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Andy Y

Locomotion Models - updates and new coaching stock.

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I would love to see the big clerestory 12-wheelers, an sell a close relative to buy some

 

Sadly a rake RTR would probably be unrealistic.  There is probably insufficient commonalty to keep tooling costs within reasonable bounds (a problem that may face GW toplights, too). They would be very expensive and probably not sell in sufficient numbers. Locomotion would need to be convinced of success, but so too would a manufacturing partner.  I daresay their day will come, but I do not think the market has evolved to the level of maturity necessary to make these viable.   

 

Plus, is there one in the National Collection?

 

There are a number of preserved  6-wheelers knocking about, and they are probably a less daunting prospect. Choose the right diagrams and you might be able to produce them in ECJS, GNR and, even, M&GN guises.

 

I think these would sell in the current market, but also help to evolve it so that other releases could be contemplated in the future, including GN and ECJS bogie stock. 

 

I imagine they would sell them in packs of 3. 6 wheelers present certain problems in RTR as witnessed by the Dapol Stove brake although maybe cheaper to tool if less compatible with a GNR C1.

(Now if someone produces a photo of a C1 with 6 wheelers.... I'm sold).

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I imagine they would sell them in packs of 3. 6 wheelers present certain problems in RTR as witnessed by the Dapol Stove brake although maybe cheaper to tool if less compatible with a GNR C1.

(Now if someone produces a photo of a C1 with 6 wheelers.... I'm sold).

Why six wheeled stock should present problems defeats me. In HO,Fleischmann,Trix,Roco et al.have been producing them for at by least 30 years by designing them with sufficient lateral movement on the wheelsets,particularly on the middle axle .Never presented any difficulties.

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Why six wheeled stock should present problems defeats me. In HO,Fleischmann,Trix,Roco et al.have been producing them for at by least 30 years by designing them with sufficient lateral movement on the wheelsets,particularly on the middle axle .Never presented any difficulties.

Good to know, Let's hope whoever designs them makes use of those best practices.

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...

There are a number of preserved  6-wheelers knocking about, and they are probably a less daunting prospect. Choose the right diagrams and you might be able to produce them in ECJS, GNR and, even, M&GN guises.

...

 

I think that would be terrifically exciting (for me, anyway). And, being unlike anything else on the RTR market, I suspect such things might have some pretty decent sales.

 

Paul

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Why six wheeled stock should present problems defeats me. In HO,Fleischmann,Trix,Roco et al.have been producing them for at by least 30 years by designing them with sufficient lateral movement on the wheelsets,particularly on the middle axle .Never presented any difficulties.

 

We've moved away from Fleischmann pizza cutter wheels Ian.  Fewer of these coaches have been re-released in the last few years where NEM wheel specs have become the norm.

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BTW there is not just coaches to go behind the single that is on our wishlist. And the national collection is more that just steam and diesel locos and we do have some very interesting ideas for the coming years. One thing that I would like to gauge some interest in is the possibilty of buildings as part of the collection but the only buildings that I have come up with at the moment are some of our historic buildings on site at Locomotion such as the coal drops or soho house where Timothy Hackworth lived.

Regards

Stuart

 

I would strongly recommend not going down the path of buildings. Given the amount of locos and rolling stock in the collection which haven't been produced, some of which the tooling exists, I would focus on them. I suspect buildings would appeal less to the "collector" than locomotives/rolling stock and as for modellers, unless you are modelling the location/region/period of the buildings within the national collection, they would not fit in to the majority of layouts.

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No

 

Page not found

 

So it isn't! 

 

Seemingly I can't get the link to post directly so try this typing this in at the top of a webpage:

 

transportsofdelight.smugmug

 

And then paste this onto the end:

 

.com/RAILWAYS/LOCOMOTIVES-OF-LNER-CONSTITUENT-COMPANIES/LOCOMOTIVES-OF-THE-GREAT-NORTHERN-RAILWAY/i-kdnhQxB/A

 

I can't directly share the image to here due to copyright but it shows C1 No.281 at Essendine in July 1904 with a Grantham - Peterborough local formed of a van and four 6 wheelers.

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It didn't work when I clicked the link, but it did when I cut and pasted the url.

 

What a marvellous picture, thank you for linking.

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It didn't work when I clicked the link, but it did when I cut and pasted the url.

 

What a marvellous picture, thank you for linking.

 

Anything to push the 6 wheeled agenda! I'm already imagining a nice rake of M&GN coaches...  :angel:

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I would strongly recommend not going down the path of buildings. Given the amount of locos and rolling stock in the collection which haven't been produced, some of which the tooling exists, I would focus on them. I suspect buildings would appeal less to the "collector" than locomotives/rolling stock and as for modellers, unless you are modelling the location/region/period of the buildings within the national collection, they would not fit in to the majority of layouts.

 

Steam at Swindon did a 'building' in the shape of the very iconic and well known (to those of us of a Western persuasion) entrance to the tunnel to the works at Swindon.  So iconic, individual looking, capable of a bit of modification into various sorts of buildings, Great Western (ok wrong colours) and so on - so logically would sell like hot cakes - they finished up clearing the last of them at a reduced price.  i don't know if they did or didn't make money on them but probably they did - but how much, how good was the overall return?  

 

I think that generally it's fair to say that locos offer the best return although even there margins are tight, coaches will have to sell in packs to achieve a decent return, wagons would have to be what many perceive as 'expensive' and would also have to sell in packs to achieve a worthwhile return.  And that is going to have to be at the root of it all as far as the NCIM is concerned - it is all about business case, return on investment, and making the best possible contribution to museum funds.  I do wonder if the right buildings could be found to actually do that?

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I’d say they also need to set up the infrastructure to be able to sell these items . No harm on the poor people who are trying to sort the distribution of the Stirling Single out, but clearly there are too few of them . I just get the impression that Locomotion are not set up to deal with volume sales .Realistically business wise you can’t be over manned all year round just to deal with occasional Stirling Single Volumes . So I think they need to engage with a retailer , maybe Rails , so that the basics , confirmations of orders, answering queries , despatch of items and communications , are all dealt with. While the Stirling appears to be a great model , it’s introduction appears to have been tarnished, at least to the people who are waiting, by the mix up sending out these models .

 

If they are introducing new models , they really need to get that sorted. It’s gone beyond selling models through the museum outlets . You need to be able to deal with e commerce and distribution.

Edited by Legend

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I agree with Mike (Stationmaster) that if an iconic building like the one made for Steam had to be sold off cheaply then it would be unlikely that they could identify any smallish building that would sell to both model enthusiasts and visitors to the museum. As Mike says, any commission must make money for the museum, they cannot afford to lose a penny on anything they launch.

 

To be successful they need to identify the really iconic items in their collection; for me the obvious one is Rocket itself which would sell to a large segment of the public. In terms of coaches, the Dynamometer Car, was an obvious example and maybe some of the royal coaches would be worth considering.

 

Hornby seem to have been successful with the Devon Belle Observation car, I remember being a bit shocked when the price was first announced - in retrospect it was a bargain -but it has been returned to the 2018 catalogue so they at least think that there is still sufficient demand.

 

The tie up with Rapido seems to have hit the right spot, high quality iconic items with a premium that (hopefully) gives them a good return but also stimulates people to dig into their wallets and feel that they are getting something very special. I also agree with Legend that they should either be prepared to set up short term contracts with local staff to work on the packing and distribution peaks or negotiate with one of the major retailers, like Rails, to do it for them.

 

Having received the Stirling safely and bought many of their releases I am, as they say, speaking as a very satisfied customer, albeit one who is prepared to pay a bit more to support the museum. I will be interested to see what they choose as their next iconic item to have modelled.

 

all the best

 

Godfrey

Edited by Godfrey Glyn
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I’d say they also need to set up the infrastructure to be able to sell these items . No harm on the poor people who are trying to sort the distribution of the Stirling Single out, but clearly there are too few of them . I just get the impression that Locomotion are not set up to deal with volume sales .Realistically business wise you can’t be over manned all year round just to deal with occasional Stirling Single Volumes . So I think they need to engage with a retailer , maybe Rails , so that the basics , confirmations of orders, answering queries , despatch of items and communications , are all dealt with. While the Stirling appears to be a great model , it’s introduction appears to have been tarnished, at least to the people who are waiting, by the mix up sending out these models .

If they are introducing new models , they really need to get that sorted. It’s gone beyond selling models through the museum outlets . You need to be able to deal with e commerce and distribution.

The link with Rails is already in place.ATM however,even Rails are under pressure to distribute as all their goodies seem to have arrived at the same time.On the positive side of that,they are operating as normal and there are no reports of any glitches in their system which is as good as it gets.(Though having stuck my neck out on that one,someone is going to be the exception that proves the rule ,knowing this forum)

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I’d say they also need to set up the infrastructure to be able to sell these items . No harm on the poor people who are trying to sort the distribution of the Stirling Single out, but clearly there are too few of them . I just get the impression that Locomotion are not set up to deal with volume sales .Realistically business wise you can’t be over manned all year round just to deal with occasional Stirling Single Volumes . So I think they need to engage with a retailer , maybe Rails , so that the basics , confirmations of orders, answering queries , despatch of items and communications , are all dealt with. While the Stirling appears to be a great model , it’s introduction appears to have been tarnished, at least to the people who are waiting, by the mix up sending out these models .

 

If they are introducing new models , they really need to get that sorted. It’s gone beyond selling models through the museum outlets . You need to be able to deal with e commerce and distribution.

 

Few retailers are set up to deal with volume sales either.

 

Look around on here and there is similar moaning about the time taken whenever Rails, Kernow, or anyone else gets in an exclusive model and are faced with suddenly having to ship out say 1000+ orders all at once.

 

So all that does is shift the problem elsewhere.

 

I think it is also fair to assume that Locomotion will have learned from their attempt at improving shipping times, and with those lessons the next item will proceed in a better fashion.

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Few retailers are set up to deal with volume sales either.

 

Look around on here and there is similar moaning about the time taken whenever Rails, Kernow, or anyone else gets in an exclusive model and are faced with suddenly having to ship out say 1000+ orders all at once.

 

So all that does is shift the problem elsewhere.

 

I think it is also fair to assume that Locomotion will have learned from their attempt at improving shipping times, and with those lessons the next item will proceed in a better fashion.

I think there is a difference in the scale of the problem though. While I’m aware Rails have had problems it’s nothing like as bad as the Stirling debacle with people getting three , others none . No confirmations etc . It doesn’t seem that the management of NRM are overly concerned , I haven’t seen any statements of intent, so not confident lessons will be learned Edited by Legend

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I think there is a difference in the scale of the problem though. While I’m aware Rails have had problems it’s nothing like as bad as the Stirling debacle with people getting three , others none . No confirmations etc . It doesn’t seem that the management of NRM are overly concerned , I haven’t seen any statements of intent, so not confident lessons will be learned

You are making this assumption purely on the basis of what is posted and read on this forum.The management of NRM do not have a presence here.This is left to Stuart and before him Sandra.What is taking place elsewhere is quite another matter.ATM it is speculative to either declare or infer anything.

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Look around on here and there is similar moaning about the time taken whenever Rails, Kernow, or anyone else gets in an exclusive model and are faced with suddenly having to ship out say 1000+ orders all at once.

 

I deal with Kernow and others regularly.  Kernow does the Model Rail exclusives as well as their own, but their service and communication is exemplary. I choose to be patient and to minimise my criticism of Locomotion, but I have waited in the dark for far too long.  But I guess there is no other option.  Have a lovely holiday weekend.

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I think there is a difference in the scale of the problem though. While I’m aware Rails have had problems it’s nothing like as bad as the Stirling debacle with people getting three , others none . No confirmations etc . It doesn’t seem that the management of NRM are overly concerned , I haven’t seen any statements of intent, so not confident lessons will be learned

 

 

That is quite a statement to make with no evidence. 

 

There has been communication through this thread and others have reported that they have had individual communication with both Stuart and Rapido repair.  I am sure that they are both embarrassed and keen to solve this problem, but to state they aren't concerned when it could have a large financial impact is ridiculous.

 

When this is finished I am sure any future releases will be dealt with differently.

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That is quite a statement to make with no evidence. 

 

When this is finished I am sure any future releases will be dealt with differently.

 

That is quite a statement to make with no evidence.

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That is quite a statement to make with no evidence. 

 

There has been communication through this thread and others have reported that they have had individual communication with both Stuart and Rapido repair.  I am sure that they are both embarrassed and keen to solve this problem, but to state they aren't concerned when it could have a large financial impact is ridiculous.

 

When this is finished I am sure any future releases will be dealt with differently.

I didn’t mean Stuart or Rapidorepair, who are clearly pulling out the stops in very difficult circumstances . I did mean the people above them who should have ensured proper resources allocated

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Interesting colour (or colorised) photo of the single pulling teak 6 wheelers in 1938 halfway down the link shared on the Rails Dynamometer thread.

 

https://www.steve-banks.org/

I think you will find they are genuine 1930s colour photos.

IMHO Colorised ones wouldn't have such variations as those.

 

Keith

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I think you will find they are genuine 1930s colour photos.

IMHO Colorised ones wouldn't have such variations as those.

 

Keith

Indeed that is what I thought but colour before WWII is rare.

Those 6 wheelers cover a much bigger period than I thought.

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