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Class 66 in OO Gauge - New Announcement


Hattons Dave
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Sort of covered above. If you are buying a Hattons 66 then you should be a modeller (my personal view), if you aren’t then maybe the Hattons 66 isn’t what you need,  try Bachmann or Hornby. 
In the quest for fidelity and detail then separately fitted parts WILL fall off from time to time, that’s a fact. 
Can’t wait for mine to arrive and do some modelling on them.

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Rather than straying off into the emotive area of who is a 'modeller' and who isn't (a lot of sniffy nonsense in my view) I would reiterate my earlier view that:-

 

1 Given the minute and bespoke nature of the part (axle cap)

2 Given the moving forces exerted on it over the life of the model

 

It would surely be a common sense and low cost move for Hattons to include spares within their detail pack. That was the only suggestion I was making!! Lol.

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1 hour ago, atom3624 said:

With the Bachmann, you still have the 'detailing' parts to fit, so being a 'modeller' of some description or other is a prerequisite - should at least have some form of competence, or know somebody who is.

 

Al.


Whilst that’s sort of true, they are optional fit items. The axle caps on the Hattons 66 are a standard part of each loco.

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3 hours ago, Sir TophamHatt said:

If I'm spending £265, I don't want to be supergluing anything.

Agree, however simple the task might be, it is a fault. Hopefully, in due course mine won't be a shedding shed or if it is the parts get found to be  glued back on.

 

Also it is a very small sized, and specific bit, that you can't just substitute something else for as a home bodge.

 

Edited by john new
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Clearly Hattons did not foresee such an issue with revolving axles, but having seen models run I’ve noticed the 'axle' ends (plastic pieces) protrude from the boogie frames when the wheel set is pushed to one side, resulting in a seemingly unrealistic scenario of the part being a few mm proud of the bogie frame.

 

Maybe a solution could be found using either square or 'D' (circular with a flat) axle ends and similar holes in the plastic attachments, as well as the attachment being captive - yet still free to revolve - in the bogie frame. This would allow both lateral movement of the metal 'true' axle inside the false plastic axle end (avoiding my above observation) and would keep the plastic axle ends captive all the time, not requiring glue to hold them in and with no danger of missing parts.

 

Just a thought and quite unrealistic to implement now without tooling change. A small hiccup on an otherwise excellent model.

 

Jack,

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...And just another thought about the current situation. If the tolerances are tight between the plastic axle pieces and the bogie frame hole, would opening out the hole slightly help? Any friction or force caused by the plastic axle stub fouling the frame may cause the glue to fail.

 

I'm not suggesting those who've purchased a model take a drill or knife to theirs, but it might be simple for Hattons to increase the tolerance on future models without hindering the appearance of the revolving axles?

 

Jack.

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3 hours ago, truffy said:

 

Leaving aside the cost for the moment, isn't sticking some things onto other things pretty much a definition of 'modelling'?

 

2 hours ago, Johnfromoz said:

It would surely be a common sense and low cost move for Hattons to include spares within their detail pack. That was the only suggestion I was making!! Lol.

 

Depends upon an individual's personal viewpoint I guess... modelling... or repair...?  Either way, all of this sounds like a bit of a handbag fight and rather pointless?

 

On a practical note however, I'd agree with the solution above, as I'm fine with accepting that any moving parts are always going to be susceptible to working loose over time, in which case - for a hi-spec model that I would imagine is to be part of Hatton's range for the foreseeable future - it would seem only reasonable to make these vulnerable parts available in the form of spares that may be purchased if/when required?  What will be a bit naff is if the only future remedy would be to purchase a complete new model for the sake of a comparatively low-cost spare part...

 

Otherwise quite a stunning model, thus far.

 

Best

Al

 

 

 

Edited by YesTor
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For me, said by several above in various guises, the only 'change' required is changing the axles - giving the AB's more to purchase onto, and align correctly - whether the end is serrated, threaded or just plain, it'll stay as required.

 

If the bogie sides are attached after insertion of the axles, this may be a limiting factor, but perhaps not - for me, I'd be talking about adding ~1.5mm to each end - 3mm total - of the axles.

 

Al.

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There's been one reply on the DD stating they've had no such problems with theirs 'so far' .... somebody said.

 

With reference to a question a little earlier, for the one problematic AB I had, I VERY SLIGHTLY opened up the hole, and once I got it aligned, there was no wobble any more and it runs perfectly ever since.

The slight 'wobble' I had was obviously the AB on the hole, rotating on the axle - the bogies are perfect otherwise.

 

Al.

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On 07/01/2020 at 21:50, IamDaniel said:

Hiya @Hattons Dave, I have 66743 on order (pre-ordered before the Nov 15 cut-off). Any idea when it is likely to arrive, please? The website just says 'Jan'.

 

Cheers!

 

Hello Daniel,

 

Owing to some unavoidable delays in the shipping process, we have provided an updated delivery schedule on our website. We’re now expecting all versions of the models ending 033 to 037 arrive with us around the end of February/early March. 

See the full delivery schedule, here: http://bit.ly/38fo4qn

 

I hope this helps.

 

Cheers,

Dave

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42 minutes ago, stock_2007 said:

I'm not sure how long a delay has to be before its 'bad' I'm really glad I never sold my Bachmann 66's on

 

Accurascale have delayed the JSAs by around 5 months! Worse than this 66 and to be honest I could do with them more than the loco.

 

Having said that it depends on how long a project has been followed as to how late it is to an extent. I only really pay attention to lead times once we get to the back end of the project where shipping times are being discussed, as most of the time the "manufacturers" are in the hands of the factories in China doing the tooling correctly, modifying it in a timely manner, and then making and shipping the stuff on time.

 

A lot of things not 100% in the control of the company commissioning the work, as I would expect they'll change their timings to suit the people with the biggest sticks, probably none of which are UK based model railway companies.

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It's getting to the point where Manufacturers should maybe consider not predicting delivery times until the product is literally in their warehouses or entering the English Channel, as they seem to have little control on the development, manufacturing and shipping timetable. For those who don't get riled by delays will be unaffected.... For those who get irritated by delays, the expectation will be more realistic. Suppose it doesn't help budgeting plans though.

 

The Hatton's 66 was originally estimated for March 2019. However some manufacturers are literally years out with their predicted delivery promises.

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2 hours ago, Hattons Dave said:

 

Hello Daniel,

 

Owing to some unavoidable delays in the shipping process, we have provided an updated delivery schedule on our website. We’re now expecting all versions of the models ending 033 to 037 arrive with us around the end of February/early March. 

See the full delivery schedule, here: http://bit.ly/38fo4qn

 

I hope this helps.

 

Cheers,

Dave

Thanks for the update Dave, looks live I have another couple of months to save for the Royal Scotsman pair. 

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1 hour ago, Winter123 said:

It's getting to the point where Manufacturers should maybe consider not predicting delivery times until the product is literally in their warehouses or entering the English Channel, as they seem to have little control on the development, manufacturing and shipping timetable. For those who don't get riled by delays will be unaffected.... For those who get irritated by delays, the expectation will be more realistic. Suppose it doesn't help budgeting plans though.

 

The Hatton's 66 was originally estimated for March 2019. However some manufacturers are literally years out with their predicted delivery promises.

 

I expect the problem is half the time people will be "ambitious" with their estimations of delivery to get the business. I don't mean the people we buy the model off, but the people who do the tooling and make the model overseas.

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2 hours ago, TomScrut said:

 

I expect the problem is half the time people will be "ambitious" with their estimations of delivery to get the business. I don't mean the people we buy the model off, but the people who do the tooling and make the model overseas.

Theres only so many factories in China.. its highly probable a delay to one model can impact several UK commissioner's as that delay rattles down the queue.

Hattons are doing A LOT of class 66’s.. its certainly going to eat a good amount of factory time.

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I am resigned to 'I will get mine when it comes to the door'. I am glad Hattons are being proactive in showing how to refit the axle box covers, however given that it is a moving part that can come off, and inevitably some will get lost I wonder if Dave could reassure us that there will be spares available?

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3 hours ago, TomScrut said:

 

I expect the problem is half the time people will be "ambitious" with their estimations of delivery to get the business. I don't mean the people we buy the model off, but the people who do the tooling and make the model overseas.

I don’t think estimates  are ambitious in order to get business. It strikes me as far more likely that estimates just don’t allow for the unforeseen. Because delays are unforeseen, planners have no idea how long they’ll be.

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3 minutes ago, No Decorum said:

I don’t think estimates  are ambitious in order to get business. It strikes me as far more likely that estimates just don’t allow for the unforeseen. Because delays are unforeseen, planners have no idea how long they’ll be.

 

I think both things are actually one and the same. My thoughts below, not statements of fact:

 

A) the actual manufacturer in China will win and lose work on lead time, not just on lead time but it's a massive factor. So they are probably ambitious with what they say as it's either win the work or not. Time to sales for the commissioner is so important from both a cash flow perspective and also to in terms of competitive edge it has to be a big factor.

 

B) the commissioner will want to generate as much sales interest and excitement for their new model. Saying "3 years with a years contingency" isn't going to get people excited. They need to give the time it will be if everything goes to plan to get as much money in up front (in case of ones where there are deposits or payments up front) or to get as much money in straight away when it does arrive. If all of a sudden stuff comes in 6 months early people either won't have the money ready or the stuff won't be pre ordered (as they thought they had 6 months) so will sit around for a while either while people save up or while it gets discounted or both. Neither are good for sales/revenue.

 

Whereas if the bare minimum lead time is stated, the manufacturers may win work they wouldn't otherwise and also the commissioners at least have people ready with their money when it comes, on time or not.

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Hattons had been pretty close on this one - Christmas delivery for the initial batch.

 

I think we may suspect that additional measures may be in progress to avoid a repeat of the 'axlebox issue' which may have delayed the second batch - could be wrong.

It does appear that they are ensuring the best possible model - which it most definitely is.

 

The difference is not like comparing the Hornby Princess of the 60's with that of today, but there are obvious improvements over the Bachmann visually - hence why I sold mine.

 

Al.

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