Cwm Prysor - 'The Bala Branch'

[Pteremy]

Worth noting that the scalefour link contains a helpful reminder that there are articles on post and wire fencing in #13 and 56 of GWJ.

[Tom F]

2 hours ago, Pteremy said:

Worth noting that the scalefour link contains a helpful reminder that there are articles on post and wire fencing in #13 and 56 of GWJ.

 

Thanks for that! Can you buy back issues of GWJ?

 

The fencing is mostly the same as what Ratio produce. However, I’ve noticed it is slightly different in places, using concrete posts and thinner posts.

 

Does anyone produce something like this?

 

 

[Pteremy]

My starting point would be eBay - but there are also retailers with stocks of the more recent numbers - Titfield Thunderbolt bookshop for example (from a quick google)

Edited February 4, 2019 by Pteremy

[CazRail]

The thinner 'posts' are dropper bars, which only tie the wires together, and dont need to be in the ground(depends on their length). The more dropper bars there are, the further the distance between posts. Changed countless numbers of these ar work!

[Tom F]

33 minutes ago, CazRail said:

The thinner 'posts' are dropper bars, which only tie the wires together, and dont need to be in the ground(depends on their length). The more dropper bars there are, the further the distance between posts. Changed countless numbers of these ar work!

 

Cheers for that, so essentially a piece of wire would work glued to the ‘cotton’ would work.

 

ill have a look who does concrete posts.

[Dave Holt]

Tom,

I must say how much I'm enjoying reading about your project. You are capturing the essence of that wild and remote area beautifully.

Regarding the post and wire fencing, I wonder if the wires would really be visible at a scale viewing distance. If the real thing is, say, 0.125" diameter wire, that would be one and a half thousandths of an inch, to scale. The finest cotton would be way over scale. There's also the problem of maintaining tension (the real thing had ratchet tensioners every so many posts - those posts have a diagonal bracing) and the risk of damage during track cleaning, etc. I believe there's some elastic single filament material called "eaziline", or something like that, that some people have used, but even their finest is still way over scale.

Dave.

[CazRail]

1 hour ago, 9793 said:

 

Cheers for that, so essentially a piece of wire would work glued to the ‘cotton’ would work.

 

ill have a look who does concrete posts.

That would work. Older dropper bars actually was made of twisted wire, which ive only come across once or twice.

[Killybegs]

I have used fine armature wire between the posts in the past. It is very thin but does break easily. At 0.09mm diam it's still a bit over size but looks OK.

Edited February 4, 2019 by Killybegs

[Tom F]

2 hours ago, Dave Holt said:

Tom,

I must say how much I'm enjoying reading about your project. You are capturing the essence of that wild and remote area beautifully.

Regarding the post and wire fencing, I wonder if the wires would really be visible at a scale viewing distance. If the real thing is, say, 0.125" diameter wire, that would be one and a half thousandths of an inch, to scale. The finest cotton would be way over scale. There's also the problem of maintaining tension (the real thing had ratchet tensioners every so many posts - those posts have a diagonal bracing) and the risk of damage during track cleaning, etc. I believe there's some elastic single filament material called "eaziline", or something like that, that some people have used, but even their finest is still way over scale.

Dave.

 

Thanks for your kind words Dave!
Regarding the fencing, it iss something I keep debating with to be honest, and I'm still not sure what to do. To not include the 'wire' would be a damn sight easier.....

[MPR]

Hi Tom

i've checked my GWRJs,  the drawing in #13 is probably the one you need, the article in #56 has the drawing of the variant where the termination is using a diagonal support made of bridge rail. By the way, the Wire gauge is 10swg. (3.251mm diameter = 0.046mm in 4mm) 

Regards

Martin

 

[Miss Prism]

48SWG enamelled copper wire

 

(a layer of paint would probably double the diameter though!!)

 

[The Johnster]

10 hours ago, 9793 said:

 

Cheers for that, so essentially a piece of wire would work glued to the ‘cotton’ would work.

 

ill have a look who does concrete posts.

Ratio do concrete posts with holes in them for the wires to go through.

[Tom F]

I think the decision will be made once the posts are in, and the last layer of grass is down, and I'll see how it looks, but my gut feeling is saying I'm probably not going to bother with the wire.....I'm certainly not adding telegraph cable.

 

5 hours ago, The Johnster said:

Ratio do concrete posts with holes in them for the wires to go through.

 

Hmmm, I've just had a look at the Ratio examples, and it appears like the wooden post, that the cable on the prototype doesn't go through the posts, it goes around the back of them.

 

[CazRail]

1 hour ago, 9793 said:

 

Hmmm, I've just had a look at the Ratio examples, and it appears like the wooden post, that the cable on the prototype doesn't go through the posts, it goes around the back of them.

 

 

The more common type of concrete posts have the wire running across the face of the post secured to it using eyes, almost like big split pins.

[Tom F]

Well....that's the finished plan! Almost ready to go off to Tim Horn to turn into baseboards! Special thanks to Geoff Taylor for all his awesome design work, and Tony Geary who is turning it into a templot plan!

 

Can't believe we are at this point! Exciting times ahead!

[St Enodoc]

3 hours ago, 9793 said:

Well....that's the finished plan! Almost ready to go off to Tim Horn to turn into baseboards! Special thanks to Geoff Taylor for all his awesome design work, and Tony Geary who is turning it into a templot plan!

 

Can't believe we are at this point! Exciting times ahead!

2' 6" radius in P4?

[Brassey]

25 minutes ago, St Enodoc said:

2' 6" radius in P4?

Peco don't make P4 points

[westerner]

I thought Tom's layout was OO.

[Tom F]

7 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

2' 6" radius in P4?

 

7 hours ago, Brassey said:

Peco don't make P4 points

 

8 minutes ago, westerner said:

I thought Tom's layout was OO.

 

It most definitely is OO! I'm honoured if people think it is P4 though!

2.6 is tighter than I would have liked, but it means we can get the max length for Bala, and within the realms of RTR locos.....it's still fairly wide to not cause issues.

[Tom F]

I’ve been having a ponder this morning. The decision to remove Capel Celyn is slightly disappointing, but having the offscene passing loop (representing Arenig) really opens up operating of the branch. I can now depict weekend ballast collections from Arenig (in the form of a Pannier and several Herrings).

 

I do like now that the Bala distant and home signals can be depicted opening the Bala scene out that but more (plus that rather interesting bi directional signal that gives access for goods trains into the down platform).

 

I think it is a positive move in general.

[The Johnster]

2'6" minimum radius curves with scale couplings and lightly sprung buffers should be fine but might be an issue if propelling is needed; but this is a superb plan and despite the loss of Capel Celyn (the loss of Capel Celyn has other resonances as well!), it's replacement with a hidden passing loop allows correct prototypical timetable operation.  With Bala in the mix, an operating session is going to keep you pretty busy and you may even have trouble doing it in real time.  

 

I think you have made the right decision.

[NHY 581]

That's the challenge I enjoy about 00 gauge. If you can present it in such a way that people think it's EM or P4 you have succeeded. 

 

I have been complimented on the quality of my EM gauge trackwork and have been delighted to confirm it to be PECO code 75 streamline 00 gauge. 

 

 

Rob. 

[Andrew P]

Hi Tom, I'm looking forward to seeing Bala develop, a couple of years ago, I joined the Bala Library, and found some fascinating books on the area, the Station and the line through Capel Celyn, and not just  about the Railways, ideal for a rainy 10 Days in November, haha.

[St Enodoc]

12 hours ago, 9793 said:

 

 

 

It most definitely is OO! I'm honoured if people think it is P4 though!

2.6 is tighter than I would have liked, but it means we can get the max length for Bala, and within the realms of RTR locos.....it's still fairly wide to not cause issues.

My mistake! Don't know where I got that from. 2' 6" will not be a problem in 00.

[Tom F]

1 hour ago, St Enodoc said:

My mistake! Don't know where I got that from. 2' 6" will not be a problem in 00.

Cheers StE!
I will have to propel stock out of Bala (as it was a prototypical move for Churchward Moguls on goods trains working between Ruabon and Barmouth). However I did a test piece and all stock seemed fairly happy, other than my long buffered presflos, which I've now added longer couplings shackles which seems to have solved the problem.