Greater Anglia's Stadler Flirt - Class 745 & 755

[russ p]

Think I upset a GA manager last week as he was telling me all about Victoria sidings being reopened at Norwich for the new trains so I said I hope they are being used for their old purpose......

They used to store scrap stock for kings scrapyard 

[adb968008]

How come all the old stuff is being stored ?

 

surely the end of the line is due for mk3’s, 317/321’s, 153/6’s ?. I’d imagine theres a queue forming for those Electrostars... only leaves 360’s as homeless & useless ?

 

[wombatofludham]

11 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

How come all the old stuff is being stored ?

 

surely the end of the line is due for mk3’s, 317/321’s, 153/6’s ?. I’d imagine theres a queue forming for those Electrostars... only leaves 360’s as homeless & useless ?

 

Class 360s are apparently moving to St Pancras to work the Corby route

[Covkid]

16 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

How come all the old stuff is being stored ?

 

surely the end of the line is due for mk3’s, 317/321’s, 153/6’s ?. I’d imagine theres a queue forming for those Electrostars... only leaves 360’s as homeless & useless ?

 

 

You would think so, but the owners had just spent millions upgrading thirty 321s to "Renatus".   

[adb968008]

8 minutes ago, Covkid said:

 

You would think so, but the owners had just spent millions upgrading thirty 321s to "Renatus".   

Shrugs shoulders...

 

a whole bunch of mk3 sleepers got new batteries... i guess the lights were bright in Booths..

[Zomboid]

I imagine someone will find work for the 156s. Can't immediately see a home for the others though.

[adb968008]

I’d imagine that a good number of  mk3’s will find a home in preservation, isnt LSL interested in a couple of rakes, plus A1ST, who knows WCRC might too, then a few preserved lines may add a few (mnr has a couple already, as does the 125 group)

 

once the mk3’s are gone, thats pretty much the last chance preserved railways will have regarding coaching stock in the UK into the future... unless they intend to enter the world of OHLE, different types of couplings, not to mention IT etc.

 

Whilst most preserved railways have stopped in 1968, a few have embraced the 1980’s but i’d imagine all of them will stop at 1994, with exception of the odd class 66,68 or 70 someday.

 

I just don't see a preservation future for EMUs & DMUs but maybe someone will preserve a class 455, 317 etc for mainline running, but stuff like Electrostar etc I can see as being problematic for preservationists.

 

 

Edited June 20, 2019 by adb968008

[Classsix T]

Stansted unit 102 currently Norwich bound, 66001 in charge.

 

C6T. 

[Zomboid]

52 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

once the mk3’s are gone, thats pretty much the last chance preserved railways will have regarding coaching stock in the UK into the future... unless they intend to enter the world of OHLE, different types of couplings, not to mention IT etc.

I think that point has already been and gone for any outfit unwilling to put air brakes on a steam engine. I can see mark 3s having a future on the main line, but heritage railways are very much vac only (maybe there's an exception or two) whilst I don't think there has ever been such a thing as a vacuum braked mk3.

 

So it's either air brakes on kettles, or vac brakes on a mark 3, neither of which seem especially likely.

[Classsix T]

Not to mention the added complications of air con, or not having it, which brings its own problems. 

 

C6T. 

[The Stationmaster]

4 hours ago, adb968008 said:

I’d imagine that a good number of  mk3’s will find a home in preservation, isnt LSL interested in a couple of rakes, plus A1ST, who knows WCRC might too, then a few preserved lines may add a few (mnr has a couple already, as does the 125 group)

 

once the mk3’s are gone, thats pretty much the last chance preserved railways will have regarding coaching stock in the UK into the future... unless they intend to enter the world of OHLE, different types of couplings, not to mention IT etc.

 

Whilst most preserved railways have stopped in 1968, a few have embraced the 1980’s but i’d imagine all of them will stop at 1994, with exception of the odd class 66,68 or 70 someday.

 

I just don't see a preservation future for EMUs & DMUs but maybe someone will preserve a class 455, 317 etc for mainline running, but stuff like Electrostar etc I can see as being problematic for preservationists.

 

 

Don't forget Mk 3s have clearance issues not 'enjoyed' by earlier standard coaching stock.  So they might not be much use on heritage lines.  Mk2s reportedly have corrosion problems which are more difficult to deal with than similar troubles on Mk1s so notwithstanding their 'issues' Mk1s are likely to be around for a while reinforced by Mk2s for those who can afford to maintain them.

[phil-b259]

13 hours ago, Covkid said:

 

You would think so, but the owners had just spent millions upgrading thirty 321s to "Renatus".   

 

One thing to beer in mind is the interest now being shown by the likes of Porterbrook in Hydrogen powered vehicles.

 

Just as the 319s are finding a new lease of life by being converted into electro - diesel units, there is potential for the 321s to be used as donors for a Hydrogen powered setup.

 

The key thing is the condition of the bodyshells - if they have a decent life in them (which they should do, being built circa 1990) then as with the D stock,  they could provide a sound platform for further development.

[The Stationmaster]

26 minutes ago, phil-b259 said:

 

One thing to beer in mind is the interest now being shown by the likes of Porterbrook in Hydrogen powered vehicles.

 

Just as the 319s are finding a new lease of life by being converted into electro - diesel units, there is potential for the 321s to be used as donors for a Hydrogen powered setup.

 

The key thing is the condition of the bodyshells - if they have a decent life in them (which they should do, being built circa 1990) then as with the D stock,  they could provide a sound platform for further development.

c.1990 makes them almost 30 years old Phil.  OK so lots of older vehicle body shells have survived far longer than that.  But do modern designs with thinner (usually) steel last as well - are they akin to modern ships which are deliberately built for a comparatively limited life because technology will overtake them?

[phil-b259]

41 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

c.1990 makes them almost 30 years old Phil.  OK so lots of older vehicle body shells have survived far longer than that.  But do modern designs with thinner (usually) steel last as well - are they akin to modern ships which are deliberately built for a comparatively limited life because technology will overtake them?

 

No idea Mike - I guess it all depends on the decisions BR made as to material specifications when they built them.

 

However many folk were pretty dismissive of the D train concept and the 319 tri-mode projects yet both projects have been found to be viable enough to end up with firm orders. A 321 Hydrogen conversion could have similar potential.

[Railpassion]

Thank you for the photos. 

Are you able to photograph the ssignal for the branch please. Photos of this newish signal with the indicator set for the branch are quite rare.

 

 

[Siggie in the east]

The 153's and 156 units are going upto Scotland, apparently to bolster other units and to be converted to hold bikes for commuters.....not unlike a BG from back in the day.

 

[adb968008]

5 hours ago, Siggie in the east said:

The 153's and 156 units are going upto Scotland, apparently to bolster other units and to be converted to hold bikes for commuters.....not unlike a BG from back in the day.

 

Thats not a bad idea..

https://www.railmagazine.com/news/network/scotrail-bike-train-plans-take-shape?image=27331

 

Do Pendolinos, Scotrail sleeper or new Azumas have bicycle spaces so that those with bikes can get them up to Scotland too ?

[beast66606]

Gissing

20 June 2019

66001 and 745102 on 5Q99, 03:43, Ripple Lane Exch Sdgs - Norwich C.PT. T.&R.S.M.D (08:23) - new unit delivery

 

The latest Stansted Express unit is delivered.

 

[beast66606]

7 hours ago, Railpassion said:

Thank you for the photos. 

Are you able to photograph the ssignal for the branch please. Photos of this newish signal with the indicator set for the branch are quite rare.

 

 

 

This one ?

[adb968008]

12 hours ago, Classsix T said:

Not to mention the added complications of air con, or not having it, which brings its own problems. 

 

C6T. 

Theres two rakes of mk3 on preserved railways in service already, indeed the MNR has one of them and recently hosted the other.

Edited June 20, 2019 by adb968008

[Classsix T]

16 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Theres two rakes of mk3 on preserved railways in service already, indeed the MNR has one of them and recently hosted the other.

Quite so, having been a volunteer at the MNR and skinning my knuckles doing the carriage aquisition Chief's bidding, I can assure you that he does intend and has the where with all to keep the rolling stock in working order. And the MNR can hardly be regarded as a steam railway. They'll always have an ets fitted diesel on hand. 

 

C6T. 

[adb968008]

17 minutes ago, Classsix T said:

Quite so, having been a volunteer at the MNR and skinning my knuckles doing the carriage aquisition Chief's bidding, I can assure you that he does intend and has the where with all to keep the rolling stock in working order. And the MNR can hardly be regarded as a steam railway. They'll always have an ets fitted diesel on hand. 

 

C6T. 

Never said it was, “preserved” is the word I used.

 

I think there will be more like the MNR in future. Steam skills, and restoration, even interest has a finite life. Whilst the chocolate boxes that are NYMR, SVR will always be steam, others will bow to the more modern, as the skill, knowledge, interest and cost will be more viable.

 

Many “tourist” or “scenic” lines in the US exist without working steam.similarly those lines have no qualms about running stock without windows too ! So anything is possible.

[justin1985]

Just noticed the following notice in the GreaterAnglia app:

 

As we have now begun a transitionary period during which we will start to introduce new trains into service, the following weekday trains will be operated with a suburban train (not an intercity train) and will therefore have limited First Class seating and no on-board catering :

 

09.03 and 14.00 Norwich to London

11.30 and 16.30 London to Norwich

 

These alterations will apply until further notice and are designed to ensure better service reliability and consistency over a period when we will have frequent operational and fleet changes, as we transfer from one fleet to another. We’re sorry if these alterations cause you any inconvenience, but they have been put in place so customers can plan their journeys with certainty.

 

Presumably this means 321s?

 

Does it also mean these will be the first diagram to switch to 745s? Or is it a case of a MK3 set being taken out of use to make room at Crown Point or something? I'm struggling to see the link!

[nightstar.train]

The 745s have been cleared for service by the ORR, so I expect those services are switching over. I believe the plan is to run a pair (or maybe even 3) 745s coupled together. The 755s will presumably be cleared pretty soon too as they’re very similar. I’m not sure of the PRM compliance level of GAs fleet. I think the original plan was to have complete fleet replacement by the end of this year with the new stock. Obviously the Bombardier units are running significantly behind schedule. In fact everything is, for just about every company. I think whoever’s job it is to sign derogation orders at the ORR (or DfT? I don’t know) will have an RSI come late December. 

[Siggie in the east]

As far as we know from our sources at GA, the 745s (emu's) aren't permitted to run by the ORR yet as they haven't logged enough testing time due to them breaking down and having issues with the overheads. The 755s (bimodes) have been cleared to run by the ORR and will come in on yarmouth, lowestoft and cambridge services out of Norwich.

The suburban units are 321s, most likely to be the referbed sets which have been running 1PXX services for a while now e.g 1P48 8car Liv St-Nor