Hornby track; why not?

[RexAshton]

Plastic frogs will only lead to tears if you run small locos. Otherwise most if not all current manufacturers code 100 track can be made to work together.

[crompton 33]

You will find most model clubs DON'T use Hornby track  on there Exhibition layouts.  They use Peco code 75 or finescale track.  It's your layout and code 100 track . I recommend Peco track in any scale .

[Captain Kernow]

Here are some thoughts.

 

Apart from the various arguments to the effect that Peco track is of better build quality than Hornby (personally I agree with this) and that you can get more realistic geometric formations out of Peco (again, true), the first question I would ask is this - is any of your Hornby track made using steel rail? If it is, I would personally run a mile, screaming, away from it, straight to the nearest supplier of Peco nickel silver track. If you live near the sea or in an area where atmospheric conditions might affect steel rail, this is even more of a concern. I just don't like the fact that steel rusts. Yes, nickel silver rail can tarnish, but you can clean and polish it or maybe just use some kind of thinners to keep the rail top clean.

 

Think about this with regard to the build quality of Peco verses Hornby. You've admittedly saved a bit of money by using Hornby track on parts of the layout. Let's say, for sake of argument, that you've laid the Hornby track in a scenic section, you've ballasted it and weathered it and you're happy with what you've done. You start running trains over this Hornby track. Then, after a few weeks or months (or years, perhaps), the lesser quality points suffer some kind of failure. You have to take it up, disrupting the layout and undoing work that you did originally and to cap it all, due to the geometry, you have probably got to replace that failed point with another, identical Hornby product, that might also cause problems further down the line. The Peco product is much more reliable and the availability of live frogs will definitely, definitely improve train running qualities, especially if short wheelbase locos are being used.

 

Here's another thought - you might be able to sell your Hornby track on EBay or similar and perhaps find some good quality Peco from the same source, thus saving money?

 

Good luck, either way.

Edited July 27, 2018 by Captain Kernow

[ddoherty958]

Here are some thoughts.

 

Apart from the various arguments to the effect that Peco track is of better build quality than Hornby (personally I agree with this) and that you can get more realistic geometric formations out of Peco (again, true), the first question I would ask is this - is any of your Hornby track made using steel rail? If it is, I would personally run a mile, screaming, away from it, straight to the nearest supplier of Peco nickel silver track. If you live near the sea or in an area where atmospheric conditions might affect steel rail, this is even more so.

 

Think about this with regard to the build quality of Peco verses Hornby. You've admittedly saved a bit of money by using Hornby track on parts of the layout. Let's say, for sake of argument, that you've laid the Hornby track in a scenic section, you've ballasted it and weathered it and you're happy with what you've done. You start running trains over this Hornby track. Then, after a few weeks or months (or years, perhaps), the lesser quality points suffer some kind of failure. You have to take it up, disrupting the layout and undoing work that you did originally and to cap it all, due to the geometry, you have probably got to replace that failed point with another, identical Hornby product, that might also cause problems further down the line. The Peco product is much more reliable and the availability of live frogs will definitely, definitely improve train running qualities, especially if short wheelbase locos are being used.

 

Here's another thought - you might be able to sell your Hornby track on EBay or similar and perhaps find some good quality Peco from the same source, thus saving money?

 

Good luck, either way.

I have heard the horror stories of Hornby steel rail. I would run that mile with you. No, all my track is nickel. I’ve decided to keep the Hornby track and just use flexitrack for the special areas. A bit of weathering and you can’t tell anyway. Saves selling everything and buying it all again.

[brianusa]

Quote: <If you live near the sea or in an area where atmospheric conditions might affect steel rail, this is even more of a concern. I just don't like the fact that steel rusts.>

 

Believe it; after Dawlish the Capt'n knows exactly what he is talking about!

 

Brian.

[Butler Henderson]

The curved points as pointed (pun intended) out in Model Rail recently have a section with a curved rail parallel to a straight rail with consequence that the gauge is onarrower than 16.5mm  Think it may be both the Peco Setrack and Hornby varieties.

Edited July 27, 2018 by Butler Henderson

[cctransuk]

... have a section with a curved rail parallel to a straight rail ...

 

Nope - that's geometrically impossible; (read definition of 'parallel') !!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[Matt]

To offer an alternative perspective on steel rail...

 

I agree that if it is a damp environment (shed, loft, basement), or if the layout to be used at exhibition (where humidity is a problem often) then steel rail will rust. However, for a home, house based layout steel is fine and has some advantages.  True it is more difficult to solder BUT the material looks more realistic (no yellowish hue) and the material is naturally less "slippy" so that your locomotives can get more grip.  I use steel code 82 rail in my exactoscale track and it does seem to help with my full scale length trains on slight gradients.  Its not for all but I wouldn't just write steel off...

 

As far as Code 100 track concerned - I have used both extensively in fiddle yards and, put it this way, I will only buy Peco points going forward.  The difference on straight / curved track is minimal in my experience and I normally pick up whatever is cheapest / available.  For rail joiners and track pins though - Hornby every time - their rail joiners are tighter so hold the rail more secure and seem not to slacken off over time which Peco can, reducing electrical continuity. 

 

Matt

[Legend]

Nope - that's geometrically impossible; (read definition of 'parallel') !!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Yes I wondered about that. Bottom line is though that these curved points just caused derailments with me . Shame because I could have done with crossovers on the curves giving more space in my station for running round a train , however they were just so much hassle I decided to sacrifice longer trains for better running .

 

Nothing wrong with using Hornby track(as others have pointed out not the old steel stuff) . It’s your layout , do what you want . There is a lot to be said for consistent running and Setrack, with the exception of the curved points, usually delivers that. I was only pointing out that the Peco equivalent tends to be less expensive if buying new. If you get the chance go for the larger radius 3rd and 4th . Better running and they look better too

 

Have fun with the layout . After all that’s really what it’s all about.

[JDW]

From my own experience, I use Peco because there was a wider range of points available when I built my layout, and also that I found some - most - Lima locos wouldn't run well through Hornby small radius points and would often derail if running with the non powered bogie leading.  Of course with the benefit of age and hindsight, adjusting the back to back measurements might have helped, but the easiest solution was to banish Hornby points to the parts of the fiddle yard only used by DMUs and replace those used by locos with Peco ones.

[Butler Henderson]

Nope - that's geometrically impossible; (read definition of 'parallel') !!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Ok adjacent to then. Whatever the simple fact is that the curved points do not meet basic OO standards - the narrowing of the gauge at best shows up as the train slowing and at worse derailing. Properly designed setrack curved points are long overdue and if someone did a 3rd-4th it might be worthwhile doing a live frog version as well.; which also goes for the Setrack Y which in Peco Streamline terms is the missing Medium Y.

Edited July 30, 2018 by Butler Henderson

[The Johnster]

I agree, Butler; let's hope the Peco bullhead range comes up with some.  My Hornby 4th/3rd curved works ok, but the standard of construction does not inspire confidence and I would not attempt to propel through it unless I had to, even trailing.  It feeds on the  3rd radius side to fiddle yard roads used by the pickup and it's traffic, all short wheelbase wagons and, apart from the toads, I wouldn't attempt anything longer.  The minerals are even more suitable, to the extent of a scale foot, but are too long as trains for these roads.

 

Despite the longest dead frog on the layout, however, the locos run smoothly over it!

Edited July 29, 2018 by The Johnster

[frobisher]

My Hornby 4th/3rd curved works ok, but the standard of construction does not inspire confidence and I would not attempt to propel through it unless I had to, even trailing.

Er, Hornby never produced such a point. R8074 and R8075 are constructed with a combination of 2nd radius curves and straight sections. If they were 3rd /4th I suspect that they would work a whole lot better.

[DCB]

I have a lot of steel rail, Peco, Hornby, GT,etc and never really had any issues with rust except when I laid some sidings with steel in the garden. N/S seems to tarnish quicker and looks yellowy so I keep it for outdoors.

Hornby points are OK for 1950s Hornby, 1990s Hornby and Thomas The Tank engine.   They are marginal for some Bachmann and the Hattons 14XX can't cope with them. Too sharp nominal 2nd radius but

1st radius in places. Same applies to Peco Set Track. The Flange ways are too shallow for 1950s/60s Triang.

The points can be improved by live frogging them but they look horrible compared to Peco, and the old 2nd radius curved is truly magnificent in its awfulness. I think the later one is 3rd radius, equally sawing off a chunk can get the track spacing down from 60mm to the 50/52mm Streamline centres or even the 44mm I sometimes use.

The Hornby sleeper base is better than  Peco in my opinion and I use 2nd/3rd/4th even 1st radius Hornby curves with streamline points as flexi does not like to be curved below about 2ft radius and protests by going dog leggy if you do and I also use the 26" and 13" straights for main lines on small layouts where they have to look dead straight as I find flexi always seems to have a bit of a tendency to d a sine wave rather than a straight line.

Horses for courses. Peco Streamline for serious layouts, Peco Set track for small layouts, Hornby points for small children and Thomas the Tank, and Triang / Hornby Super 4 for playing with your trains on the living room floor.   Oh and Bullhead for the polished wood plinth you have on the mantle piece where keep your latest Chinese acquisition

[davetheroad]

You can't make a gentle sweeping curve with anybody's "corners" (fixed radius curved tracks), you have to use somebody's (not necessarily Peco's) flexitrack.

 

I'm sure I will now be told someone makes 6' radius setrack curves …….. 

 

No 6 foot radius curves but Shinohara make 2 foot to 3 foot in 2 inch increments. You have to buy a full circle though

[hallmodelspares]

Any thoughts on old lima style track in steel and nickel silver?

[DCB]

Any thoughts on old lima style track in steel and nickel silver?

Same as Hornby, more brittle but better (brass?) Fishplates

[Finsbury]

I'm thick as mince, but not as useful. But regarding this whole yellow business. OK my eyes aren't the 20/20 sharpshooters they once were, but here I can at least offer evidence!

 

(Gameshow host voice) "And our first lady strolling in with bendy P4 timbers.... followed up by a cheeky buggeration of a 1 in 9! Oh look, viewers, here's the star of the show on the right, some Hornby!"

Yellow?

 

Bern

[Big James]

I’m in the same boat I’ve always used Hornby points. And after repeatedly having to replace broken points I’m now running a rolling replacement program. As a point fails I replace it with a peco equivalent except in the fiddle yard mainly because the points haven’t failed yet. But I have to admit the peco points and track feel more robust compred to the Hornby equivalent.

 

Big James