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Darius43

Improving a Triang-Hornby Mk1

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So I've done a bit of work on mine. The first bsk I was given 50 years ago and much abused in my youth. So it is good to have it running again.

Refurbishment included 

1. Replacement wheel sets and for the bsk, replacement bogies.

2. Added gangway ends and doors

3. Replacement buffers

4. Full repaint and relettering

5. Repaint interior and added netting to the luggage cage.

6. light weathering.

7.Replacement glazing

8. New couplings.

I have another 4 in hand. Will post when done.

20200406_112425.jpg

20200406_112407.jpg

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Has anyone made a Mark 1 Open First from the old Tri-ang coaches ?  I'd love to have one to go with Restaurant Kitchen.  Photos with where the cuts / shuts / joins / mistakes were would be lovely.  Not that I want to cheat or anything.

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On 06/04/2020 at 12:05, ikcdab said:

So I've done a bit of work on mine. The first bsk I was given 50 years ago and much abused in my youth. So it is good to have it running again.

Refurbishment included 

1. Replacement wheel sets and for the bsk, replacement bogies.

2. Added gangway ends and doors

3. Replacement buffers

4. Full repaint and relettering

5. Repaint interior and added netting to the luggage cage.

6. light weathering.

7.Replacement glazing

8. New couplings.

I have another 4 in hand. Will post when done.

20200406_112425.jpg

20200406_112407.jpg

Nice!

Do you have a photo of your modified gangways and end doors? Thanks!

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Posted (edited)
On 08/04/2020 at 11:26, muddy water said:

Nice!

Do you have a photo of your modified gangways and end doors? Thanks!

Does this help? I measured up the "rubbing plate" (is that the name?) and cut several out on the cricut with 10 thou plasticard. I then found that by happy accident, the inside cut out pieces were an exact fit into the corridor connection and thus covered up the unsightly triang screwholes etc. Then just glued the rubbing plate and new door in.

20200410_091209.jpg

Edited by ikcdab
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Here is an unmodified one for comparison. Yours is a great improvement!
So from one piece of plastic card you made the door and the rubbing plate!

You had a good steady hand cutting that out with the curved bit at the top!

8654D824-A50F-4032-8849-6DA32663F385.jpeg

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2 hours ago, muddy water said:

Here is an unmodified one for comparison. Yours is a great improvement!
So from one piece of plastic card you made the door and the rubbing plate!

You had a good steady hand cutting that out with the curved bit at the top!

8654D824-A50F-4032-8849-6DA32663F385.jpeg

I used the cricut cutter. Made up the outline on coreldraw, duplicated it a few times, yes the file and a sheet on 10thou into the cricut and hey Presto. Yes, the bit cut out from the rubbing plate fitted the door very well. You need to replace buffers too.

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54 minutes ago, ikcdab said:

I used the cricut cutter. Made up the outline on coreldraw, duplicated it a few times, yes the file and a sheet on 10thou into the cricut and hey Presto. Yes, the bit cut out from the rubbing plate fitted the door very well. You need to replace buffers too.

 

https://www.craftstash.co.uk/cricut-joy-digital-cutting-machine.html?___store=default&awc=7803_1586530461_ddecc64f5391b9ebd3b835638591fcaf&utm_source=Kiesproduct+%2F+Shoparize+CSS&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=affiliatewindow

 

Is this the Cricut machine that you use?

 

Please could you give a few more details of its capabilities - material types and maximum thicknesses; could it cut out a 4mm. scale coach side in plastic card; etc?

 

I would also welcome input from others about alternative cutting machines.

 

Many thanks in anticipation.

 

John Isherwood.

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Hi John,  ours is the cricut explore air 2. My wife mostly uses it for her crafts. It cuts paper and card very well. Max size is about 300mm x 300mm. 

I have also used it to cut 5 thou and 10 thou plasticard. It mostly gets through but needs a final break out. It is very precise and can cut the most intricate shapes very accurately.

It does come with its own software but this is a little simplistic as I far prefer to use coreldraw. I save as a svg file which reads directly in.

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On 07/04/2020 at 19:43, Middlesea John said:

Has anyone made a Mark 1 Open First from the old Tri-ang coaches ?  I'd love to have one to go with Restaurant Kitchen.  Photos with where the cuts / shuts / joins / mistakes were would be lovely.  Not that I want to cheat or anything.

Hi John

 

Bachmann do the RFO which has the same body as the FO diagram 71. Replica did the FO diagram 73, which had slightly shorter bays and a central door.

 

I have bashed Tri-ang CKs into a FO diagram 72, the one with the central door in the middle seating bay.

100_5852a.jpg.18469453b9e06bd92c67e88ad3084d36.jpg

Toilet side

 

100_5861a.jpg.c19c6add02273a4df1029fd09d26af09.jpg

Corridor (?) side.

 

The type where Doug, Brenda and their two boys climb in at Bedford Midland Road station. Brenda says "It is first class, I don't think we are allowed to get on here". To which Doug replies, as he bashes the chap sat by the door with his suitcase, "Of course we can, We will walk down the train." Brenda closes the door after the kids get on, swinging around almost taking the nose off the lady in the opposite seat. They were not the most popular of first class coaches.

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MR-2.JPG

 

My Triang RMB, with some Lima 2Cs

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Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, ikcdab said:

Hi John,  ours is the cricut explore air 2. My wife mostly uses it for her crafts. It cuts paper and card very well. Max size is about 300mm x 300mm. 

I have also used it to cut 5 thou and 10 thou plasticard. It mostly gets through but needs a final break out. It is very precise and can cut the most intricate shapes very accurately.

It does come with its own software but this is a little simplistic as I far prefer to use coreldraw. I save as a svg file which reads directly in.

 

Thanks for that info., most appreciated.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Edited by cctransuk

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Posted (edited)
On 07/04/2020 at 19:43, Middlesea John said:

Has anyone made a Mark 1 Open First from the old Tri-ang coaches ?  I'd love to have one to go with Restaurant Kitchen.  Photos with where the cuts / shuts / joins / mistakes were would be lovely.  Not that I want to cheat or anything.

Hi John,

 

I have built both an FO and an FK to diagrams AD11 No.s M3000-M3002 and AA11 respectively. I have included the FK AA11 diagram as it had a similar body shell as the diagram AD11 No.s 3020-3080 and No.s 3085-3103 except for a central door on both sides and slightly different window spacing. Do check dimensions for the window spacing as they seem to be closer spaced than those of the FK.

 

The FO AD11 was built from the first class end of a Triang composite fr the right hand end with a door and toilet window at the left hand end with sections of windows spaced to first class centres, I had a lot of cut and shuts on the bench so I can't say where they came from. On the vestibule side of the coach the ventilator is removed form the toilet window. The RFO AD11 is of the same body shell No.s E1-E11

 

The FK AA11 is made in the same way for the compartment side, and the corridor side with from the left hand end, first class sections of corridor sides from a composite and the right hand door end from the second class end suitably spliced in.

 

I hope that makes sense !

 

572829806_DSCF09971.JPG.97a3f5fe0bf924c6012486e62b6a5c6e.JPG

Top, FK AA11 corridor side, bottom, FO AD11 vestibule side,

2090807255_DSCF09981.JPG.da1a1df43cfba8ab2e6b7f5f0a6a8ddd.JPG

Top, FK AA11 compartment side, bottom, FO AD11 toilet side.

 

Gibbo.

Edited by Gibbo675
Improper grammar.
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The older Triang models are surprisingly good, the only issue is that some windows are very slightly too deep.

 

The RMB is fine, but CK and BSK are slightly too deep so I have had to shrink them for my TSOs BSK BG and BFK.

 

I have also just started on doing up a 2 BFK.

 

Cheap and provide a set of coaches, shallower holes than Lima too.

 

If only they had done the TSO SK sides originally.

 

My 2 x TSO, BSK, BG and RMB have Replica flush glazing.

 

The RMB and BG are in the same MR 2C set and TSOs and BSK are choc and cream and will run behind 75069.

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It is interesting to see your modifications of Tri-ang Mk1 coaches.

 

I bought a bright red and yellow R628 1805 BR Mk1 Buffet Car from Hobbytime of West Wickham in 1972 for £1.30.

 

I repainted it crimson and cream using Humbrol Railway enamels but I never got round to numbering it.

P1100001.JPG

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This all takes me back to the days when (like others on here) I had a go at creating other types of Mk.1 stock from Tri-ang-Hornby coaches, at a time before Lima or Mainline when you could only get BSK, CK, RMB and Sleepers - and the overlength BG.  I had a wonderful time hacking up several pairs of BSKs to create correct-length BGs from the brake ends, and then making up SKs or TSOs from the bits left over!  Other BSKs plus bits of CK went into a BCK and a couple of BSOs, and I think that parts from a couple of CKs went into an FK.  With the advent of the Bachmann product some of the conversions were sold on but I still have the BGs and BSOs.  As it happens, I never went for Lima or Mainline because I felt that the plastic sides were thicker and made the windows even less convincing than the Tri-ang-Hornby ones. 

 

For me, this was inspired by articles in the Model Railway Constructor from the early 1960s on carving up Kitmaster coaches to represent other BR Mk.1 types: by the time I started wielding my hacksaw the Kitmasters were long since unavailable, although I've subsequently been able to collect quite a few built-up Kitmasters (in various states) from second-hand stalls at shows.  By the time I became aware of the Coopercraft versions I reckoned I had more than enough BR Mk.1 stock to last me a lifetime... happy days !

 

Alasdair

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The early Mainline at first I thought were good, but after a while the dimensions looked odd. Lima too thick.

 

Had a stage where my SKs were 1 Mainline, 1 Lima, 1 Coopercraft, 1 Bachmann, TSOs 2 Lima, 2 Bachmann.

 

Now more Bachmann and Triang!

 

Lima though work well as bases for converting with brass sides. BG to Bar as an example

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Late Mainline (RBR BCK FO) though are excellent

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Sorry to hi-jack this thread. I’m in the planning stage of my first Triang Mk1 Cut ‘n’ Shut improvement, hopefully at the end have a diagram AB11 BFK with c/w bogies. A couple of questions, does anybody know what type of roof ventilators were fitted to the final Lot number 14023-14027 and does my picture below look like a workable plan of what goes where from a BSK and a CK.

4AA25A13-8AEC-42F4-913A-C9E18FDAE54A.jpeg

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Evening. And good for you - go for it

 

Have you seen this thread?

 

Cheers

 

 

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On 06/05/2020 at 19:52, turbos said:

Sorry to hi-jack this thread. I’m in the planning stage of my first Triang Mk1 Cut ‘n’ Shut improvement, hopefully at the end have a diagram AB11 BFK with c/w bogies. A couple of questions, does anybody know what type of roof ventilators were fitted to the final Lot number 14023-14027 and does my picture below look like a workable plan of what goes where from a BSK and a CK.

4AA25A13-8AEC-42F4-913A-C9E18FDAE54A.jpeg

 

Morning . Been thinking about this and looking again.... hope you dont mind me pointing this out.

 

Would I be correct in assuming you intend to use sections A & B to give you the corridor side back to the rear vestibule? Your section 5 will give you the correct window spacings - and therefore the correct length - for the compartment side as you are taking them from the first class compartments of the CK. Unfortunately unless you are planning to insert spacing sections I am afraid splicing A and B will leave you short on the corridor side as these are the second class compartments which are smaller and therefore the windows are closer together - which will mean the windows wont align with the compartments and the vestibule doors wont align.

 

As Hornby never did an FK or RFO in their original Mk1 range unfortunately you cant use both sides of one of their coaches without a lot of cut and shuts or compromising window alignment. Getting hold of another CK would help you as you could use the 4 window first class section from that for your corridor side.

 

Kind regards

 

Phil

 

 

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3 hours ago, Phil Bullock said:

 

Morning . Been thinking about this and looking again.... hope you dont mind me pointing this out.

 

Would I be correct in assuming you intend to use sections A & B to give you the corridor side back to the rear vestibule? Your section 5 will give you the correct window spacings - and therefore the correct length - for the compartment side as you are taking them from the first class compartments of the CK. Unfortunately unless you are planning to insert spacing sections I am afraid splicing A and B will leave you short on the corridor side as these are the second class compartments which are smaller and therefore the windows are closer together - which will mean the windows wont align with the compartments and the vestibule doors wont align.

 

As Hornby never did an FK or RFO in their original Mk1 range unfortunately you cant use both sides of one of their coaches without a lot of cut and shuts or compromising window alignment. Getting hold of another CK would help you as you could use the 4 window first class section from that for your corridor side.

 

Kind regards

 

Phil

 

 

Thank you for taking the time to think about my wee project. You’re correct assuming that section B is to replace the corridor side door and two small windows. I understand your thinking in compartment sizes but if you think in bits of plastic I think it should work. By cutting along the inside edge of the toilet window window frame and the inside edge of the stretcher window frame, and the outer edges of the two small windows it should be an OK fit.

 

24C0F687-31B0-4960-A70E-6E9598F310BE.jpeg

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I think they are planning on using wide bits and filling in the small bits of narrow windows.

 

I have some BFK sides somewhere.

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On 14/09/2018 at 17:18, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Darius,

 

The one modification that will easily improve a Triang-Hornby Mk1 is to set the bogies to the correct centres and at the same time lower the running height especially if using the correct diameter 14mm wheels. It makes a huge difference for the sake of 3mm as does the correct height of 12' 41/2" to the top of the roof which scales at 49.3mm.

 

The bogie centres need to be set at 46' 6" which works out at 186mm rather than the 189mm of the Triang coach, buffer height needs to be 14mm. The easy way to set the centres is 34mm from the outer end of the head stock.

 

I have 39 Mk1's in my to do box, all the body sides along with various cut and shuts have been done along with about half of the bogie mounts. I eventually got so bored with them all I went on to build 15 Freightliner flats, 16 Presflos and designed a laser cut Cartic-4 instead,  when I've had enough of trucks I shall get on with them.

 

Looking good so far,

 

Gibbo.

Does the same apply to the Kitmaster/Coopercraft MK1 kits as well?

 

Cheers N

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1 hour ago, rodent279 said:

Does the same apply to the Kitmaster/Coopercraft MK1 kits as well?

 

Cheers N

Hi Neil,

 

I cant say as I have no experience with either Kitmaster or Coopercraft Mk1's, all I can say is that if you scale the bogie centres to 46' 6" which equates to 186mm you are on the right track.

 

Gibbo.

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