Phase 1 4 Cig details

[Geep7]

I'm fairly soon about to embark on a Phase 1 4-Cig build, using Replica Mk1 bodies and the MJT sides (I am aware of their inaccuracies from Mr Park's Cig build thread, which i'm happy to live with) & ends.

 

What I would like to know before I start is, are there any detail differences between the Phase 1 and Phase 2 Cig's I should be aware of, other than the motor bogies being the Mk4 variant?

 

Would the shoe beams be the type used on the Cep's mounted on B5 bogies, or the type used on the later Cig's/Vep's/Rep's?

 

I am going to be painting it in the original Green with SYP if this is if any help.

 

Thanks, Chris

Edited September 14, 2018 by Geep7

[mike hughes]

Internally the seat ends of the Phase 1 were like MK1 coaches and phase 2 didn’t have headrests. I seem to remember the seat cushions on the phase 1 were thicker and the side panels were different colours

 

Michael

[Gwiwer]

Externally 7301-36 had a paler shade of warning yellow than the rest (described by some as lemon compared with custard) and those units were equipped with triangular worded NO SMOKING decals and totem-shaped FIRST CLASS signs.  All subsequent deliveries had the round "crossed out cigarette" decal for no smoking accommodation and the round-cornered square with a numeral 1 for first class.  

 

Moquette differed.  In second class 7301-36 were supplied new with Trojan; all later units arrived with blue-check.  First class was a pale blue-grey pattern in 7301-36 but black / charcoal check in all later units. It may not be relevant for modelling purposes but the seat cushions were thinner and harder on 7337 onwards in both classes and the seats lacked the winged headrests of the first 36 units.  All first class compartments of all batches featured fold-up armrests.

 

The reading lights differed too.  Without checking internal photos I cannot for the moment be specific but one version had wall-mounted lights and the others had a moulding integral with the stainless steel luggage racks which contained a light fitting.  Internal lighting was always brighter on 7337 onwards suggesting they were wired differently or the lights were rated at higher voltage.

 

Small details which differed also concerned the external unit allocation stickers.  These were not used from new appearing some time in the late 1970s.  As the Series 1 units, 7301-36, were kept on the Central Division these gained BTON  stickers and later BI. South Western units wore FTON stickers though later were dispersed between other depots when Fratton ceased to have its own allocation so wore the 2-letter code applicable to the depot they were then based at.  

 

Shoe gear was the same on all units but whether it was identical to Cep units is beyond my knowledge.  The firs 36 units featured a leaf-sprung motor brake coach; all other vehicles of all builds were coil sprung including the motor brakes.  All units were regarded as operationally identical.

[dasatcopthorne]

I'm fairly soon about to embark on a Phase 1 4-Cig build, using Replica Mk1 bodies and the MJT sides (I am aware of their inaccuracies from Mr Park's Cig build thread, which i'm happy to live with) & ends.

 

What I would like to know before I start is, are there any detail differences between the Phase 1 and Phase 2 Cig's I should be aware of, other than the motor bogies being the Mk4 variant?

 

Would the shoe beams be the type used on the Cep's mounted on B5 bogies, or the type used on the later Cig's/Vep's/Rep's?

 

I am going to be painting it in the original Green with SYP if this is if any help.

 

Thanks, Chris

 

Shoe gear all the same for units with Mk4 (s) bogies at the leading ends.

 

Nothing like the Ceps.

[Oldddudders]

Electric parking brake?

[Geep7]

Thanks for all your very useful answers.

 

Would be useful if I actually looked properly at the books I have in my possession, as the answer was literally staring me in the face. Phase 1 Cig photos of them in Green in both the Martin Welsh Southern EMU books....

 

Looks like it'll be a scratch-build job grafted onto the Replica bogies, unless MJT release their shoebeams for the B5(S) in the meantime....

[5Bel]

Looks like it'll be a scratch-build job grafted onto the Replica bogies, unless MJT release their shoebeams for the B5(S) in the meantime....

 

Hi Chris,

 

Southern Pride do the shoe beams and dampers for the Replica bogie. I used them on my 4Cig many years ago. The part number is P358a, enough for a 4 car set. They have quite a few bits for EMU's, unfortunately I don't know how to do a link to their website.

 

Cheers for now, Ian

[Geep7]

 

Looks like it'll be a scratch-build job grafted onto the Replica bogies, unless MJT release their shoebeams for the B5(S) in the meantime....

 

Hi Chris,

 

Southern Pride do the shoe beams and dampers for the Replica bogie. I used them on my 4Cig many years ago. The part number is P358a, enough for a 4 car set. They have quite a few bits for EMU's, unfortunately I don't know how to do a link to their website.

 

Cheers for now, Ian

Thanks Ian, never ordered from SPM before, but looks simple enough. I'll order the underframe details as well while i'm at it.

 

Cheers, Chris

[dasatcopthorne]

I thought Hornby got the Bogie sides fairly correct.

 

Trouble is you would need to cut the sides off and mount them on an etched frame.

 

Available as spares.

 

Dave.

[Geep7]

I thought Hornby got the Bogie sides fairly correct.

 

Trouble is you would need to cut the sides off and mount them on an etched frame.

 

Available as spares.

 

Dave.

I must admit, I hadn't thought of using the Hornby bogies for the shoe beams. As you say, they are pretty accurate, even if the damper is in the wrong place.