be a useful feature IMO. I aren't suggesting they make it work multiple locos on DCC with this just a better way of testing a loco on its own on the layout. Also given I have no interest in running DCC fitted locos in DC I tend to buy DCC only chips as they are cheaper so I wouldn't even need to clear they layout I don't think. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
classy52 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 1 hour ago, cairnsroadworks said: It will be interesting what news the Bachmann announcement next week brings. As mentioned before many rumours of an upgrade for their 66. Hope they do, nothing like a bit of competition within the high fidelity arena. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted July 30, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 30, 2020 1 hour ago, newbryford said: Define "most" please. I would never go near doing it again on my Lenz system (address 0). Tried it once - a loud buzz from the motor, cr@p running, and a hot motor in a couple of minutes. +1 to that, and you are still putting potentially high current through the decoder if there is a loco fault before you find that fault on DC. Roy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete the Elaner Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 2 hours ago, newbryford said: Define "most" please. I would never go near doing it again on my Lenz system (address 0). Tried it once - a loud buzz from the motor, cr@p running, and a hot motor in a couple of minutes. NCE Powercab/Powerpro seem to be popular systems & do not support address 0 running for those reasons. After hearing what it can do (& understanding how it works), it is not a feature I want anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 57 minutes ago, Roy Langridge said: +1 to that, and you are still putting potentially high current through the decoder if there is a loco fault before you find that fault on DC. Roy Unless I am missing something, you have got that the wrong way round. He is on about running a DC loco on DCC controller, i.e. no decoder involved, not DCC loco on DC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 36 minutes ago, Pete the Elaner said: NCE Powercab/Powerpro seem to be popular systems & do not support address 0 running for those reasons. Z21 doesn't either and there are a few of them about. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted July 30, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, TomScrut said: Unless I am missing something, you have got that the wrong way round. He is on about running a DC loco on DCC controller, i.e. no decoder involved, not DCC loco on DC. Doh - quite right. I was on DCC, but thinking the decoder was already in. Being a muppet today! Roy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted July 30, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, TomScrut said: Z21 doesn't either and there are a few of them about. Two of my DCC systems support DC, two don't. Roy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, classy52 said: Hope they do, nothing like a bit of competition within the high fidelity arena. I hope so, although I do honestly think they could clean the market up IF they could get the cost of their current one down to around £100-£110 at release (as opposed to being about that having been on the shelves a while). Would expect it would take a lot of sales from the Hornby one, and make a lot of people think whether the price difference to the Hatton's one is worth it. At the moment with there not being much price difference between Bachmann and Hatton's I am willing to persist with trying to get a Hatton's one how I want it than a Bachmann one for similar money but if it was £40-50 cheaper I maybe wouldn't. OTOH if Bachmann only brought out one that was same price as current but more on a par with the Hatton's one, they'd have to spend some money on tooling and also still only be taking sales from one competitor. Having said that, I think the 2 main areas that the Bachmann should be improved on IF they are doing so is the air dam and the lighting. Edited July 30, 2020 by TomScrut Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, Roy Langridge said: Doh - quite right. I was on DCC, but thinking the decoder was already in. Being a muppet today! Roy Whilst it may come across as be being a pedantic so and so, I was actually wondering if there was something I didn't know (in the context of what you said, I know there is a lot of things I don't know in general)! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted July 30, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, TomScrut said: Whilst it may come across as be being a pedantic so and so, I was actually wondering if there was something I didn't know (in the context of what you said, I know there is a lot of things I don't know in general)! No worries, quite happy for people to point out when I am wrong. My wife does all the time Roy 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Colin_McLeod Posted July 30, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 30, 2020 The ZTC 511 has a switch to select between DC and DCC. Very useful for testing and running in locos. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mooresby Posted July 30, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 30, 2020 For what its worth i've returned 66587 and have just been called to advise me that there are no replacements available so have taken the refund option. It was wobblier than an anxious jelly and it appeared that at least one wheel set was not in contact with the railhead on my test track which prevented it from running even slightly well. Additionally, there appeared to be red lights permanently on in the middle of the cab face where there was no light resulting in a reddish glow - I should have taken a picture of it prior to sending it back. Anyway, I think that on balance, the Hattons project is just not worth the aggro and whilst i'm disappointed as I did love the pink One livery, i'll stick to Bachmann for future 66's. What they lack in fidelity they more than make up for in terms of reliability. Hey ho.... 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted July 30, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 30, 2020 You say lack of fidelity but from normal viewing distances I can’t see any huge issue with the Bachmann loco quick quiz, this is a mixture of hattons and Bachmann 66s, identify the hattons examples (of which I’ve been very lucky getting good running examples) 5 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
37501 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 6 hours ago, TomScrut said: I hope so, although I do honestly think they could clean the market up IF they could get the cost of their current one down to around £100-£110 at release (as opposed to being about that having been on the shelves a while). Would expect it would take a lot of sales from the Hornby one, and make a lot of people think whether the price difference to the Hatton's one is worth it. At the moment with there not being much price difference between Bachmann and Hatton's I am willing to persist with trying to get a Hatton's one how I want it than a Bachmann one for similar money but if it was £40-50 cheaper I maybe wouldn't. OTOH if Bachmann only brought out one that was same price as current but more on a par with the Hatton's one, they'd have to spend some money on tooling and also still only be taking sales from one competitor. Having said that, I think the 2 main areas that the Bachmann should be improved on IF they are doing so is the air dam and the lighting. The air dam at the coupling end of a Bachmann 66 can be fitted around a Kadee coupling. It requires a bit of surgery but gives a good result. John 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 Just now, 37501 said: The air dam at the coupling end of a Bachmann 66 can be fitted around a Kadee coupling. It requires a bit of surgery but gives a good result. But the Hattons one looks loads better regardless IMO 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 2 hours ago, big jim said: quick quiz Ok I'll bite. 789 is the only Hattons one? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
37501 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 I can’t disagree with that. Loving my 66756. I was very keen on buying a standard EWS liveried one, 66005 but was put off by the font of the lettering. John 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamski94 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 It's a shame about these locos. I was really excited when I first saw them announced and all the features they were to include. I didn't preorder any due to not being able to justify at that time the expense but now it seems I dodged a potential bullet. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 4 minutes ago, Adamski94 said: potential bullet Not really. If you'd got a bad one you'd have got your money back. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamski94 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 Yes but it's more the disappointment and hassle involved. Especially with what seemed to be a great model. I'm sure we would rather a working and great product than to have to get our money back 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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