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Great Model Railway Challenge - Channel 5


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Those pondering the question of whether "the perfectionists" bear any responsibility for the state of the hobby, positive or negative, will find a rich seam of food for thought in this and all other GMRC threads, especially those not moderated quite so strictly. Whether there is a pattern to be found in those posters most negative about the GMRC and the type of modelling they espouse, I will leave to the individual researcher.

I should have been clearer and say that not all finescalers of whatever scale or competence are like that. I know a lot of people who I regard very highly who are positive about the benefits of the programme and new blood. As ever, it's a minority.

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Each to their own. If it does not appeal to you then fine but to rubbish everyone else who has a go is going too far. Railway modelling is a broad church and there is room inside it for everyone. The fact that the series has exceeded its projected viewing figures shows there is a demand for such shows otherwise the figures would have tailed off by now. I volunteer on the NYMR and there are numerous people coming to see Piglet et al on the railway. At Wakefield we have set a target of at least 100 extra visitors and 2 new members as a result of being on the show at our exhibition 16/17/18 th Nov. If you want to come and be disgruntled of X fine by me, just pay your £7 at the door, free show guide included and I will even throw in a cup of tea. If you want to see elements of the layout and the other team members ( it was a team event even though the team captains tended to be shown) they will all be there.

Who is rubbishing everyone else?

 

I haven't commented on the tv show or the layouts. My reaction was to a quoted statement that I felt was inaccurate and damaging. The reaction on the S4Society Forum has been a very even handed response to the show, with an open recognition that the programme is intended to provide entertainment and isn't about how to build a model railway.

 

I applaud your proposals for your Wakefield show. I can't take up your offer though, as I shall be at the SHMRC exhibition in Portsmouth, talking to people about kit building.

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I should have been clearer and say that not all finescalers of whatever scale or competence are like that. I know a lot of people who I regard very highly who are positive about the benefits of the programme and new blood. As ever, it's a minority.

 

I actually agree entirely. I'm a member of the 2mm Scale Association (although probably not for much longer as I need to be realistic about fat fingers and deteriorating eyesight) and it's not at all an elitist organisation. Nor was the G0G when I was first a member (no idea about now), and nor, I am sure, are the EMGS, the S4 folk or any other finescale organisation or the majority of their members.

 

Some comments by (a minority of) individuals on this and other fora, however......

Edited by PatB
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You get all sorts in clubs. I've met people with an apparent attitude of "I model EM, therefore I'm better than you". That may not even be how they felt, but it's how it came across to me.

 

Not saying that's universal, of course. Far from it. But it is there to a degree and such attitudes need to be kept away from newcomers if we want to welcome them.

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As has been mentioned I too thought the “drained channel” looked bloomin’ good, maybe not exactly English Channel but a good tide out representation, maybe it just looked a bit weirder close up?

I'd have said "Algal bloom mate. Algal bloom." and left it at that!

 

The Nim.

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iv heard a lot about GOG members being elitist, i'm not nor are any of my friends and fellow members though i suppose there might be a few such people in the guild where the notion comes from

 

about the rules, when we first started planning, the first thing we did was have a good read of the rules and plan the best thing we could do within them, any ideas we had which we were unsure of were consulted with the production and we consulted about vague rules to define them a bit more so we knew what we could do. a new updated set of rules were emailed to use a few times during the first few weeks. of course theyre new to this and knew nothing of model railways

Edited by sir douglas
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I am not convinced that there is any need to pre-lay some of the track, but if it allows better modelling then I guess it has to be a plus.

No need perhaps, but it tends to get only subliminal attention in the final edits of the show, at the cost of foregoing one of the team's opportunities to pre-build an attention grabbing set piece. Having to make judgements and tradeoffs, and witnessing their consequences all adds to the entertainment.

 

The Nim.

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That sort of mispronunciation is very common. Get over it.

 

Think how the Americans pronounce aluminium and solder. And how some US Presidents (not the current one, I think) pronounce nuclear.

 

And that Leicestershire town of Loo Ga Bur Who Ga (if you have not worked it out it has the HQ of the preserved GCR)

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In my mind.....anything that may end up attracting newcomers to this hobby is a good thing. Now, how about an American team for the next series?

 

How about an American series? I am sure I can rustle up a team of six fellow members from the NMRA British Region...

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What utter poppy cock. The "perfectionists" - by whom the writer probably meant those that model in 2mmFS, EM, P4 or S7,  probably have very little, if any, regular interaction with newcomers. The people who do that are club members, either at their clubhouse or local show, the high street model shop (where they still exist), or more importantly forums, magazines and online retailers. 

 

I attend a number of shows each year and "newcomers" aren't veryl evident at Scaleforums or ExpoEMs (where the writer of that daft statement will probably believe the "perfectionists" congregate) but are much more in evidence at shows like the CMRA January show in Stevenage, the IRMA show in Ipswich, the L&WMRC show in Leamington or the WVMRC show in Southwold.

Well, our Area group (of the S4 Society) is made up of a number of people who were (I believe) beginners to the hobby when they joined the S4 Society and our Area Group.

 

Our Area Group, which meets twice a month, it's probably fair to say, is made up of a wide range of experience and ability. And yet elitism isn't evident in our group.

 

We have also exhibited at our local show on a number of occasions, which has brought us 'perfectionists' into contact with the General Public.

 

As far as I know, the General Public has survived the encounter unscathed.

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Who is rubbishing everyone else?

 

I haven't commented on the tv show or the layouts. My reaction was to a quoted statement that I felt was inaccurate and damaging. The reaction on the S4Society Forum has been a very even handed response to the show, with an open recognition that the programme is intended to provide entertainment and isn't about how to build a model railway.

 

I applaud your proposals for your Wakefield show. I can't take up your offer though, as I shall be at the SHMRC exhibition in Portsmouth, talking to people about kit building.

Enjoy, I am sure Oliver from Squires will be delighted to sell you any tools you Require!

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there was a lone, but sane, voice making a good point: "I am afraid that the perfectionists are what is destroying modelling as a hobby for the newcomers"

What utter poppy cock. The "perfectionists" - by whom the writer probably meant those that model in 2mmFS, EM, P4 or S7,  probably have very little, if any, regular interaction with newcomers.

 

I think both of these statements are true.

 

The finescale folk may work to very high standards but I don't think any of them would consider him/herself a perfectionist and I have not read anything from any of them that denigrates someone who is content with lesser standards. And at any of the exhibitions where I have seen a "finescale" stand they have been very welcoming.

 

The "killer perfectionists" are the folk who like to think they are experts and convince themselves by finding fault with everything in sight - "we don't do it that way here"

 

...R

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I think both of these statements are true.

 

The finescale folk may work to very high standards but I don't think any of them would consider him/herself a perfectionist and I have not read anything from any of them that denigrates someone who is content with lesser standards. And at any of the exhibitions where I have seen a "finescale" stand they have been very welcoming.

 

The "killer perfectionists" are the folk who like to think they are experts and convince themselves by finding fault with everything in sight - "we don't do it that way here"

 

...R

 

 

You have hit the nail clearly on the head, whether you get either a warm or frosty reception when going to a local club does not depend on whether they model finescale or not, it is whether you are lucky enough to find someone who will not only give you a warm welcome but welcome you into their clique. Granted if you either share the same interests of have a skill they require your fine but the large majority of club members seem to want to carry on undisturbed in their own world oblivious to anyone else 

 

Edit

 

This trait is a bit British/English and not just limited to model railway clubs, golf clubs are worse

Edited by hayfield
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It’s all relative of course , what people regard as perfectionists may be standard to others. I’m absolutely not a perfectionist , just out to get enjoyment from the hobby, but I must admit initially being disappointed at the inclusion of dinosaurs and flying saucers. This is not railway modelling as I know it , and I felt it actually belittled the hobby. It was as if railways weren’t interesting enough and had to have something to create interest.

 

This program has got to have been good for the hobby . I’m really glad it’s got a second series . I always thought it was harmless entertainment but it did take a while for it to grow on me. I thought the last two episodes were particularly good, perhaps returning more to the fundamentals of Model Railways .

 

Themes for the future. Well how about some internationals? Signalist suggests an American layout. How about America versus Switzerland versus Germany. Or as another theme , how about create a layout for beginners , maybe on an 8 X 4, to show how you can enter the hobby. I’m sure the teams could all create interesting layouts . Maybe a theme to construct a layout from second hand items, as I’m sure new entrants may hesitate With the cost of the hobby.

 

But overall a great series . Looking forward to the final. Well done all that saw the potential of this and entered .

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Best model of the beach at Weston-super-Mare I've ever seen.

 

We went on a family holiday to Weston-Super-Mare in 1972 (which was when I saw my only working Warship in BR days, 807 at Weston Milton, hence my User Name) and for some reason decided to walk out to the sea at low tide. If we hadn't turned back after half an hour we'd probably still be walking.....

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I think both of these statements are true.

 

The finescale folk may work to very high standards but I don't think any of them would consider him/herself a perfectionist and I have not read anything from any of them that denigrates someone who is content with lesser standards. And at any of the exhibitions where I have seen a "finescale" stand they have been very welcoming.

 

The "killer perfectionists" are the folk who like to think they are experts and convince themselves by finding fault with everything in sight - "we don't do it that way here"

 

...R

 

... and those who believe every RTR model should be to the exact prototype dimensions(*), incorporate every detail and be designed and constructed in such a way that the manufacturers can model every variant that existed during the history of the class, even if it means models are financially out of reach for a number of people.

 

(*) Obviously models should be *close* to prototype dimensions but personally I can live with a discrepancy of a scale 3 inches (or perhaps more) in wheelbase if it means the manufacturer can cut costs by using an existing chassis.

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Another slight issue is what constitutes a prebuild? Missenden got pulled up for rows of houses yet Fawley laid all the top board track which, in reality, was a lot more than 6 pieces. This is an anomaly that needs sorting out and clarifying for next time.

 

 

 

Or was it that Missenden's opponents objected and Fawley's didn't?

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The "killer perfectionists" are the folk who like to think they are experts and convince themselves by finding fault with everything in sight - "we don't do it that way here"

 

Usually because they don't actually make anything themselves.

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We went on a family holiday to Weston-Super-Mare in 1972 (which was when I saw my only working Warship in BR days, 807 at Weston Milton, hence my User Name) and for some reason decided to walk out to the sea at low tide. If we hadn't turned back after half an hour we'd probably still be walking.....

 

No , you'd only be up to your armpits in mud if you were lucky , or I'm sure you can work out the

worst case scenario , even all these years after your jaunt we still get people trying to do the same ,

they usually have to get rescued by the coastguards and hovercraft crews .

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