Greater Anglia's Stadler Flirt - Class 745 & 755

[Coryton]

There are a couple of interesting photos here: http://www.railtechnologymagazine.com/Rail-News/first-greater-anglia-flirt-bi-mode-arrives-in-norwich-for-testing

 

The unit looks as if it's running round the UK with continental end of train markers on it, presumably from the delivery.

 

I would have thought somebody would want them back.

[admiles]

12 hours ago, Coryton said:

There are a couple of interesting photos here: http://www.railtechnologymagazine.com/Rail-News/first-greater-anglia-flirt-bi-mode-arrives-in-norwich-for-testing

 

The unit looks as if it's running round the UK with continental end of train markers on it, presumably from the delivery.

 

I would have thought somebody would want them back.

 

Modern ones are just bits of molded plastic. Very little value in the grand scheme of things. You tend to see loads of them floating around the bigger stations in Europe.

[beast66606]

First of the 745  (Standsted Express) units arrived today

 

28 February 2019

Gissing

66001 and 745104 on 5Q99, 03:43, Ripple Lane Exch Sdgs - Norwich C.PT. T.&R.S.M.D (08:23)

 

 

[nightstar.train]

I’m really curious as to why the stadler units are built semi articulated. They’re essentially 6 x 2 car articulated sets coupled up. Why not full articulation? 

[Coryton]

1 hour ago, nightstar.train said:

I’m really curious as to why the stadler units are built semi articulated. They’re essentially 6 x 2 car articulated sets coupled up. Why not full articulation? 

 

Presumably because it gives more flexibility in maintenance - you don't have to lift 12 coaches up to get under one.

 

Perhaps being able to swap half-sets more easily is also useful.

 

The 373's were built as half-sets though apart from anything else I think it was a requirement at the time that any passenger train in the tunnel could be split in half for evacuation purposes.

 

Edited: I've just realised you said 6 x 2 car sets not 2 x 6 (I read what I wanted to see there).

 

That does seem unusual - I've not noticed a layout like that before elsewhere but I probably haven't been paying attention. It seems an odd compromise between the advantages and disadvantages of articulation.

Edited March 1, 2019 by Coryton
Correct misunderstanding

[Satan's Goldfish]

I think, but don't quote me, the articulated bogies in Flirts are not powered, but the conventional fixed bogies are. Hence in the 3 and 4 car 755 bi modes only the 2 outer bogies provide traction (which is fine for the branchline and secondary services they are providing).

 

By making the 745 12 car sets into essentially 6 joined 2 car Flirts (minus cabs on the inners) there's much more power getting to the rail which means better acceleration (12 powered out of 18 (2/3rds)) than if it was a pair of joined 6 car Flirts (4 powered out of 14 (2/7ths)) (maximum Flirt length is 6 vehicles if I remember correctly)

 

Again, don't quote me on any of that but I think that was covered quite a while ago on the specs of these units.

[Coryton]

1 hour ago, Satan's Goldfish said:

I think, but don't quote me, the articulated bogies in Flirts are not powered, but the conventional fixed bogies are. Hence in the 3 and 4 car 755 bi modes only the 2 outer bogies provide traction (which is fine for the branchline and secondary services they are providing).

 

Putting the powered bogies under what I assume is the lighter parts of the train, then.

[nightstar.train]

4 hours ago, Satan's Goldfish said:

I think, but don't quote me, the articulated bogies in Flirts are not powered, but the conventional fixed bogies are. Hence in the 3 and 4 car 755 bi modes only the 2 outer bogies provide traction (which is fine for the branchline and secondary services they are providing).

 

By making the 745 12 car sets into essentially 6 joined 2 car Flirts (minus cabs on the inners) there's much more power getting to the rail which means better acceleration (12 powered out of 18 (2/3rds)) than if it was a pair of joined 6 car Flirts (4 powered out of 14 (2/7ths)) (maximum Flirt length is 6 vehicles if I remember correctly)

 

Again, don't quote me on any of that but I think that was covered quite a while ago on the specs of these units.

 

Ah, that makes quite a lot of sense. Are they rated up to 125mlh or just 110? I know the line to Norwich isn’t 125mlh, but you often order trains that go faster in the hope of later upgrades (see class 91+Mk4s, Class 390). 

[hexagon789]

On ‎01‎/‎03‎/‎2019 at 17:19, nightstar.train said:

 

Ah, that makes quite a lot of sense. Are they rated up to 125mlh or just 110? I know the line to Norwich isn’t 125mlh, but you often order trains that go faster in the hope of later upgrades (see class 91+Mk4s, Class 390). 

 

Both 745 and 755s are 100mph max.

[hexagon789]

Also, don't know if it's been mentioned but Greater Anglia will be introducing two "Norwich in 90" services from May. These will 4-car Class 755s as the InterCity 745s won't be ready yet. 

 

Services will be:

 

0900 Norwich-Liverpool St

1100 Liverpool St-Norwich

1700 Norwich-Liverpool St

1900 Liverpool St-Norwich

[Siggie in the east]

41 minutes ago, hexagon789 said:

Also, don't know if it's been mentioned but Greater Anglia will be introducing two "Norwich in 90" services from May. These will 4-car Class 755s as the InterCity 745s won't be ready yet. 

 

Services will be:

 

0900 Norwich-Liverpool St

1100 Liverpool St-Norwich

1700 Norwich-Liverpool St

1900 Liverpool St-Norwich

That is the intention but realistically they will be a Class 90 and 8 mk3's as the 745's may not be in service in time due to using the current 745s for driver training. 

[Coryton]

4 hours ago, Siggie in the east said:

That is the intention but realistically they will be a Class 90 and 8 mk3's as the 745's may not be in service in time due to using the current 745s for driver training. 

 

So....Norwich in 90 with a 90?

[Classsix T]

Well Abbelio can relax a bit when the new trains come on-stream then.

Norwich in 745 minutes sounds eminently do-able. Tractor 'beet shedding incident at Bacton notwithstanding, natch. 

At ul do me fine buh, tek it easy, let that London worry, we're all good.

 

C6T. 

[great central]

4 minutes ago, Classsix T said:

Well Abbelio can relax a bit when the new trains come on-stream then.

Norwich in 745 minutes sounds eminently do-able. Tractor 'beet shedding incident at Bacton notwithstanding, natch. 

At ul do me fine buh, tek it easy, let that London worry, we're all good.

 

C6T. 

Bacton? Must be the long way round!

 

 

 

 

Unless there's another one?

[Satan's Goldfish]

1 hour ago, great central said:

Bacton? Must be the long way round!

 

 

 

 

Unless there's another one?

 

There's more than 1.

[justin1985]

On 18/02/2019 at 19:38, Siggie in the east said:

The carriage washer at crown point has been partially dismantled due to 'gauging' issues according to the signaller there, so that the new units can be shunted onto the wash road without damaging both the units and the washer.

 

After several months of not being able to see out of the windows on the MK3 sets, some are finally starting to look vaguely clean again! I assume carriage washer is back in action?

[beast66606]

2 minutes ago, justin1985 said:

 

After several months of not being able to see out of the windows on the MK3 sets, some are finally starting to look vaguely clean again! I assume carriage washer is back in action?

 

Hand cleaned I think

[Siggie in the east]

Yep, they have been hand cleaning some in Norwich and sending some to ilford for wheelset attention and being cleaned there. That's why nearly all the 1Pxx this week have only been 8car formations, not 9.

[Buckley Wells]

On 12/02/2019 at 10:29, Joseph_Pestell said:

 

I blame the BBC. If they had not started using this americanism it would have spread more slowly. That said, there is a certain logic to it. You don't board a bus at a road station.

 

As to spending £1M and 5 weeks to build a shortish platform: Sheer insanity!

I still say railway station....it' a yoof not Beeb thing, trust me.

[hexagon789]

On 07/03/2019 at 14:52, Siggie in the east said:

That is the intention but realistically they will be a Class 90 and 8 mk3's as the 745's may not be in service in time due to using the current 745s for driver training. 

 

Indeed, I think they've been out testing a 90 and Mk3 set for potential use on the 90 min services, I'd heard that the loco provided by Crown Point had an M3 restriction (only 3 motors working), so I don't know how well it fared.

[Siggie in the east]

We have test trips tonight running from Norwich station to Ipswich station. The first trip is an up service following the 23:05 departure, 1Y75, all the way to Ipswich on diesel power only.

[hexagon789]

On 13/03/2019 at 22:10, Siggie in the east said:

We have test trips tonight running from Norwich station to Ipswich station. The first trip is an up service following the 23:05 departure, 1Y75, all the way to Ipswich on diesel power only.

 

Are they still not authorised to run on the OLE then?

[Siggie in the east]

They can only run with the pantograph up when under test conditions. They transit to the start point under diesel power and then begin. But this run was testing the engines out. They were supposed to do a test run the day before but the unit they were using didnt have a permit to run so I believe this recent test had something to do with that lack of a permit.

Also, to run with the pantograph up, there needs to be an SPZ in place as running with the pant up can affect the control of signals on adjacent lines, possibly returning them to a red aspect in front of trains. 

[hexagon789]

3 minutes ago, Siggie in the east said:

They can only run with the pantograph up when under test conditions. They transit to the start point under diesel power and then begin. But this run was testing the engines out. They were supposed to do a test run the day before but the unit they were using didnt have a permit to run so I believe this recent test had something to do with that lack of a permit.

Also, to run with the pantograph up, there needs to be an SPZ in place as running with the pant up can affect the control of signals on adjacent lines, possibly returning them to a red aspect in front of trains. 

 

So does that mean the signalling needs modifications to prevent interference from the new trains? (Rather as with the northern ECML.)

[iands]

9 minutes ago, hexagon789 said:

 

So does that mean the signalling needs modifications to prevent interference from the new trains? (Rather as with the northern ECML.)

Or, as with the Azuma's, mods to the rolling stock as well?