RMweb Gold nest Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 Hello again Following on from my previous thread asking for general information, I have a new request for assistance! I am planning a layout based on the Ligne de Carcassonne á Rivesaltes and am thinking about the buildings for such a layout. I realise finding drawings of the specific buildings may be a little tricky so a more general request instead... I am wondering if anyone has or knows of anywhere where I may be able to find drawings for some of the more rural railway buildings of the Compagnie des Chemins de fer du Midi? I know there is a ready-to-plant building that would fit quite well but I am quite keen to build my own so any assistance would be greatly appreciated. Thanks guys Nestor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 I am sure that I have seen some. But I can't remember where. I am down there early next month and could take some suitable photos to make drawings from. If I remember to get my Disto back from the wife, I can also take some key measurements. There are iirc two different sizes. Would you be after the smaller or the larger? Quite simple rectangular buildings so easy enough to scratchbuild. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nest Posted August 6, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 I am sure that I have seen some. But I can't remember where. I am down there early next month and could take some suitable photos to make drawings from. If I remember to get my Disto back from the wife, I can also take some key measurements. There are iirc two different sizes. Would you be after the smaller or the larger? Quite simple rectangular buildings so easy enough to scratchbuild. That would be of great help! I have been looking at the smaller, particularly the building at Lappradelle. The simplicity has a certain charm. I have a few photos, found online but I'm especially interest in straight on profile pictures and measurements. I did have a load of photos of the station and the line in general from a holiday a few years back but can't seem to locate them... A pain as it's a lovely line. Nestor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 Lapradelle is a very attractive site especially if you have enough space to model the viaducts. I doubt if I will get up that far (wife will keep me busy on the diy stuff) but I think Lapradelle has the same building as Espira which I will probably be passing on my way to BricoDepot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 (edited) Thought folks might find this photo interesting. French tourist lines can be very different from our preservation outfits. That said, even if the passenger vehicles are a bit odd, the 63000 looks rather good in that livery. Edited August 6, 2018 by Joseph_Pestell 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 This photo confirms that Lapradelle-Puilaurens is the small two-door variant with attached goods shed. https://www.flickr.com/photos/116072983@N04/29080740402 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Storey Posted August 6, 2018 Share Posted August 6, 2018 Guess you may have already seen these? https://www.flickr.com/search/?text=gare%20de%20lapradelle Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nest Posted August 6, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 Thought folks might find this photo interesting. French tourist lines can be very different from our preservation outfits. That said, even if the passenger vehicles are a bit odd, the 63000 looks rather good in that livery. Yes I remember thinking that when I rode the line. All the stations where in pretty sorry state with buildings looking pretty run down and tracks over grown. This still had a certain charm of its own though. The emphasis was definitely on the tour side of things rather than any kind of UK style preservation effort. This photo confirms that Lapradelle-Puilaurens is the small two-door variant with attached goods shed. https://www.flickr.com/photos/116072983@N04/29080740402 Yes I had seen that particular photo. Very atmospheric little spot. The plan I have is for a stopping point once it's broken out into the vineyards between Lappradelle and Rivesaltes. A building like the one at Lapradelle or Espira is exactly what I'd be looking at modelling. Nestor Guess you may have already seen these? https://www.flickr.com/search/?text=gare%20de%20lapradelle I had seen the first one but not the other two. Thanks! Nestor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Storey Posted August 6, 2018 Share Posted August 6, 2018 Le Train Rouge preservation group may have other historic info if you contact them? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 Le Train Rouge preservation group may have other historic info if you contact them? In the early days of the group, Roger Nautre would have been the go-to man for history. But I don't suppose he is still with us. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 (edited) The plan I have is for a stopping point once it's broken out into the vineyards between Lappradelle and Rivesaltes. A building like the one at Lapradelle or Espira is exactly what I'd be looking at modelling. Cases-de-Pene might be the best option. Just outside the village, so among vines. And there is a natural scenic break to the west where the line goes behind the houses that front the main D617 road (most of the village, including the Mairie, is on the other side of the river). Just east of the station is a quarry with rail-served sidings although I don't think that was there in your 1950s timeframe. Edit to add: At least one of the stations had sidings into the local wine co-operative. That might be an excuse to run some of those nice old wine tank wagon models that various manufacturers have done. Edited August 6, 2018 by Joseph_Pestell 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 (edited) Meanwhile, on the next line south, somewhere interesting to stay. There is at least one other converted station in the region doing B&B, Chalabre iirc. https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Hotel_Review-g2278077-d4917360-Reviews-La_Gare_de_Millas-Millas_Pyrenees_Orientales_Occitanie.html#photos;aggregationId=&albumid=22&filter=7 Edited August 6, 2018 by Joseph_Pestell 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rue_d_etropal Posted August 6, 2018 Share Posted August 6, 2018 Looks like a fairly standard(possibly classic) French station building. Windows probably of standard size, so probably could use that as a guide. Roof pitch is often something that is different, depending on local weather system. This area looks pretty similar to the area I know to the northeast of Carcassonne. Slightly further north and it is slates not tiles on roof. Quite a few drawings of similar station buildings in Loco Revue and Voie Libre. Worth having a look in issues online at http://fr.1001mags.com/magazine/loco-revue Has not been updated for a while but still plenty to search through. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nest Posted August 6, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 Meanwhile, on the next line south, somewhere interesting to stay. There is at least one other converted station in the region doing B&B, Chalabre iirc. https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Hotel_Review-g2278077-d4917360-Reviews-La_Gare_de_Millas-Millas_Pyrenees_Orientales_Occitanie.html#photos;aggregationId=&albumid=22&filter=7 Looks wonderfully twee! The plan I have is for a stopping point once it's broken out into the vineyards between Lappradelle and Rivesaltes. A building like the one at Lapradelle or Espira is exactly what I'd be looking at modelling. Cases-de-Pene might be the best option. Just outside the village, so among vines. And there is a natural scenic break to the west where the line goes behind the houses that front the main D617 road (most of the village, including the Mairie, is on the other side of the river). Just east of the station is a quarry with rail-served sidings although I don't think that was there in your 1950s timeframe. Edit to add: At least one of the stations had sidings into the local wine co-operative. That might be an excuse to run some of those nice old wine tank wagon models that various manufacturers have done. Its another location which looks to have a very similar station building. If I had a lot more space, a model including the quarry (bending history never hurts in modelling) would be rather nice. Looks like a fairly standard(possibly classic) French station building. Windows probably of standard size, so probably could use that as a guide. Roof pitch is often something that is different, depending on local weather system. This area looks pretty similar to the area I know to the northeast of Carcassonne. Slightly further north and it is slates not tiles on roof. Quite a few drawings of similar station buildings in Loco Revue and Voie Libre. Worth having a look in issues online at http://fr.1001mags.com/magazine/loco-revue Has not been updated for a while but still plenty to search through. Thanks for the link, I'll take a look. I'm still quite definitely a novice in terms of the French modelling scene as everything I've done up until now has more or less been exclusively British so links like this are invaluable. Much appreciated. When the plan is a little more developed, I will start a proper thread for it. Nestor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 Looks like a fairly standard(possibly classic) French station building. Windows probably of standard size, so probably could use that as a guide. Roof pitch is often something that is different, depending on local weather system. This area looks pretty similar to the area I know to the northeast of Carcassonne. Slightly further north and it is slates not tiles on roof. Quite a few drawings of similar station buildings in Loco Revue and Voie Libre. Worth having a look in issues online at http://fr.1001mags.com/magazine/loco-revue Has not been updated for a while but still plenty to search through. Yes, I think these are identical to the buildings on "your" Bedarieux - Mazamet line other than the roofing. Is it Olargues that has a nice cafe in the goods shed? But there is no standard French station building. Many are very similar but each company had a very slightly different set of building details. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Andy Hayter Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 6, 2018 (edited) Some references Midi Infrastructure Electrical substation Loco Revue Hors Série Chemin de Fer Réels 3 Midi Infrastructure Catenary Loco Revue 2000 February 22 Midi Infrastructure Catenary Loco Revue 2000 March 44 Midi Infrastructure Catenary Loco Revue 2000 Hors Série 5 Midi Infrastructure Crossing keepers cottage - branch line Pyrennees Loco Revue Hors Série 2000 2 Midi Infrastructure Overhead hoist Loco Revue 1987 January 23 Midi Infrastructure Small loading dock Loco Revue 1993 February 96 Midi Infrastructure Ogive catenary RMF 1969 October 413 Midi Infrastructure Station Building 2 door plus goods shed Loco Revue 2004 January 93 Midi infrastructure third rail Loco Revue 1948 June 191 Midi infrastructure catenary Loco Revue 2006 November 30 Midi infrastructure Water tower Voies Ferrées 1983 September 76 Midi infrastructure buffer stops made by Eailway and Atelier Debelleyme RMF 2007 March 62 Midi infrastructure Maison de PN Loco Revue 2007 August 59 centrefold Midi infrastructure 2 track engine shed Loco Revue 2008 August 38 Midi infrastructure 2 track engine shed Loco Revue 2008 September 38 Midi infrastructure Water tower Ferrovissime 2008 September 10 Midi infrastructure water crane Ferrovissime 2008 September 10 Midi infrastructure small workshop Ferrovissime 2008 September 10 Midi infrastructure Water tower Ferrovissime 2008 October 24 Midi infrastructure train shed Ferrovissime 2009 July 20 Midi infrastructure Level crossings Loco Revue 2011 September 50 Midi infrastructure Bullhead track Loco Revue 2012 April 54 Midi infrastructure Crossing keepers cottage Ferrovissime 2013 January 24 Midi infrastructure Crossing keepers cottage Ferrovissime 2013 September 60 Edited because the forum software converts tables to a continuous string. All of the above have drawings that should allow a model to be built. Edited August 6, 2018 by Andy Hayter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nest Posted August 6, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 Some references Midi Infrastructure Electrical substation Loco Revue Hors Série Chemin de Fer Réels 3 Midi Infrastructure Catenary Loco Revue 2000 February 22 Midi Infrastructure Catenary Loco Revue 2000 March 44 Midi Infrastructure Catenary Loco Revue 2000 Hors Série 5 Midi Infrastructure Crossing keepers cottage - branch line Pyrennees Loco Revue Hors Série 2000 2 Midi Infrastructure Overhead hoist Loco Revue 1987 January 23 Midi Infrastructure Small loading dock Loco Revue 1993 February 96 Midi Infrastructure Ogive catenary RMF 1969 October 413 Midi Infrastructure Station Building 2 door plus goods shed Loco Revue 2004 January 93 Midi infrastructure third rail Loco Revue 1948 June 191 Midi infrastructure catenary Loco Revue 2006 November 30 Midi infrastructure Water tower Voies Ferrées 1983 September 76 Midi infrastructure buffer stops made by Eailway and Atelier Debelleyme RMF 2007 March 62 Midi infrastructure Maison de PN Loco Revue 2007 August 59 centrefold Midi infrastructure 2 track engine shed Loco Revue 2008 August 38 Midi infrastructure 2 track engine shed Loco Revue 2008 September 38 Midi infrastructure Water tower Ferrovissime 2008 September 10 Midi infrastructure water crane Ferrovissime 2008 September 10 Midi infrastructure small workshop Ferrovissime 2008 September 10 Midi infrastructure Water tower Ferrovissime 2008 October 24 Midi infrastructure train shed Ferrovissime 2009 July 20 Midi infrastructure Level crossings Loco Revue 2011 September 50 Midi infrastructure Bullhead track Loco Revue 2012 April 54 Midi infrastructure Crossing keepers cottage Ferrovissime 2013 January 24 Midi infrastructure Crossing keepers cottage Ferrovissime 2013 September 60 Edited because the forum software converts tables to a continuous string. All of the above have drawings that should allow a model to be built. That's extremely helpful thankyou! I'll take a look through. Nestor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nest Posted August 6, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 In fact looking through quickly now, the list includes pretty much everything I am looking for! Thank you very much Nestor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nest Posted August 6, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 One quite interesting feature (going slightly off topic) is the use of Bullhead rail. I wonder if the new Peco Code 75 bullhead would be appropriate for HO, perhaps with a little modification of the sleeper width? Does anyone have experience of doing Bullhead in HO? Nestor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Andy Hayter Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 6, 2018 Personally no, but a number of French modellers have used it unmodified quite successfully. The sleeper spacing is possibly closer to H0 than 00 anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nest Posted August 6, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 I imagine once detailed and placed within a scene it will look quite passable. Until starting on this project, I had always assumed the French only used flat bottom rail. Nestor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rue_d_etropal Posted August 6, 2018 Share Posted August 6, 2018 Something I have seen French modellers do is use code 100 for mainline and code 75 for sidings as it emphasises the lighter rail used in sidings. Not sure if most people would actually notice if it was bullhead or flat bottom. I feel it is going down the rivet counting path . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Andy Hayter Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 6, 2018 No. Going down the rivet counting route is when you say (and this applies to the PLM and possibly not the Midi) the track was laid in coupons each of 16 sleepers. the spacing between the first and last two is reduced to support the rail joint to the next coupon and you do the same with the PECO sleepers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nest Posted August 7, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 7, 2018 (edited) Something I have seen French modellers do is use code 100 for mainline and code 75 for sidings as it emphasises the lighter rail used in sidings. Not sure if most people would actually notice if it was bullhead or flat bottom. I feel it is going down the rivet counting path .Ah, without wishing to open a huge can of worms, it is the sort of thing I would notice...If the prototype had bullhead, it would be nice to model it with bullhead, atleast for me anyway. It is all personal preference of course! Plus, I am a self confessed rivet counter, on my own layouts at least.... Nestor Edited August 7, 2018 by nest 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 7, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 7, 2018 Ah, without wishing to open a huge can of worms, it is the sort of thing I would notice... If the prototype had bullhead, it would be nice to model it with bullhead, atleast for me anyway. It is all personal preference of course! Plus, I am a self confessed rivet counter, on my own layouts at least.... Nestor The line is still in bullhead throughout. It's an important part of its Midi character. Some of my friends in AMHVA used to buy SMP bullhead track from me. Because it has thinner sleepers than Peco, it is easier to cut the sleepers about to represent the rather rough and ready nature of the French pine sleepers. I'll see if I can touch base with a friend in Esperaza who had quite an extensive layout laid in modified SMP. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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