TSD's Workbench - SECR and Industrial modelling

[TurboSnail]

6 minutes ago, Regularity said:

Every day’s a school day... 

But as you say, it is also about the physics. As modellers we tend to forget that sometimes that is all that determines something on the prototype, so the easiest way to get this right is to study the prototype and copy it.

 

Exactly. My issue is that I generally work from limited drawings or photos, which don't often show inside cabs, so I end up guessing. I shall have to resolve to improve my research skills!

[Regularity]

Some of the basics will apply across the board, so placement of a few key items will always be pretty straightforward.

Mind you, it can range from this:

()

To this:

[burgundy]

These photos from a little single tank, built in the UK in 1862 for a Spanish railway, may offer some ideas about backhead detail.

Or perhaps this

Or perhaps this one from Cork railway station?

Hope this helps

Best wishes

Eric   

[Annie]

Ooooooo love those 19th century detail photos.  Do you have any more photos of the Spanish single driver tank engine?

[Killian keane]

21 hours ago, Annie said:

Ooooooo love those 19th century detail photos.  Do you have any more photos of the Spanish single driver tank engine?

It was discovered by a British rail enthusiast on holiday in Spain in 1962 still working in a sugar mill,  I think the builder might be Jones & Potts though I might be proven wrong on that, the driving wheels have curved spokes 

[Annie]

 What an utterly delightful old survivor.  Thanks very much for the extra information and pictures.  

[TurboSnail]

I've had a productive day - a new CAD model, almost finished! I mean, it is very small, but still. Those who have been to the Middleton Railway in Leeds may recognise it. I visited when I was working in Leeds over the summer, and I've been trying to work out how I'd model it since - the eureka moment was when I did that Land Rover chassis from a few posts ago. I'm now developing that into a 'universal' chassis that I can make with different wheel sizes and wheelbases that I can plonk different bodies on, this loco being the first of those. The chassis is small enough to have opened up some possibilities of really early (1860s onwards) industrial locos, so look out for some of those in the future too.

 

[TurboSnail]

One of the good folks of this parish recently introduced me to the locomotives of Boulton's Siding. Needless to say, I am now having a look at the feasibility of making a fair few of them in OO... Anyone have any particular favourites?

 

For those concerned that I have forgotten about other projects like the SER O class, they are on the back burner for now as I want to use RTR chassis(s), which I don't have the income to purchase at the moment (I'm scraping through my last term of Uni on whatever I can find down the back of the sofa). CAD work is nice and cheap, at least until I want to make it in real life.

[Ruston]

45 minutes ago, TurboSnail said:

One of the good folks of this parish recently introduced me to the locomotives of Boulton's Siding. Needless to say, I am now having a look at the feasibility of making a fair few of them in OO... Anyone have any particular favourites?

 

 

Oh dear, you're in trouble now that you have discovered "The Chronicles". It's like falling down the rabbit hole...

 

Lady Of The Lakes would be a good start. It's a saddle tank that probably started off as a tender loco. Built by E.B. Wilson. 5ft. 3in drivers 3ft. 3in. trailing wheels.

 

[RedGemAlchemist]

13 minutes ago, Ruston said:

Oh dear, you're in trouble now that you have discovered "The Chronicles". It's like falling down the rabbit hole...

 

Lady Of The Lakes would be a good start. It's a saddle tank that probably started off as a tender loco. Built by E.B. Wilson. 5ft. 3in drivers 3ft. 3in. trailing wheels.

 

I like that. Very cute.

[TurboSnail]

46 minutes ago, Ruston said:

Oh dear, you're in trouble now that you have discovered "The Chronicles". It's like falling down the rabbit hole...

 

Lady Of The Lakes would be a good start. It's a saddle tank that probably started off as a tender loco. Built by E.B. Wilson. 5ft. 3in drivers 3ft. 3in. trailing wheels.

 

 

I'm inclined to agree, it's relatively simple too, although the outside frames might be a bit tricky. I'll have to see if I can dig up any more photos to get a look at anything other than the sides.

[Edwardian]

17 hours ago, TurboSnail said:

One of the good folks of this parish recently introduced me to the locomotives of Boulton's Siding. Needless to say, I am now having a look at the feasibility of making a fair few of them in OO... Anyone have any particular favourites?

 

For those concerned that I have forgotten about other projects like the SER O class, they are on the back burner for now as I want to use RTR chassis(s), which I don't have the income to purchase at the moment (I'm scraping through my last term of Uni on whatever I can find down the back of the sofa). CAD work is nice and cheap, at least until I want to make it in real life.

 

O and O1 are of interest. 

 

For RTR chassis, the closest match of which I am aware is:

 

5’2”                  7’3” + 8’3”        GWR Dean (with thicker tyres) and Collett Goods 0-6-0s; GNR J4 /J5 (J3/J4) Class 0-6-0s;

5’2”                  7’4” + 8’2”        SER O/O1 Class 0-6-0

 

I can certainly live with each distance being 1/3 mm out. 

[TurboSnail]

22 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

 

O and O1 are of interest. 

 

For RTR chassis, the closest match of which I am aware is:

 

5’2”                  7’3” + 8’3”        GWR Dean (with thicker tyres) and Collett Goods 0-6-0s; GNR J4 /J5 (J3/J4) Class 0-6-0s;

5’2”                  7’4” + 8’2”        SER O/O1 Class 0-6-0

 

I can certainly live with each distance being 1/3 mm out. 

 

I was planning on using the Oxford Dean Goods, following a conversation on your thread some time ago. Apparently they run nicely, but I haven't got £70-odd quid burning a hole in my pocket at the moment. Even a half-decent 2nd hand Collett is £50-60 from Hattons at the moment.

 

8 minutes ago, AVS1998 said:

 

Wasn't there a Bachmann Pannier that had a close-matching wheelbase, or am I grossly incorrect? As I'm sure the O(1) and R shared a wheelbase, though maybe not a wheel size? Someone's bound to tell me I'm wrong now... 

 

The R and O classes had the same wheel diameter and wheelbase, at least according to one of my books. That's partly why I wanted to get an RTR chassis, so I could have a nice smooth running chassis and just swap the bodies over. 

[Killian keane]

21 hours ago, TurboSnail said:

 

I'm inclined to agree, it's relatively simple too, although the outside frames might be a bit tricky. I'll have to see if I can dig up any more photos to get a look at anything other than the sides.

this is fairly small and low res but it does show the front of the same loco

[RedGemAlchemist]

21 minutes ago, Killian keane said:

this is fairly small and low res but it does show the front of the same loco

Cute. I like it.

[Ruston]

As far as drawings go, almost everything in Boulton's stable is shown in The Chronicles as drawings in various scales, but all rather small. They are also available scaled to 7mm in the Oakwood Press book that was compiled by Mike Sharman.

[TurboSnail]

The book I have is the drawings one, so I don't actually have much background on the loco. I've had a quick look on various sites, but the Chronicles is a little pricey for me right now unfortunately.

[TurboSnail]

Finished the CAD for the tiny Hunslet loco. I'm quite proud of the mechanism on this one, the only compromise I've had to make to the body is the raised section in the cab, circled in blue. It will be a bit quick though, due to the lack of space to fit a big reduction gearset. The spindly cab frame will be made of plastic microstrip as it's folly to attempt to 3D print such a fine structure. The roof and exhaust will also be a separate part to avoid too much support material messing up the details. The closest wheels to the prototype I've found so far are the Markits 10.5mm spoked, 0.5mm too small, but close enough.

 

Unfortunately, it will be a while before I get to build it! No money for new projects at the moment, so I'll just have to content myself with the many other projects I have going on...

 

Edited April 17, 2019 by TurboSnail

[TurboSnail]

Two KCL locos waiting at Broadmead Yard for their next turns of duty.

 

[Edwardian]

Brilliant Tom, brilliant.

 

A unique and distinctive loco stud developing there. 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 19, 2019 by Edwardian

[TurboSnail]

Since it's a lovely day, E.B.Wilson has taken his drawing board outside for the afternoon. Although he is struggling a bit to work out how wide this loco should be. Does anyone know the dimensions of Markits outside cranks (or other manufacturers)? The closest thing I have is a set of Hornby Class 08 wheels.

 

[Ruston]

I've been thinking about scratchbuilding this very loco and have been considering this. I don't know anything about Markits stuff as I don't use it (I dislike that chrome-like finish to the tyres for one thing) but I do know that Alan Gibson do outside cranks. They are made to fit a 1/8th in. dia. axle and I presume the Markits cranks are also for this size. If you look at the photo of the loco, the cranks appear to be very slight things and anything made for a 1/8th axle is going to look too chunky.

 

My own plan was to turn down (or rather get someone to as my own lathe isn't that accurate) some 1/8th axles to have 2mm dia. ends, so cranks that look more the part will fit against the shoulder of the 1/8th in. dia. part. I would, of course, mill the cranks from brass.

[TurboSnail]

43 minutes ago, Ruston said:

I've been thinking about scratchbuilding this very loco and have been considering this. I don't know anything about Markits stuff as I don't use it (I dislike that chrome-like finish to the tyres for one thing) but I do know that Alan Gibson do outside cranks. They are made to fit a 1/8th in. dia. axle and I presume the Markits cranks are also for this size. If you look at the photo of the loco, the cranks appear to be very slight things and anything made for a 1/8th axle is going to look too chunky.

 

My own plan was to turn down (or rather get someone to as my own lathe isn't that accurate) some 1/8th axles to have 2mm dia. ends, so cranks that look more the part will fit against the shoulder of the 1/8th in. dia. part. I would, of course, mill the cranks from brass.

 

It's probable that my loco will be nowhere near the works of art you produce, so I'm not too worried about true scale cranks. That's always something I could remake later down the line when my skills and access to tools improve

 

I usually prefer Scale-link wheels, but they didn't have driving wheels with the correct number of spokes, so I started looking at Markits. I've since checked and Markits don't do the correct size trailing wheels, so I've gone back to Scale-link for now. I have enough trouble with quartering even with Scale-link wheels, so I'm a little scared of Gibson wheels!

[TurboSnail]

Mr Wilson has been busy over the last couple of days. There are a few overscale buts due to the limitations of 3D printing of course. All the widths are just educated guesses based on other locos and a guess at approximate width of the outside cranks. Likewise, the smokebox front, bufferbeam details and spectacle plate position are approximated from that one rather indistinct photo posted by Killian a few posts ago - searches for further photos or info have drawn a blank.

 

The chassis has the driving wheels rigid with pickups, and the trailing wheels free to move up and down and side to side, using exactly the same system as my Neilson 2-2-2T's trailing wheels, which worked well.

 

[TurboSnail]

I realised this morning that I forgot to finish the Hudswell Clarke loco I started a while back - so it now has a chimney and cab interior detail (based off the discussion a page or two ago, so it should be relatively accurate this time!). I've stuck it on Shapeways for the time being, along with the other locos I've designed for the Electrotren 0-6-0 chassis, until such a time as I can start printing more economically in Resin again (if anyone does want one, I may be able to get it done, but it won't be cheap!).

 

This will hopefully become the brute of the workforce on my future layout - I'm considering the idea of running in two eras, based on the mainline stock I have, namely 1900-1914 and 1945-1949. This loco would fit the latter quite nicely I reckon, not sure how early I could go with it though - any ideas?