Wentworth Junction

[Enterprisingwestern]

"Proper" metal Ian Macdonald hoppers?

 

MIke.

[Barry O]

"Proper" metal Ian Macdonald hoppers?

 

MIke.

Life is too short.. (for me at least)..

Baz

[Michael Edge]

Tracklaying started now, I can put two baseboards at a time in one of the bedrooms (no grandchildren expected to be staying for a few weeks).

Starting at the Wath end this is the last fiddle yard board and the first corner of WJ

T

The LOR turnback siding on the right is going to have to be made removable or the pantographs aren't going to get underneath it. The points below this present an interesting problem, for Herculaneum Dock this is the end of the fiddle yard for the Dock railway but for WJ it's the up running line. For the dock railway this is wired DCC but for WJ it has to be part of the up link, I didn't want to put a switch on here to avoid the inevitable result of it being thrown by accident. The answer was to wire the appropriate connections in the plug on the WJ corner board, this switches everything over when it is connected, the points don't have to be worked for WJ. I'm wiring this up as I go along so as each board goes back in the shed it should be possible to run trains.

Fiddle yard board back in the shed and the next WJ board bolted up, the hole at the near end is for the Tortoise operating wire to first point of the junction. The curve in the background where the two test coaches are standing is sharper than I would have liked at 39" radius but we never have enough space. It will mean the overhead portals being a lot closer together than they should be, there's a similar curve at the other end but that one is in a deep cutting and may not be so noticeable.

 

The new Peco track seems to glue down well enough with No More Nails and I'm using the new Peco fishplates as seen here. Amazingly after Peco finally produced 4mm scale 00 gauge track they also managed to produce scale length fishplates which actually grip the rail, not to mention the bolt head detail - so for the first time ever, I'm using Peco track.

[Michael Edge]

Tracklaying continues.

 

 

First chunk of pointwork now added, under the tiebar is a 16mm diameter hole for the Tortoise operating wire, two strips of paper either side to cover most of the hole. This is a lot easier and quicker than making a slot for the wire. Why do they supply such feeble wire with these point motors? It usually needs replacing with .7mm or .8mm piano wire.

 

 

 

This is the drilling jig for Tortoise motors, the wire fits in the hole in the centre of the tiebar.

 

 

the jig is held in place and the four holes are drilled from the top.

 

[St Enodoc]

12 hours ago, Michael Edge said:

Why do they supply such feeble wire with these point motors? It usually needs replacing with .7mm or .8mm piano wire.

Cobalts come with 0.8mm as standard.

 

Just saying...

 

Nice signals by the way.

[Michael Edge]

Last photo from the temporary use of the back bedroom (required for its normal purpose this week).

Two baseboards are a tight squeeze in here, one of the beds had to be tipped up to make room to get past. First groups of pointwork laid, wire and tested now. The next group will straddle the next baseboard joint so that will have to wait a bit, Templot drawing set out to make sure everything will be in the right position.

Up corner board and first board now assembled in the shed, trains can now run on to it from the fiddle yard using the link switches.

 

More wiring work done in the shed with the board on its side on a table, much easier than grovelling on the floor underneath. Wires and point motors labelled as I go along now.

 

Tidied a bit and plug attached, the black wire is the point motor common, the green wire sets points to normal, the yellow wire sets them reversed. This is the system I devised for Carlisle with split potential wiring from two transformers.

 

Appropriately an O4 is the first loco to run on the new layout, this would be a returning banker tender first on the up line, it will reverse over the crossover and slip to get back to the banker siding.

[innocentman]

31 minutes ago, Michael Edge said:

Last photo from the temporary use of the back bedroom (required for its normal purpose this week).

Two baseboards are a tight squeeze in here, one of the beds had to be tipped up to make room to get past. First groups of pointwork laid, wire and tested now. The next group will straddle the next baseboard joint so that will have to wait a bit, Templot drawing set out to make sure everything will be in the right position.

Up corner board and first board now assembled in the shed, trains can now run on to it from the fiddle yard using the link switches.

 

More wiring work done in the shed with the board on its side on a table, much easier than grovelling on the floor underneath. Wires and point motors labelled as I go along now.

 

Tidied a bit and plug attached, the black wire is the point motor common, the green wire sets points to normal, the yellow wire sets them reversed. This is the system I devised for Carlisle with split potential wiring from two transformers.

 

Appropriately an O4 is the first loco to run on the new layout, this would be a returning banker tender first on the up line, it will reverse over the crossover and slip to get back to the banker siding.

 

Can I recommend some of these

 

https://www.screwfix.com/p/2-way-adhesive-base-natural-19-x-19mm-pack-of-100/36085

 

St Enodoc's usual disclaimer applies

 

Andy

Edited February 19, 2019 by innocentman

[Michael Edge]

I've tried this sort of thing before and they always dropped off in the shed - probably the damp atmosphere in winter. Since then I've been using large cable ties pinned under the boards but I'll do this later when all the wiring is in place.

[St Enodoc]

3 hours ago, Michael Edge said:

Tidied a bit and plug attached, the black wire is the point motor common, the green wire sets points to normal, the yellow wire sets them reversed. This is the system I devised for Carlisle with split potential wiring from two transformers.

Looking good Mike.

 

Not sure that I follow what you are saying about split potential. I do that (+9V/0V/-9V) and I only need two wires to the motor - one common and one from the centre pole of the switch. Am I missing something?

[Enterprisingwestern]

3 hours ago, innocentman said:

 

Can I recommend some of these

 

https://www.screwfix.com/p/2-way-adhesive-base-natural-19-x-19mm-pack-of-100/36085

 

St Enodoc's usual disclaimer applies

 

Andy

 

54 minutes ago, Michael Edge said:

I've tried this sort of thing before and they always dropped off in the shed - probably the damp atmosphere in winter. Since then I've been using large cable ties pinned under the boards but I'll do this later when all the wiring is in place.

 

Bloody useless foam pads are the problem, glue about as sticky as ant spit. I peel the pads off and give em a dose of no nails or similar, even when not using them under baseboards.

 

Mike.

[innocentman]

1 hour ago, Michael Edge said:

I've tried this sort of thing before and they always dropped off in the shed - probably the damp atmosphere in winter. Since then I've been using large cable ties pinned under the boards but I'll do this later when all the wiring is in place.

 

I screw them to the board (belt and braces). Have a look under Chapel on Friday

[Michael Edge]

2 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

Looking good Mike.

 

Not sure that I follow what you are saying about split potential. I do that (+9V/0V/-9V) and I only need two wires to the motor - one common and one from the centre pole of the switch. Am I missing something?

This is the power supply wiring from the transformers, there are only two wires to each motor. The two transformers are in the middle of the fiddle yard, power needs to run round to the WJ control panel.

[Michael Edge]

Back to work on Wentworth Junction now.

The snag on a round and round layout with a gradient is that what goes up must come down.....

The fiddle yard needs to mirror the gradient at the front of the layout but in rather less length because the line into the pit has to join in somewhere near the control panel.

For the moment this is being done with packing under the legs and a 65mm high platform to stand the lifting section on.

 

Next job is to test that trains can be hauled up the gradient in the fiddle yard, at least the coal trains are empty in this direction.

 

 

A selection of trains lined up in the loops, the WD 2-8-0 is on a "half train" of 30 wagons, the J11 has 18 empties for the pit, the EB1 (only electric loco available at the moment) on my entire stock of 21T and 24T wagons (not many) and the 04 is on a steel train about the same length as the 30 wagon one.

All these were lifted successfully up the gradient with no slipping, my J10 was equally happy with the pit trip.

 

 

Thirty more coal wagons added to the half train, sixty plus brake van is a full train. I won't have enough room to run this in the down direction but one will fit in the longest fiddle yard loop. Much to my surprise none of the 2-8-0s had any difficulty with this train, the EB1 couldn't manage it but it doesn't have much weight, the EM1s will be a lot heavier. One loco was normal on these empty trains although in all electric operation a banker returning to Wombwell might be attached. A daily class A tank wagon train was the only up one which had to be double headed to avoid pinning down brakes, normal practice on all other trains. Fully fitted trains were a rarity on this line.

With essential tests complete I need to build the rest of the pointwork now.

[St Enodoc]

Good to see progress again Mike. As I read it my thoughts were drawn to Clydach Yard...

[Michael Edge]

It's not as steep as that but wagons will roll away if they don't have a loco attached.

[Barry O]

Strangely enough I happened across a box of 21T wagons today. Are BR 24.5T ones any use?

 

Looks very good . Do we need brake Van's with brakes again?

Baz

[Michael Edge]

Yes, there were trains of 24T, I've not found so many 21T though. Mostly I was using all the coal wagons I have, at the back of the 60 wagon train there are 12 NCB wagons from Cwmafon. There were full trains of 21T hoppers and coke hoppers. We will need some more empty steel wagons, most probably full trains of BoBols going back to Sheffield/Rotherham etc.

Most of my brake vans are still stiff running but I'm not sure we need them, one brake van at a time, staying with the loco, on the pit branch. I think we'll probably have to use just the kickback sidings at the end near the turntable for the fulls/empties at the pit.

[Michael Edge]

Last section of pointwork now on the bench, first the Templot drawing with double sided tape along the track centres.

 

 

 

Timbers added

 

 

The start of the long and tedious job of adding the chair bases. For the track purists these are somewhat generic but the main purpose was to raise the rail above timber height while maintaining solid (and adjustable) rail soldering. If there is enough interest in these we would be happy to put them into production, I've not worked out the cost yet though.

One of the tiebars is uncomfortably close to the baseboard joint (line starting from the end of the scalpel handle) here, I don't mind splitting the pointwork like this but fitting the motor isn't going to be easy.

 

Finally (for now) the S1/3 has progressed to the paintshop, photos of 69901 fully assembled and grit blasted below.

 

 

[St Enodoc]

11 hours ago, Michael Edge said:

One of the tiebars is uncomfortably close to the baseboard joint (line starting from the end of the scalpel handle) here, I don't mind splitting the pointwork like this but fitting the motor isn't going to be easy.

How about putting a crank in the operating wire?

[Michael Edge]

I think it might be too close to the baseboard end for that even though it's only 9mm ply.

[St Enodoc]

2 hours ago, Michael Edge said:

I think it might be too close to the baseboard end for that even though it's only 9mm ply.

Hmm, how close are you to the baseboard edge at the bottom of the photo? As there is a slight angle between the tiebar and the baseboard joint you might just get enough space if you move the motor towards the edge and use a separate wire connection. Can't think of anything else at the moment.

[Michael Edge]

That's all I've come up with at the moment as well, I'll see what it looks like when it's in place. Shame it's not ready yet - this hot weather is just what I want for track laying.

[Michael Edge]

Latest piece of trackwork finished and laid now - when the sun shines it gets nice and warm in the shed.

 

 

 

Still on the bench in these photos, with successive diamonds/slips it's important to keep a straight run through in both directions - there is a slight curve all the way through the junction though. Checkrails are always fitted last, after testing without them.

 

 

 

One more point to build - the trap for the siding on the up side, the former access to Sovereign pit, then just some plain track to lay and it should be possible to test trains all round (with some temporary wiring - I haven't done a control panel yet).

[A Murphy]

Michael,

 

That Wath Daisy is an awesome looking beast........

 

Best wishes,

 

Alastair M

[UpDistant]

Michael,

 

How have you managed the "transitions" from level to 1 in 40 up or down?

Have you put a series of parallel cuts on the underside of the plywood, or have you just packed it to give the correct gradient, given that it's 9mm?

How long is the transition?

 

Thanks