Dowlais Ironworks Class D 0-4-0T cut 'n' shut

[Ruston]

I know that I said I wasn't going to build any new engines until I had something for them to run on... Well, laser-cut baseboards are on order, so something is happening in that direction but there's time for another quickie build until they arrive.

 

The Dowlais Ironworks locomotives have been discussed here - http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/109959-dowlais-ironworks-locomotives/ and this build relates to the Class D engines, built at the works. The basis of the model is the 0-4-0T made by Hornby.

 

(photo from Hattons website)

 

It's nothing more than a toy train in every way - massive wide flanges on wheels that are too large, powered by a motor and gearing that allows a scale top speed that would put Mallard to shame. The body is too long and too wide and the whole thing is so light (79g) that it couldn't pull the skin off of a rice pudding.

 

Comparing the model with a scale drawing I found that the boiler, firebox and cab need shortening. The first two are fairly easy and involve only four cuts but the last is a bit sketchy and so I have decided to leave it as it is, making my model a scale 6 ins. too long but far better than Hornby's 2ft. 8in. over-length.

 

The smokebox and smokebox saddle are also too long but fixing those would be a major hassle and if I were going to those lengths I would build the whole lot from scratch but that's not the aim here - I just want a relatively easy and quick build that ends up looking and performing better than the base model.

 

After a couple of hours this evening cutting, sanding, filing and spraying I now have this:

The boiler/smokebox and cab handrails have been removed and the thick base on which the bodywork is moulded has been sanded down to a nearer scale width.

 

I have looked in my spares stash and there are two sets of Gibson 3ft. 6in. dia. driving wheels, an N20 motor and a set of spur and crown wheels to suit, so I appear to have everything that is required to get on with it.

 

 

[Ruston]

[Barclay]

Great job already - I hope my own cut 'n' shut looks that good. I think you're right not to worry about the odd mm. or you're going to end up making the whole thing from scratch, which isn't the point at all !

[Osgood]

Looks like you've captured the ugliness of the real thing to a tee.......

[Ruston]

Oh, I wouldn't say they're ugly. They're definitely strange though; almost as if the designer had pretentions of being a main line railway designer. Everything is out of proportion - the massive boiler, and that Belpaire firebox? In a loco with cylinders of the same dimensions of a Peckett W4..

 

New chassis and old. I have made all the components for the brake gear, well I did but two brake blocks have gone AWOL, along with a cab step backplate. I had a quick look on the floor and couldn't see them so will make new ones. It's far quicker when dealing with tiny parts to make new ones than it is to spend hours scouring the floor of the shed for them. That's one advantage of having one's own pantograph miller over having things etched.

 

The fluted rods are a first for me and were a bit on the experimental side but have come out well enough (although the flash means they don't show in the pic). Before painting the frames and wheels I had the motor in and the wheels and rods on to test it. Another thing that has gone AWOL is one of the plunger pickups. I bought a set of 10 from Alan Gibson. Six were used on Hercules and so now the build is stopped until I get some more. I spent ages searching the floor to no avail. It may not even be on the floor as I never saw or heard it drop. One minute I'm measuring the diameter of the plastic bit and then I put it down. The next minute it's vanished, simply vanished; like an old oak table...

[88D]

Looks like you've captured the ugliness of the real thing to a tee.......

Ugly?..!!!? where are you from? Norfolk?

[Gibbo675]

Oh, I wouldn't say they're ugly. They're definitely strange though; almost as if the designer had pretentions of being a main line railway designer. Everything is out of proportion - the massive boiler, and that Belpaire firebox? In a loco with cylinders of the same dimensions of a Peckett W4..

 

Is the motor you are using the N20 type and if so what reduction gearbox is it fitted with and would I be right in thinking the motors run at 12000 rpm when given the beans hence the reduction?

 

I should like to know as I thinking of attempting to motorise a Dapol Rocket kit with an N20 type that has a 1mm shaft without the reduction box and don't really want it doing 200 mph scale speed.

 

Gibbo.

[Ruston]

Is the motor you are using the N20 type and if so what reduction gearbox is it fitted with and would I be right in thinking the motors run at 12000 rpm when given the beans hence the reduction?

 

I should like to know as I thinking of attempting to motorise a Dapol Rocket kit with an N20 type that has a 1mm shaft without the reduction box and don't really want it doing 200 mph scale speed.

 

Gibbo.

I have no idea what rpm they can run up to but I have a bare N20 motor fitted to a High Level 60:1 gearbox in an RT Models Manning Wardle K and it runs slow enough.

 

Plasticard buffer beams made and fitted. The moulded handrail around the smokebox front, and the smokebox door handles, have been cut off to be replaced with metal items.Does anyone make handrail posts in nickel silver? It would be nice to have them, and the rails themselves, made from this material as it would look better than painting them to a polished metal finish.

Edited August 3, 2018 by Ruston

[Osgood]

Maybe the model boat chandlers?

[The Johnster]

One would ask why Dowlais built their own locos when everybody else was using more or less standard industrial designs bought in, and while I have no real idea as to the answer to this question, this sort of thing is usually down to the works having particular requirements for one or more movements that the standard off the shelf locos of the time could not provide an answer to at a reasonable cost.  Looking at the 0-4-0, the stumpiness suggests to me a loco that needed a big boiler to work hard for a short time, along with an efficient firebox to raise steam quickly; water capacity is not the most important feature of the loco and a saddle tank can be dispensed with.  Why inside cylinders are chosen I cannot imagine, but running steadiness may be a factor.  

 

Perhaps a duty that involved long periods in light steam waiting for the next job, then a short sharp burst of effort, followed by more waiting.

 

All this is pure speculation on my part and I am probably completely wrong!  But it's an odd little engine, very modern looking for 1907 and a very suitable outline for an RTR industrial in the 'Nellie/Polly' genre.  One hopes that the age of such toys is over with the presence of Hornby's Peckett and Hattons' Andrew Barclay, which at least have proper cylinders and motion, but there will probably always be a train set home for these sort of engines, along with Smokey Joe.  They are easy for children's hands to deal with and tough as old boots, with few parts to fall/break off.

[Arthur]

 

I think that you maybe over analysing the reasons an industrial concern built their own locomotives. I suspect that rather than it being down to demanding a design to a specific requirement it was simply that they had the ability, the workshop capacity and knowledge, so why pay somebody else to do something you can do yourself.

 

Move beyond locomotives and many large industrial concerns kept the design and manufacture of much equipment and plant, sometimes very large plant (e.g. blast furnaces), in house.

 

These days equipment and plant is generally more complex and specialised, most industries have slimmed down to their core business, so they buy in rather than self build.

 

.

 

.

[Ruston]

The frames are almost finished. I need to fit the rods and wire up the pickups to the motor and that's it. I have fixed a pair of scrap connecting rods inside the frames to provide some distraction froml the hole in the frame plates. Obviously they're not going to move but who's going to notice that when it's running? I may yet put in some smaller bits and pieces as a stationary representation of the valve gear.

The next thing to do will be making a cab interior. I don't think I'll go to town on that, what with it being and enclosed cab and all but it definitely needs something - there's not even a floor in the bodyshell! On the other hand I may do a more detailed cab interior but it will all be fiction as I don't have any photos of the insides. I guess making it look roughly like some sort of main line shunter that has a Belpaire firebox will do. A 3F Jinty ,or something?

[avonside1563]

One would ask why Dowlais built their own locos when everybody else was using more or less standard industrial designs bought in, and while I have no real idea as to the answer to this question, this sort of thing is usually down to the works having particular requirements for one or more movements that the standard off the shelf locos of the time could not provide an answer to at a reasonable cost.  Looking at the 0-4-0, the stumpiness suggests to me a loco that needed a big boiler to work hard for a short time, along with an efficient firebox to raise steam quickly; water capacity is not the most important feature of the loco and a saddle tank can be dispensed with.  Why inside cylinders are chosen I cannot imagine, but running steadiness may be a factor.  

 

Perhaps a duty that involved long periods in light steam waiting for the next job, then a short sharp burst of effort, followed by more waiting.

 

All this is pure speculation on my part and I am probably completely wrong!  But it's an odd little engine, very modern looking for 1907 and a very suitable outline for an RTR industrial in the 'Nellie/Polly' genre.  One hopes that the age of such toys is over with the presence of Hornby's Peckett and Hattons' Andrew Barclay, which at least have proper cylinders and motion, but there will probably always be a train set home for these sort of engines, along with Smokey Joe.  They are easy for children's hands to deal with and tough as old boots, with few parts to fall/break off.

Shelton Steel Works in Stoke-on-Trent built several of their own locomotives based on earlier Andrew Barclay machines. Presumably they thought 'we can do that' so did. However they must have decided that it was simpler/cheaper to buy off the shelf products from the usual industrial locomotive builders as they returned to buying new locos.

[Ruston]

Rods on, wired-up and running. The front steps are fitted to the bodyshell but until it gets a floor in the cab there isn't anything to fix the cab steps to. The floor will be put in tomorrow evening and I'll have a go at making a firebox backhead for it. I had thought about buying in a casting that could be adapted to fit but I want to crack on with it and not to spend too much money on it. The base model cost just £12 from ebay and I have a buyer lined up for the old chassis for £10!

The buffers are sprung buffers, sold as Bachmann spare parts. Handrail posts are on order from Alan Gibson and I think I have a set of smokebox door handles somewhere. Name, works and mumber plates are needed and then it's time to think about lining.

 

Does anyone know of any other of these engines that have been done by anyone in 4mm, or any other scale?

[NeilHB]

That really does look great Ruston - a very nice looking model!

 

I don’t think I’ve ever seen one modelled accurately before - have seen one unmodified mounted on an 0-6-0 chassis which with the original proportions of the body didn’t look too odd.

[88D]

That really does look great Ruston - a very nice looking model!

I don’t think I’ve ever seen one modelled accurately before - have seen one unmodified mounted on an 0-6-0 chassis which with the original proportions of the body didn’t look too odd.

I think Dowlais did have six-coupled versions of this loco; and, yes, they did look better.

[Osgood]

Only this morning achieved access to a more detailed description of the livery (from John Owen's 'The History of The Dowlais Iron Works 1759 -1970):

 

Smokebox, saddle, chimney, running plates - gloss black

Boiler, bunker sides, back - medium green with broad black band having finer yellow line between black and green

Cab side sheets, roof - bordered by broad band with finer yellow line innermost

Dome, safety valve cover - in the same green

Whistles, window framings - polished brass

Valves, under frame, guard irons and plates, step black plates - green with yellow lining

Steps - black

Sandboxes - green unlined

Brake hangers, shoes - unlined black

Wheels - green with black tyres and yellow line between black and green

Buffer beams, stocks - red bordered in black and lined in yellow

Name, number, works plates - raised brass edges and characters on black background

All brass lightly polished

Coupling rods, handrails, smokebox door handles and hinges, buffer heads, couplings, seating ring behind smokebox door - polished steel

 

Probably just too late for you!

 

Tony

Edited August 9, 2018 by Osgood

[Ruston]

Only this morning achieved access to a more detailed description of the livery (from John Owen's 'The History of The Dowlais Iron Works 1759 -1970):

 

Smokebox, saddle, chimney, running plates - gloss black

Boiler, bunker sides, back - medium green with broad black band having finer yellow line between black and green

Cab side sheets, roof - bordered by broad band with finer yellow line innermost

Dome, safety valve cover - in the same green

Whistles, window framings - polished brass

Valves, under frame, guard irons and plates, step black plates - green with yellow lining

Steps - black

Sandboxes - green unlined

Brake hangers, shoes - unlined black

Wheels - green with black tyres and yellow line between black and green

Buffer beams, stocks - red bordered in black and lined in yellow

Name, number, works plates - raised brass edges and characters on black background

All brass lightly polished

Coupling rods, handrails, smokebox door handles and hinges, buffer heads, couplings, seating ring behind smokebox door - polished steel

 

Probably just too late for you!

 

Tony

Thanks. Not too late for all of that but some of those things are beyond me such as a line of yellow on the wheels and step backplates, and the polished steel seating ring on the smokebox door. It's going to have the economy version of that livery.

 

Boiler backhead ready for painting. Pipes will be added after fitting.

Firehole door operating levers have been added since this photo.

[Ruston]

It's not the best boiler backhead ever but it's good enough for what can actually be seen through the cab doorway.

[Ruston]

That really does look great Ruston - a very nice looking model!

 

I don’t think I’ve ever seen one modelled accurately before - have seen one unmodified mounted on an 0-6-0 chassis which with the original proportions of the body didn’t look too odd.

Class D No.44 was rebuilt to an 0-6-0 but in the photo that I have seen it still looks the same above the running plate, except for the front sand boxes having been replaced with rectangular ones and placed on the running plate, either side of the smokebox saddle. Iit doesn't look to have been lengthened, so the stock Hornby body on an 0-6-0 chassis would still be wrong but I guess it wouldn't be so obvious.

Edited August 10, 2018 by Ruston
Some of the letters have rubbed off my keyboard!

[Ruston]

In the words of Britney Spears... Oops, I did it again.

 

I never knew that the LNER were buying shunting engines from Guest, Keen & Nettlefold!

I picked this up at the Skipton exhibition, this morning. Do I do it as Queen Mary, or make it an 0-6-0 and do it as No.44 Pant?

The other one was indicated in the box packaging as being Hornby, Margate. The smokebox end was a seperate part and there was a brass helicoil insert in the plastic bodyshell to take the machine screw that fixes the body to the chassis. On this one the smokebox front and the rest of the body are all one moulded piece, along with a moulded extension undeneath to take a self-tapper. Standards were evidently slipping by the time this one was shipped from some Chinese sweatshop.

 

I also bought a neat little mitre box for just £2.79, from Squires. The loco body is a nice tight fit in it. If I'd had this a few weeks ago, instead of relying on a steady hand and marking with masking tape, I'd have taken that extra couple of mil out of the cab on the other one. As it is, this one will have to be the same as I'll want them to match.

[Caledonian]

In the words of Britney Spears... Oops, I did it again.

 

I never knew that the LNER were buying shunting engines from Guest, Keen & Nettlefold!

DowlaisBuild-010.jpg

I picked this up at the Skipton exhibition, this morning. Do I do it as Queen Mary, or make it an 0-6-0 and do it as No.44 Pant?

 

 

I'd do it as an 0-6-0, it'll make a nice contrast to the 0-4-0

[Ruston]

I'd do it as an 0-6-0, it'll make a nice contrast to the 0-4-0

I've had another look at the photo of Pant and it's going to be too much work. I initially thought that the length had stayed the same in the conversion to 0-6-0 but it now appears that the bunker was lengthened, as was the smokebox. That means the frames are longer and so I would have to make new frame patterns where I thought I could get away with changing the spacing of the axle holes and adding one on the existing pattern.

[Corbs]

Ah, I was going to ask if the Hornby model better matched the 0-6-0T but from your description it seems like the length is in completely different areas!

 

Superb work on the 0-4-0T, have never seen one of these realistically modelled before.

[RedGemAlchemist]

Superb work on the 0-4-0T, have never seen one of these realistically modelled before.

Me either, and it's about time too that these quirky industrials got a proper model treatment, or at least better than Hornby's take.

Edited August 13, 2018 by RedGemAlchemist